商店页面
Farthest Frontier
全部 讨论 截图 艺术作品 实况直播 视频 创意工坊 新闻 指南 评测

Farthest Frontier

商店页面
查看统计:
全球成就
Farthest Frontier > 综合讨论 > 主题详情
此主题已被锁定
Jobbi 2022 年 6 月 10 日 上午 1:44
2
1
Grid Based ?
Stop making medieval city builder games with this bulls**t american grid layout! Have you ever been to europe? Do those developers even know how medieval settlements were founded?
最后由 Jobbi 编辑于; 2022 年 6 月 10 日 上午 1:44
此应用的一名开发者已标记一个回帖作为该主题的解答。
点击这里跳转至那一条帖子。
引用自 Zantai:
引用自 Hecleas：
Don't compare it to AOE.
Already the game is closer to Stronghold than AOE.

If you have to compare to a similar game; Foundation, Ostriv, Dawn of Man, Ancient Cities etc.

And as a source of inspiration there is Manor Lords, knowing that this game is developed by a single dev.
So if we take out the excuse of it's complicated, no it's just that people don't want it.

All that to say that the majority of the games mentioned do not have this grid system is the game horrible and complicated for the layout of the buildings? Absolutely not, so this argument is simply a false excuse.

Yes, it's accurate, we in fact do not want to do it. We even explained why in this thread. :)

Grid based layout was a design decision and it's not something we're going to do a 180 on at this stage of development.

引用自 Medierra：
引用自 Jobbi：
yeah, but Boston was not built up 1100 A.D. None medieval town has a grid based layout- Sure, it's eassier to play/plan, but does not fit into theme and time.

His point is that we live outside Boston and Boston is far from a grid layout, with the older parts of the city being as "off-grid" as most European cities in terms of lack of any kind of early building planning. Zantai is also from Europe so...

So it is not that we are unfamiliar with cities not built on a grid but rather that, this is a game and we have oriented our features more around what we believe are fun mechanics that fit the style of play we are trying to create, as opposed to aiming for the most realistic recreation of European city layout.

Some city builders aim much more for simulation and crafting realistic cities - our goal is to create a more engaging and strategically challenging gameplay experience.

We did try free placement at one point and it felt very finicky, placing a sort of burden on the player to invest more time in building placement simply because they could, which was not necessarily always that satisfying. Most importantly, without grids, we felt like the game was missing a tetris-like strategic component of city layout that was very appealing in some of the old classics of the genre.

We do have spline based roads though and the buildable terrain is not all flat, so even with buildings on a grid, towns do not typically end up being totally grid-like in appearance. Plus the models for many buildings is angled, so that they are not all aligned.

It is a gameplay preference, not a lack of attention to detail. Some will enjoy it, some won't but that's how it always is with game dev.
< >
正在显示第 16 - 30 条，共 85 条留言
Aegyssus 2022 年 7 月 7 日 下午 1:05 
引用自 Jobbi：
...
You are right !
I live in a small medieval city, Oudenaarde, Belgium.
Map of Oudenaarde, at the siege in AD 1453
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Oudenaarde#/media/File:Oudenaarde,_Belgium_;_Deventer_map.jpg

or
Gent, Belgium AD 1534
https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fi.pinimg.com%2Foriginals%2Fa9%2F22%2F8e%2Fa9228eb1beb5494762e0f58e6a1f9071.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pinterest.com%2Fpin%2F571816483933947333%2F&tbnid=7spUNsSWbdkSsM&vet=12ahUKEwjJxN2Lyef4AhW_h_0HHRXQC0EQMygHegUIARDOAQ..i&docid=HhlucY_0WvykYM&w=640&h=503&q=Gent%20medieval%20map&ved=2ahUKEwjJxN2Lyef4AhW_h_0HHRXQC0EQMygHegUIARDOAQ
-
Developers, Make more grids!
and a way that the player can use multiple geometrical grids at the same time to build/represent what a Medieval City, Castle really was.
#16
Paraleo 2022 年 7 月 9 日 上午 2:31 
fact is the town shown in the key art, the one you see in the background of the forums also is actually round so it is a misrepresentation of what you actually get.
#17
Thjof 2022 年 7 月 13 日 上午 10:08 
引用自 Modesty：
Grid layout ruins immersion for me personally
I feel the same way. I'm still following this game, but I might end up not buying it just because of the grid.
#18
< blank > 2022 年 7 月 16 日 上午 6:08 
They introduced grid to Settlers and it ruined it for me.
#19
ElBarto56 2022 年 7 月 18 日 下午 2:36 
引用自 krixpop：
引用自 Jobbi：
...
You are right !
I live in a small medieval city, Oudenaarde, Belgium.
Map of Oudenaarde, at the siege in AD 1453
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Oudenaarde#/media/File:Oudenaarde,_Belgium_;_Deventer_map.jpg

or
Gent, Belgium AD 1534
https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fi.pinimg.com%2Foriginals%2Fa9%2F22%2F8e%2Fa9228eb1beb5494762e0f58e6a1f9071.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pinterest.com%2Fpin%2F571816483933947333%2F&tbnid=7spUNsSWbdkSsM&vet=12ahUKEwjJxN2Lyef4AhW_h_0HHRXQC0EQMygHegUIARDOAQ..i&docid=HhlucY_0WvykYM&w=640&h=503&q=Gent%20medieval%20map&ved=2ahUKEwjJxN2Lyef4AhW_h_0HHRXQC0EQMygHegUIARDOAQ
-
Developers, Make more grids!
and a way that the player can use multiple geometrical grids at the same time to build/represent what a Medieval City, Castle really was.

