Pylons vs. Effort vs. Impact

[Khorzho]

I absolutely love 1.4. Soooo much awesomeness added to Terraria.

But... we need to talk about Pylons and how they could be improved vastly. (TLDR at bottom)

In principle, Pylons are a cool idea. Having a new way to instantly hop around the biomes without your world being criss-crossed with wires is neat. And having a new use/purpose for NPCs is pretty cool too. Any time you can make villagers more a part of the game, it's good in my book.

That being said, there are some real stumbling-blocks to make them truly useful, and viable as a meta concept.

1. Forced diaspora - Since I bought Terraria all those years ago, and as more and more NPCs were added to the game, I cleared land in my worlds for unique NPC housing around my main base/castle. At first this housing is no more than rectangles, but as I progress through a world, I develop more and more elaborate housing with the idea that my NPC community is advancing with the changes around them.

If I were to pursue Pylons fully, I would have many abandoned structures, as not only do the NPCs now want to be in specific biomes, but they want to be near or away from certain other NPCs. I feel like all the hard work I put into making a camp turn into a village then into a town is negated by new NPC prejudices.

2. Pylon neediness - Despite the problem of breaking up your community of NPCs, there is also the little problem of making the Pylon itself work. Being able to place them wherever is useless in the face of the requirement of having 2 or more NPCs near it. This puts an outright restriction on NPC housing in the game, as you must always build dwellings in pairs. Considering there are 9 different pylons in the game, that means if you want to use all the Pylons, you will have only 7 NPCs to do what you want with as far as housing placement goes.

This is a real creative bane and very un-terrarian. There was only one NPC that needed special housing previously, The Truffle, and his little minor exception to free form housing was more of a flavorful quirk, than an outright strangulation of town design.


For me personally, after buying a couple pylons and seeing the restriction on their use, I threw my hands up and walked away from them.

My suggestions for fixing them are as follows:
1. Make NPC happiness less reliant on biomes. Some of the NPC biome preferences just seem kind of wonky. Why not let them be happy around NPCs they like more important than where they are?

2. Let Pylons work without NPC proximity. This will make them FAR more interesting to use and more useful.

TLDR: A fully equipped and enabled Pylon network limits creativity in NPC housing placement. A suggestion to change this, is to make them usable without NPC proximity, and NPC happiness not so biome dependent.

[Fumo Bnnuy n Frends]

İlk olarak ImHelping tarafından gönderildi:

Pylons are a good idea and the only problems with them are down to the fact NPC unhappiness only exists because "Annoyance=Depth(?)" passing itself off as "No, no, it's to encourage creativity!"

When you build a nice well furnished mansion, but NPCs refuse to sell you pylons until you shove them in a torch lit clay cube because proximity to other NPCs is what REALLY matters, it just makes everyone else trying to claim "You just want to be lazy and aren't creative!" look even more pathetic.

Teleporters are handy, but also just boring and annoying to set up. You're paying a busywork tax not just for setup, but for any revisions of your home and outpost locations.

But, teleporters are still a godsend if you want custom exact location transport during events that turn off pylons. So at least, they still have an effort=reward usage out of them.

to add as previously stated

if you spread npcs out too much theres a higher chance they can die / get killed. That and having npcs can reduce enemy spawning which is bad if you wanna farm in a specific biome and on smaller worlds (everyone thinks large world but what about small / medium worlds)?

You can dig under the soil before hitting underground lvl but then what type of house will that make for them?

[Fumo Bnnuy n Frends]

also wait

event turns OFF pylons? wtf?

[ImHelping]

İlk olarak Jostabeere tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak ImHelping tarafından gönderildi:

When you build a nice well furnished mansion, but NPCs refuse to sell you pylons until you shove them in a torch lit clay cube because proximity to other NPCs is what REALLY matters, it just makes everyone else trying to claim "You just want to be lazy and aren't creative!" look even more pathetic.

I do love when I live in a luxurious mansion that has no lights. I bet I can simply live off of stubbing my toes on all the luxurious furniture.

On that note, I removed the lighting from the bathrooms after a prime example of hypocrite NPC logic with my emergency fallback main base to guaranteed NPCs have a safe place to respawn with their own sofas and other luxuries.

"We all hate this place!"
"I made a spacious 3 bedroom plus personal bathroom zone that is 30+ tiles away from any other housing from the farthest edges of your walls"

"Nuh uuuuh! The guy who hates me moved into the bathroom! That means it's FOUR people! And everyone knows four people is overcrowded!"
"If you all hate that, why didn't they move into the empty bedroom next to an NPC they love 60 tiles away?"

"... No, no. This is your fault and you're the lazy one who just is too lazy to reassign rooms. We're not dumb AI, you're dumb AI!"
"I don't think you actually know how debates work, do you."

İlk olarak Smug aya tarafından gönderildi:

also wait

event turns OFF pylons? wtf?

