Worms and Carapaces?

[Impos!]

So, on some level, it seems like Worms and the Carapace Cross are different groups, Worms strange entities that arrived from Nowhere after emerging from the dead Sun-In-Splendor's body, and the Cross were many different individual groupings of beings that were THE Mortals before human beings.

Is there some sort of connection between them? I'm struggling to tell if they're ever one and the same in some ways, or separate all the time?

[ohioguyo]

I basically agree with your interpretation, that the Carapace Cross involves multiple extremely ancient vaguely insectoid Scale-aspected species or bloodlines that have largely passed from the world but on some deep level persist in humanity most notably through the Line of Antaios.
I think you're right that the Worms are a separate phenomenon that emerged from Nowhere; for me it feels like they're not necessarily related to the Carapace directly but that they do strongly oppose Eternity in favor of History, so in a sense their devouring embodies a return to an much earlier time (perhaps even enabling the Gods-From-Stone to reemerge), hence their connection with Scale.
Anyway, all this is to say the lore in this setting is overall abstract and inscrutable and hard to wrap your head around while still seeming to carry a strange sense of internal consistency. So many things will resist a clear detailed description while maintaining an undercurrent of strange mystery which I enjoy lol.

[Impos!]

Gotcha, so I was right- the connection between them is that they're both insect/wormlike and work against the current reign of hours who " are in charge of reality." They probably more accidentally assist one another, rather than on purpose, end goals aligning- though much of the Cross no longer exists.

When you define the distinction between Eternity and History- Eternity makes sense, it has to do with immortality, and the reigning hour's desperation to hold onto the power they control over reality without letting it change, shift hands or dissipate- thus their very jealous pickyness of who can become a Long/Name/Hour and how many can be them, and quite possibly having a sway on the impact the "Crime Of The Sky" has. (Crime In the Sky?) I'm not sure I believe that, THING that happens can't be attributed to someone not wanting there to be more Long around.

When you say History though, what does that necessarily mean? A Thousand new Secret Histories where in each one, different hours are the most powerful and rule them- perhaps some even being more ruled by humans? Do you mean everything having a lifespan and eventually dying, even gods thus dissolving the idea of immortal unending power and empires that can exist for eternity? Is it just about the current reign of the mostly "From Light" hours and who's in charge?

Man, does this game ever feel ripe for having extremely in depth conversations about.

[Maina]

Originally posted by Bee:

work against the current reign of hours who " are in charge of reality."

It is important to note that there are two things at play here. There are worms as the creature that infests and were born from the corpse of the Sun-in-Splendor and there is the faction that calls itself worms which works against the current order of things. Julien Coseley is a member of the latter.

You would be forgiven for thinking the former was just a metaphor for the latter, except that the critter-worms are present in both games as curses and objects of power, so they are definitely both distinct, existing phenomenon.

[Impos!]

Hmm, you're right- I've noticed that, but it uses "worms" interchangeably when talking about them.

I feel like, every time it's used the term "worms" before I always think of the little parasite creatures, and it's never crossed my mind that by saying "worm" they may be speaking about a person or people who are simply sympathetic to the creatures, they're existence and anarchy in general. As opposed to calling them a "worm sympathizer".

Several different individuals mentioned in books and locations in both Cultist Sim and Book Of Hours now arrive in person to request intel from the Hush House- is Julien Coseley someone who may appear?

I know I was pretty surprised to see Dr. Arun Peel, supposedly a mythical ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ Naga. Less surprised that he appeared looking like a human person, but no less disappointed for it.

[Maina]

JC does show up. I believe I got him during Numa. I kind of wanted to try to stab him after CS.

[Impos!]

Originally posted by Maina:

JC does show up. I believe I got him during Numa. I kind of wanted to try to stab him after CS.

Ppf oh, is he responsible for a hard time in Cultist Sim? I'm terrible recalling names to who the person is.

[Maina]

He is one of the Long that can show up to ruin your day in the Apostle Legacies. Being a Winter Long, he's also the only one you can't kill. And he leaves you a letter calling you an idiot. And unlike the other two Longs, the object he leaves softlocks the game if you use it. So that you can't win, only lose.

Really hate that guy.

[Impos!]

Originally posted by Maina:

He is one of the Long that can show up to ruin your day in the Apostle Legacies. Being a Winter Long, he's also the only one you can't kill. And he leaves you a letter calling you an idiot. And unlike the other two Longs, the object he leaves softlocks the game if you use it. So that you can't win, only lose.

Really hate that guy.

Oh my god, he's such a prick- I get it though. He wants to destroy Eternity- less immortal Name underlings of the Lantern Hours, Forge of Days and Grail, is probably good for him.

Sounds horrendously annoying in Cultist Sim thou- I've never done any of the "Hardmode" Forge/Lantern/Grail endings- mostly because by the time I've played a run and gotten to the end, I'm quite tired of the game, and don't want to continue into a whole new run from there. And you can only start one of those Apostle runs after winning a more basic one.

I'm not super interested in redoing a win I've already gotten once either- so I tend to turn those into the "Settling down with your lover" endings instead. Got to get more of those " We ascended together" ones thou.