oh so 2 examples make a rule now? grids are for beginners
#20
HellSlayer 2022 年 7 月 18 日 下午 2:49 
As long as devs dont make a game based around "optimisating the grid placement system" then its great, means I can relax and build my town how i want forgeting the small bonus I would gain if i did max optimisations. All in all - without playing its just a speculation if I would prefer grid or gridless game.
#21
Jobbi 2022 年 7 月 19 日 上午 9:11 
引用自 ElBarto56：
引用自 krixpop：
You are right !
I live in a small medieval city, Oudenaarde, Belgium.
Map of Oudenaarde, at the siege in AD 1453
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Oudenaarde#/media/File:Oudenaarde,_Belgium_;_Deventer_map.jpg

or
Gent, Belgium AD 1534
https://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=https%3A%2F%2Fi.pinimg.com%2Foriginals%2Fa9%2F22%2F8e%2Fa9228eb1beb5494762e0f58e6a1f9071.jpg&imgrefurl=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.pinterest.com%2Fpin%2F571816483933947333%2F&tbnid=7spUNsSWbdkSsM&vet=12ahUKEwjJxN2Lyef4AhW_h_0HHRXQC0EQMygHegUIARDOAQ..i&docid=HhlucY_0WvykYM&w=640&h=503&q=Gent%20medieval%20map&ved=2ahUKEwjJxN2Lyef4AhW_h_0HHRXQC0EQMygHegUIARDOAQ
-
Developers, Make more grids!
and a way that the player can use multiple geometrical grids at the same time to build/represent what a Medieval City, Castle really was.

oh so 2 examples make a rule now? grids are for beginners

none of these historical examples show a gridded city layout - am I blind?
#22
Drinjanin 2022 年 7 月 19 日 上午 11:30 
引用自 Jobbi：
引用自 ElBarto56：

oh so 2 examples make a rule now? grids are for beginners

none of these historical examples show a gridded city layout - am I blind?
He didn't understand the sarcasm.
#23
Jernej 2022 年 7 月 19 日 下午 3:58 
Well... what I see on youtube... a game has a grid, but roads are organic. Buildings are build in diferent angle, so you can make organic or European like town. I just hope walls can be build like roads are in the game.
#24
NutCracker 2022 年 7 月 19 日 下午 4:22 
Game looks realy good at the first glance but as a hardcore city builder gamer i can simply say with this type of wall placement and grid its big no no to me alredy. Life is feudal forest villige is amazing game and they did many things perfectly but abadoned their game . now we have foundation and manor lords unless you gonna pass them whats the catch ? instead of making this new game just buy the life is feudal forest village and upgrade it. sell the expension packs people will surely buy it.
#25
Chilled Sloth 2022 年 7 月 19 日 下午 9:50 
Foundation and Manor Lords are far more attractive to me because of the more free-form building styles.
In FF, you may be able to make a more angled, organic looking town - but it will be at the loss of a lot of efficiency, right? With buildings (and even parks?) requiring square blueprints and many buildings/parks affecting a radius around them, you're always pushed towards a neat, un-immersive grid town. Even Medieval planned cities didn't have such 1920s grids.

If you changed the attractiveness and other such influences from a radius around a building to a certain distance via the shortest path/road, this problem could be alleviated without abandoning the grid, I think.

Ideally, building blueprints should get superfluous corners cut (forming octagons or a mixture between a square and an octagon). That way, a grid following town layout isn't hindered in any way (and would look the same as now), but more organic shapes can form too, with build and roads in many different possible angles (though each in steps of 45 degrees-ish,depending on how uniformly the corners are cut). Maybe you can even keep a couple of trees in those potentially left-unbuild corners.

Would such changes still be possible, either before the full release or in a later patch?
#26
NutCracker 2022 年 7 月 20 日 下午 4:44 
Actualy the problem with understanding is not that in medival times people doesnt know how to use grid roads and systems. no it was the mother earth herself doesnt help them in the way. coz you must defend your city state and not everyone can terraform the world to make it pure flat grid city. thus they build their houses and used what they have at the moment they are building. natural water sources undigable rocks. cliffs high grounds hills etc. if you look at how a city build by itself it usualy try to find a way between odds of surrounding also thats why it cant be grid. because even from ancient greek people were pretty aware of grid based system and how to use it in colonies etc. but with the constant big scale wars cities tend to build on places that you can defend for very long time and those places are hill tops riverbanks and beach heads. But im pretty sure this game will be another banished resource management game instead of city builder.
#27
powbam 2022 年 7 月 20 日 下午 5:44 
引用自 NutCracker：
But im pretty sure this game will be another banished resource management game instead of city builder.

Or you could try reading the developers detailed description of what the game is on their Store page, or perhaps the Game Guide
https://www.farthestfrontier.com/guide/about/introduction/

..or even watch the numerous Let's Plays over on YT right now..
https://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=Farthest+Frontier

--

It already knows what it is and what its about.
#28
ಠ_ಠ 2022 年 7 月 20 日 下午 7:31 
引用自 Lord Admiral Mormont：
the future of building games is definetly free placement not grid.

Judging from the comments on YouTube city builder videos, I have to say you're wrong. The rage induced from free handing roads and structures is actually pretty funny.
#29
powbam 2022 年 7 月 20 日 下午 7:57 
引用自 ಠ_ಠ：
引用自 Lord Admiral Mormont：
the future of building games is definetly free placement not grid.

Judging from the comments on YouTube city builder videos, I have to say you're wrong. The rage induced from free handing roads and structures is actually pretty funny.

Sound like it would be fun to watch.. got any specific links to some good vids on the topic? I can always use a good laugh.
#30
< >
正在显示第 16 - 30 条，共 85 条留言
每页显示数： 1530 50

Farthest Frontier > 综合讨论 > 主题详情
发帖日期： 2022 年 6 月 10 日 上午 1:44
回复数： 85

讨论规则及指引