What I think About The Current Difficulty

[Samseng Yik]

Fans of Roguelike here. These are my opinions of the game difficulty comparing to other games. Games that I will bring up are :
- FTL
- Chrono Ark
- Goldian Quest
- Monster Train

"Player need to win every battles, enemy only need one".
"Player need to maintain the team and injuries, enemy don't need to".

FTL
If may seems weird to bring out a RTWP (Real Time With Pause) game. The AI fire their weapon randomly to player ship location. The game has a lot of RNG such as weapon loot, event outcome, hit vs evasion.
The key I want to compare here is the AI. You can judge the developer saying they made a dumb AI. But all the pro players know, if the enemies play like human, THE PLAYER IS DOOMED due to the golden Roguelike rules. Thus randomly fired AI is completely justified and this is still a god darn hard game.

Chrono Ark (CA)
Probably the closest sibling to TOF. Both feature party wide mana pool. And the whole party taking a same turn. CA don't have tactical movement however, less gearing slot, different leveling system and it own healing system.
Like FTL, CA also feature hit vs evasion, and most importantly enemy attack randomly.
The final boss of CA, notably cannot even kill a non tank within 2 turn even you just pass your turn. The "damage and HP ratio" is well balanced enough.
Lets not forget, you can heal up the wound in combat too.

Monster Train / Gordian Quest
Also cards game, what I really want bring out from these 2 games are the "enemy action preview".
In Monster Train, we knew already whats going to happen every turn. And the game can preview player whats will happen if we play this or that card.
In Gordian Quest, each enemies has their attack card and range which player can view. Player also can move away to avoid the attack.

Monster Train
The difficulty increase system in MT aka "Cataclysm" in TOF. Somewhat similar but MT is up to 25.
What biggest different is
MT in Cataclysm 0. Is very easy to beat as long as you understand the system and has sensible Tactical RPG mindset. Final boss HP is 1200 in 0, and 4000 at 25 on top of all other difficulty modifier.
Obviously, your tactics that work at 0 will not work at 25 due to all enemies deal more damage and more HP. 25 is the part where player need to sharpen their skill to pinnacle. A well planning and execution will be needed.
Also I finished MT Cataclysm 25 with almost every Faction + Support Faction + Both Heroes combinations. A proven example any boss can beaten by any combination.

Why I bring up this? Because the AI in TOF is very smart (spiteful). They think like a real human, they will gang up on the weakened hero just to kill 1. No matter how much they sacrifice, if they can down 1 hero, the long term damage to player run will be there.
If you turn up the game difficulty, all these enemies card also deal much greater damage on top of outnumbering player already.
- 1 lose to the enemies party are nothing, they are infinite anyway.
What enemies need to do ...... they slowly grind away the player party health.
Enemies also don't need to "Deckbuilding". Each enemies deck are already well planned.
- A party with multiple injuries, will need more herb to heal themselves, or fight the next encounter with handicap, which may lead into more injuries snowball or lose.
Normal difficulty in TOF Cataclysm 0 also is really hard to beat.
- The boss is dishing out surprisingly huge amount of damage in normal mode for experienced tactical gamers. Mix with the AI, a boss can blindside a tank defense and taking out the less protected hero. Glass Elemental is serious offender. Unless your tank "played correct power card and executed the plan flawless" then can sustain the defense.

Bottom line, sorry for the TLDR.
Normal difficulty is really hard in TOF. I did complete it all campaign in normal mode. But oh boy, the feeling of smooth campaign run only to decimated by final boss is really bad.
I hope developer consider fine tuning enemies cards and stats.
I hope I expressiing the message correctly.

[Gabbek]

I've read your message and I'm not sure how I feel about it.

My friend is consistently winning cata10 runs. I myself have done up to cata9 and I feel like the game is challenging, but once you know the mechanics well enough hard difficulty is pretty punishing, but I can't imagine losing on hard difficulty now (I'm specifically talking about hard difficulty, not cata difficulties).

I agree that ToF AI is pretty smart - but there was quite a lot of improvements done in EA which made it easier to cope with strong AI - namely being able to see the deck of each opponent creature/boss. Most of the groups in the game have dedicated damage dealers and supporting enemies which aren't as big of a threat.

Bosses in ToF are also really deadly - especially optional ones. Once you get comfortable you have an idea of what optional bosses you can beat and which will easily beat you. You can also skip them willingly and you will know which one you're about to face - so it's really a lot of adapting to the given situation, which for certain setups are easier, or harder.

