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[Mr Eos]

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[Pugs]

Originally posted by Mr Eos:

And anyone who wants to attack me down the... oh it's just muscle memory you have to get over.... Derp.

You know...you can give constructive feedback without getting so aggressive. Your post makes it look like you came here for a fight.

Not a good look.

[Thanxie]

You're real good at making walls of text that always turn in to a completely rage-filled rant. Always great to see coming from someone who hasn't even used the product.

[a man and his harem]

in all honesty my friend i think its more dumb to even have any form of controling type unit like what er have today for VR, we should have devices that fit are hands and able to make it feel far better in VR so u could in truth hold your weapon, or do normaly things with out a bulky controls. have real hands ingame that u could reach out and grab on ur own with out being clunky

[SquishNoob]

I like the touchpads... way better than thumb sticks IMO... they do take a bit of practice though... and they are backed up by gyro in the steam controller... and laser positioning in hte vr

[Clu]

I'm not a fan of the xbox controller, its to big and clunky

[Squishy]

While I disagree with the form, a D-PAD would have been nice indeed.

I do tend to agree that the thumbpad seems overly redundant, and I can not for the life of me, see a place where it would be better than a thumbstick.

I'm guessing they wanted to give people more choice or something :)

[SquishNoob]

Questions? I thought you were just angry ranting because your muscle memory precluded you from enjoying a new form of controlling and interacting with your games.

Anyways; for your first question: I dont have an opinion... dpad vs ab... maybe your are right, dpad would give us more options.

Second question answer: Trackpad coupled with gyro coupled with click/no click really does give me keyboard/mouse precision with my steam controller... so keyboard/mouse precision from my couch without a keyboard mouse... As a PC gamer AND a console gamer I KNOW that your little xbox controller is an inferior input device/scheme... you cant even come close to competing with keyboard mouse players with an xbox controller... but you CAN with a steam controller...

Well, if you are willing to put in a little muscle memory training.

[Squishy]

Originally posted by SquishNoob:

Second question answer: Trackpad coupled with gyro coupled with click/no click really does give me keyboard/mouse precision with my steam controller... so keyboard/mouse precision from my couch without a keyboard mouse... As a PC gamer AND a console gamer I KNOW that your little xbox controller is an inferior input device/scheme... you cant even come close to competing with keyboard mouse players with an xbox controller... but you CAN with a steam controller...

Well, if you are willing to put in a little muscle memory training.

I do not use controllers, well, except the Index' one, now. :)

I find the thumbstick a lot more precise than the thumbpad personally, but it is more than likely, a preference thing really. That's probably down to the many years playing arcade games as a teen, 20 years ago or so :). Old dog, new tricks... you know? :D

I am not sure who you were replying to however, so I replied, just in case it was to me... :)

[SquishNoob]

But the gyro IS part of the scheme... so getting rid of it for the sake of argument is nonsense. Dual thumbsticks cannot compete with mouse keyboard while dual touchpads with gyro can... hell, maybe adding gyro to any scheme is what makes the difference... I know It helps in Breath of the Wild.

fwiw I also use my steam controller to browse the internet from my couch... the two track pads are kinda seamless for that... much unlike the 360 controller... I also use the steam controller for racing games... I use gyro to steer and the trackpads control my players head... unless Im in VR... then my head controls the head.

[SquishNoob]

I actually used to use xpadder all the time there bud, I set it up to play X3: Reunion... it was very convenient.. I said in my previous post that it might be the gyro making all the difference in fps games... I even mentioned breath of the wild as an example... It's straight up silly to pretend that xpadder for desktop nav beats 2 trackpads though... sure with a ton of practice you might be ABLE to use a joystick to move around and click on icons... but track pads are better and that is why you DONT have that stupid little keyboard nub anymore ;)

[SquishNoob]

The reason one game scheme doesnt translate to every other game in vr is that vr is new and we dont yet know what scheme is gonna work best for each situation... speaking of, I love what they did with no mans sky vr controls... its super intuitive for me so far... you might be glad to know that they dont seem to have used the track pads much :D

[SquishNoob]

one thing I ABSOLUTELY LOVE the track pads for is fighting games! It takes a little practice if you set them to no click and then just regular direction stick on the left and buttons on the right, you can play without thumb blisters.