Funny thing. I've never tried to use one during an event so I'm going off of "I heard other people being rudely surprised when they tried and it didn't work" and the wiki there with claims like ""The Pylon Network cannot be used during Boss battles or when invasions are announced or in progress.""

Sounds like you are in the same boat. but mostly you hear about it being a pain in the ♥♥♥♥ during the globe trotting carnage that is the lunar event. Which I've been too slow and distracted to do yet in spite of being long ready to beat the ♥♥♥♥ out of the golem like he owes me money.

Back to a note of "Pylon > teleportation items" the hell conch loves to warp me underneath obsidian seals over lava rather than anywhere sensible. So my revisiting hell faster than fall speeds is still much better served with the pylon set up right above it.

Hell conch ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ rules for making it much faster to zip down to hell and curbstomp the wall of flesh for "I need a different world in hardmode" reasons though.

[Fumo Bnnuy n Frends]

İlk olarak ImHelping tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Jostabeere tarafından gönderildi:

I do love when I live in a luxurious mansion that has no lights. I bet I can simply live off of stubbing my toes on all the luxurious furniture.

On that note, I removed the lighting from the bathrooms after a prime example of hypocrite NPC logic with my emergency fallback main base to guaranteed NPCs have a safe place to respawn with their own sofas and other luxuries.

"We all hate this place!"
"I made a spacious 3 bedroom plus personal bathroom zone that is 30+ tiles away from any other housing from the farthest edges of your walls"

"Nuh uuuuh! The guy who hates me moved into the bathroom! That means it's FOUR people! And everyone knows four people is overcrowded!"
"If you all hate that, why didn't they move into the empty bedroom next to an NPC they love 60 tiles away?"

"... No, no. This is your fault and you're the lazy one who just is too lazy to reassign rooms. We're not dumb AI, you're dumb AI!"
"I don't think you actually know how debates work, do you."

lol

i hate the random npc spawning. It just complicates the whole npc housing setup for the pylons even more (add some lunar pillar events in master mode and this happens frequently actually especially in the stardust and solar pillars.

also for hell i just setup my bed spawn point near the hellevator...erm hell well /hole whenever i'm gonna go back and forth farming for stuff like souls or fishing.

[Jostabeere]

İlk olarak ImHelping tarafından gönderildi:

"... No, no. This is your fault and you're the lazy one who just is too lazy to reassign rooms. We're not dumb AI, you're dumb AI!"

[ImHelping]

İlk olarak Jostabeere tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak ImHelping tarafından gönderildi:

"... No, no. This is your fault and you're the lazy one who just is too lazy to reassign rooms. We're not dumb AI, you're dumb AI!"

Oh, I'm so sorry to hear you moved into a bathroom thinking it was a house. I had no idea this was an actual thing that could happen in real life, but here we are.

[Jostabeere]

İlk olarak ImHelping tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Jostabeere tarafından gönderildi:

Oh, I'm so sorry to hear you moved into a bathroom thinking it was a house. I had no idea this was an actual thing that could happen in real life, but here we are.

You are expecting NPCs which only check two things to choose between what you think is a bathroom and what isn't? Don't give your bathrooms everything that makes it a living room. Complaining about it won't really solve your own issue.

[The_Technomancer]

+1 The pylons were a great idea that were needed to make spreading npc's out actually viable, but the happiness system that's attached to it just drags it down a whole bunch. Should've just tied them to boss progression like everything else.

[Kitsune Dzelda]

I like the Im Helping person. He understands bad AI. I too occasionally mistake bathrooms for bedrooms, and fall asleep in them. Most often while dead exhausted at 4am in the morning.

If youre in the neighborhood of suggestions, building a waterbed in the bathroom would be really groovy. I like sleeping and drowning at the same time.

I guess for Pylon talk, tbh I like them. They spread out the NPCs far as I know, but placed at multiple bases, they allow much more communication between the smaller areas. The pylons kinda tie the entire map into one big town.

Though it is nice to note that teleporters are still the go to when you run out of Pylons, need an ETS, (Emergency Teleportation System) or want to ♥♥♥♥ around with the Dungeon Guardian. I guess in that sense it does add a bit. Those who dislike the system can likely safely ignore pylons for older methods of transport.

[Soren]

İlk olarak Smug aya tarafından gönderildi:

Agree.

I am one of the few that actually saw how ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ they were when they came out. You have an easier time wiring and waiting for the teleporters sold by the mechanic and steampunker or skyrail.

Oh yeah, I too find it way easier to get the mechanic and the steampunker, farm and spend the couple of platinum I'll need on all the wire alone, run wire directly through tens of thousands of blocks and taking days or weeks in the process setting up a bunch of teleporter spots to be way easier than pylons.