Gaining wound is not as big of a deal as you make it out to be - especially since recovery mechanic has been introduced - all of your heroes get one wound cured once you defeat each main boss, which you can turn into a huge advantage if you play it out correctly - I usually reach first boss with 1-2 wounds just to clean them.

In theory some changes could be made for hard difficulty - enemies using weaker deck than the cata difficulty ones, but that sounds like a lot of work.

Perhaps ToF requires more game experience than other titles and after ~20-30ish hours it becomes easier once you understand much more how the game works?

[Khor]

Originally posted by Gabbek:

I've read your message and I'm not sure how I feel about it.
My friend is consistently winning cata10 runs. I myself have done up to cata9 and I feel like the game is challenging, but once you know the mechanics well enough hard difficulty is pretty punishing, but I can't imagine losing on hard difficulty now (I'm specifically talking about hard difficulty, not cata difficulties).

This

The "problem" with this game is that it requires a lot of decision-making.

The "power up" phase is pretty sandbox-y
"Equipment deckbuilding" is often a noob trap
and the Combat requires both "cards" and "tactical" insight

On top of that, Bosses plays quite differently from normal fights... and it can be very offputting.




Obviously, it`s not perfect and some tweeks might be in order (*cough*Charred Mistics*cough*) but, after few hours, even Cata10 feels balanced enough.

Something i`d personally like to see is the option to have enemy card draws revealed.
It would make "learning" the encounters much faster

I still remember my first fight with the Goddess
I was all like: she`s a Deity, right? Better charge her before she smites us with her Phenomenal Cosmic Powers... right?
Nope! she just bonks you really hard

[TheMasterBlaster]

I also felt like the difficulty was too much when I began ToF. BUT, after more than 150 hours played I have a much better grasp of gameplay. ToF is not something you can rush during encounters. Players must be incredibly methodical and attentive to be successful, in addition to learning the various Boss strengths/weaknesses.

Deckbuilding is not a simple part of this game. As a beginner, I used to just equip whatever gear had the best defense and 'powerful' cards. Seriously, how many Battle Stance cards does your party really need? Now I'm more selective and often 'hone' certain cards off my legendary items before equipping them. Sometimes I keep items in my inventory just so I can copy certain cards into my deck without ever actually equipping the item, especially if it's a low defense item or my item slots are already filled.

Knowing which cards to upgrade is another critical factor of deckbuilding. For example, imho, upgrading the starting 'willpower' bonus Power cards when making melee attacks, combo attacks, and casting spell attacks, is a HUGE deal especially when paired with 1 WP cost cards. Card upgrades which merely increase damage are ok in the early stages of a run, but card upgrades which totally bend the combat rules are much more valuable.

Some cards have surprising upgrade features, like Goad, for example. Normal it gives you a +1 attack bonus for each adjacent enemy. That's nice and all, but Goad+ makes you IMMUNE TO COMBO ATTACKS. The majority of my party wipes are not from bosses, but from getting combo ganked. Likewise, Stalk+ allows you to make combo attacks even when there's an adjacent enemy. Those are super powerful benefits.

Learning how certain effects impact gameplay is crucial! For example, combining Chilled and Weakness is a strong defensive duo, making regular mobs almost worthless, and significantly mitigating Boss damage. For offense, combining Inspired with Exposed makes a measly Swipe deal double its normal damage.

Character movement and placement are also things I've had to learn the hard way. You need to know when to charge and when to turtle at chokepoints. Movement cards like Run and Sprint (or any 3+ movement cards) are SOOOO good instead of chucking your valuable attack or power cards just for one or two more hexes of movement. Wind Stride and Fly are just great.

Stealth, for example, is ok for a damage bonus, but stacking stealth allows you so much FREE movement! The Assassin action card which gives your entire party Stealth is AWESOME if played early in combat, especially vs ranged attackers which like to hang back and shoot bows or sling non-aoe spells at you. Not only are they unable to strike from long range, but you get free movement to quickly close the gap and make your attacks.

Anyway, these are just some of the things I've learned which catapulted me from normal and hard difficulty into cataclysm difficulty.

[SpacePoon]

Originally posted by Khor:

Obviously, it`s not perfect and some tweeks might be in order (*cough*Charred Mistics*cough*)

Yeah, I'm pretty salty. My party had just beaten the Great Worm fairly handily, only a handful of stops before final boss of map. I then run into 3 charred mystics/skirmishers in a rando materials encounter, which melt my Warrior by turn 2 and thus my campaign.

It hurts