[EmptyMag]

A private profile, and a massive wall of text detailing his issues with a non issue. Nothing to see here, folks.

[Chefproll]

Mr Eos!

I like people living criticism instead of obediently swallowing each and every nonsense thrown at them.

So first for your questions ...

> Why do I need a second set of A/B instead of a d-pad?
I would separate the two elements making up that question.
1. Do we need a second set of A/B keys?
2. Wouldn't a D-Pad be the better choice?
Ad 1: Yes. The more keys the better.
Ad 2: Yes, a D-Pad would be the far better choice.
Manufacturers seem to hate D-Pads for reasons beyond my imagination. Take a look at Fujifilm: Touchscreen and D-Pad with earlier models of their excellent X series, a perfect combination. Now they trash the D-Pad, replace it with a thumbstick.
Idiots. A combination of both would be the holy grail.
-> Sometimes you need relative movements (thumbstick), sometimes you absolute movements (touchscreen), sometimes you need binary choices (D-Pad).
So the answer is an AND, never an OR.

You see? We agree and disagree concurrently.
Thumbstick AND touchpad AND D-Pad, that's the way to go.
Read on.

> Why do I need a touchpad at all?
Because different usage scenarios need different means.
Imagine a PC without a mouse, replaced with a thumbstick (like IBM did it with their Thinkpads - but as an addition to the touchpad). Perfect solution at the IBM side. But awkward without the touchpad.
Back to the mouse ...
You like egoshooters? Fine. Ever handled live firearms like shotguns?
You POINT and shoot. You move in an absolute way. There's your target, you point at it. You don't crank up the weapon in a linear way like you do it with console shooters. Far too slow.
Check it out yourself: Get some software for moving your mouse pointer with a joystick, or just connect a X52 Hotas; has a little nub for moving the mouse pointer.
Give it some time. Then give it some more time.
You'll end up being far slower and less precise than with using the mouse.
There's a reason why there's mice for PCs, not joysticks. No kidding.
The same reason why IBM provided thumbstick AND touchpad: Two different usage scenarios, one needing linear movement, one needing absolute movement.
Now don't become a pettifogger, claiming mouse pointer movements indeed are also linear.
You got the point but cannot take it.

If still not convinced: Disconnect the mouse from your PC, work with a joystick as a replacement for a week.
You'll be enlighted.

You may argue that PC and Index are two different pairs of shoes.
You may argue there's no real application for VR using a touchpad which cannot be handled with a thumbstick the same if not better way.
You're wrong.
There's applications making good use of the touchpad's unique properties. Like Virt-a-Mate. ;)
Try, you'll like it. If using a controller with a touchpad. While you'll hate it using a controller without.

That's for your questions. I am open to additions and queries.

And I'd like to add another question to the pool of excitement:

"Why the heck did we get a controller with a fixed battery?"

I dare to answer: Because Valve wants us to trash the controller and buy a new one if the battery dies. Which may happen quite fast if the battery overheats or gets charged often.
Would have been just no problem at all using an exchangeable battery like a 18650.
Like it would be no problem at all using exchangeable batteries with smartphones.
There's just lies like "needed for making it waterproof" or "design dictates".
Lies.
Only reason is: "Add weak point prone to fail soon, make the buyer pay again."
Like the glass backplate of smartphones. Not because it's pretty, not because it lets radio signal pass - just because it easily breaks and forces you to buy a replacement.

So I back your opinion about the D-Pad.
But I disagree with your touchpad attitude.
Flexibility needs different ways.

[SquishNoob]

Originally posted by Mr Eos:

I've done been enlightened on how to use windows with a thumbstick long before you came along. And it works just fine.

It may work just fine... but a trackpad works better ;)