What, days or weeks versus the hour tops it takes to set up a simple shed with 2 NPCs and immediately set down a pylon after they move in? I'll take the days or weeks of effort instead thank you very much! It's especially easier when you consider the fact that I need to initiate hardmode and beat a mechanic boss first! Because beating the mechanic bosses is way easier than not having to do anything and getting access to pylons right at the start of the game. If anything, having no boss restrictions and being able to buy pylons nearly at the start of the game is far too hard. Might as well ask me to beat the moonlord on master mode solo before I could ever do that.

[Fumo Bnnuy n Frends]

İlk olarak BK201Soren tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Smug aya tarafından gönderildi:

Agree.

I am one of the few that actually saw how ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ they were when they came out. You have an easier time wiring and waiting for the teleporters sold by the mechanic and steampunker or skyrail.

Oh yeah, I too find it way easier to get the mechanic and the steampunker, farm and spend the couple of platinum I'll need on all the wire alone, run wire directly through tens of thousands of blocks and taking days or weeks in the process setting up a bunch of teleporter spots to be way easier than pylons.

What, days or weeks versus the hour tops it takes to set up a simple shed with 2 NPCs and immediately set down a pylon after they move in? I'll take the days or weeks of effort instead thank you very much! It's especially easier when you consider the fact that I need to initiate hardmode and beat a mechanic boss first! Because beating the mechanic bosses is way easier than not having to do anything and getting access to pylons right at the start of the game. If anything, having no boss restrictions and being able to buy pylons nearly at the start of the game is far too hard. Might as well ask me to beat the moonlord on master mode solo before I could ever do that.

Okay skyrail then

Also you still gotta go to the area and cant spawn or teleport randomly vs teleporters and rail systems.

To add insult to injury good luck having your nocs not get killed by events like the lunar pillars or boss spawning especially in the jungle or hallow.

Have fun moving around npca again when they respawn in the wrong rooms

[Sebastian]

İlk olarak Smug aya tarafından gönderildi:

Also you still gotta go to the area and cant spawn or teleport randomly vs teleporters and rail systems.

you have to go to teleporters/rails too if you want to use them.
unless you mean placing them, which you have to do up close as well.
teleporters dont just spawn in the world fully wired up.

İlk olarak Smug aya tarafından gönderildi:

Have fun moving around npca again when they respawn in the wrong rooms

afaik that got fixed already.

[Soren]

İlk olarak Smug aya tarafından gönderildi:

Okay skyrail then

Also you still gotta go to the area and cant spawn or teleport randomly vs teleporters and rail systems.

To add insult to injury good luck having your nocs not get killed by events like the lunar pillars or boss spawning especially in the jungle or hallow.

Have fun moving around npcs again when they respawn in the wrong rooms

Are you playing on smaller worlds or something. Lunar pillars are more likely to kill your NPCs and skybridge/skyrails/teleporters are easier to build in smaller worlds sure, but I don't really think the trade offs are all that good either way. And even on smaller worlds, pylons are still better for long trips.Those pesky wyverns are more likely to harass you at lower heights and you get less resources and space on small world as well.

Now, if you want to build a skybridge on a large world along with a skyrail that will cost you approximately 8,500 wood and 1000 iron ores. Even if you pay those material costs and also make a hellavator or two(which takes much longer than setting up NPCs in basic houses and pylons), it still takes minutes to reach most destinations every single time you want to travel anywhere. You'll save minutes on each trip to the ocean, hell, the jungle, or an altar. You'll save hours of time when it comes to fishing quests especially. Personally, I set up both skybridges and pylons whenever I play, but the skybridge/rails are inferior and rarely ever used. They make great simple boss arenas and shooting star farms though.

Also, as Sebastion said, your NPC dying should go back to their assigned housing.

[Fumo Bnnuy n Frends]

İlk olarak RoboEmperor tarafından gönderildi:

This is how you make houses
1. 13x5 block house. Inside space is 10x3. You need platforms as doors at the top.
2. Put two of these houses together, then 25 blocks away put another 2 of these houses together.
3. Put 4 NPCs in them, each paired with their favorite neighbor.
4. Make two of these sets of 4 houses. At your spawn point put Nurse + Arms Dealer, then Mechanic + Goblin because 99.9999% of your money is gonna be spent on reforging gear.
At an artificial jungle (in the sky is ok) put Dryad + Witch Doctor, and 2 other NPCs of your choice.
5. Buy and place a Pylon for both of these sets of 4 houses.
6. Make twenty 13x5 block houses in one location and dump all the worthless useless NPCs you will never buy from in the game because they are worthless and forget they ever existed.

Pylons are absolutely worthless because you can't use them during a boss fight or event. So if you recall back home, you need to walk back to the event location.

lol

you'd think they'd think ahead during the lunar events. Sometimes people just kill the cultists by accident and forget to finish the events.

[Battleseed]

İlk olarak RoboEmperor tarafından gönderildi:

you need to walk back to the event location.

Who walks in this game? Mounts and wings are a thing~