unlimited summons is cheesy. probably should limit to 1 per hero.

[VladK02]

I noticed I can spawn unlimited bears.

I mean, I dont mind, spawn 10 bears, send them in, nuke morale of everything in range to zero, farm exp.

And if 10 bears not enough, send in 20 bears (mission the clansmeet is great, with multiple mana sources).

But its kinda cheesy, you know. Should be 1 summon at a time, and probably have a timer in it too.

Also, summons should not pillage, honestly. Way to exploit kinslayer debuff, by pillaging with temporary bears. I mean, thats fine, I got like 8 weapons from the clansmeet by pillaging everything with bears, but....also cheesy you know.

[BloodyPork]

Escrito originalmente por Narf:

Have Fun with this lost EXP and your low Troops in late Game :) And you lost EXP...

That doesn't matter because the AI troops adapt to your troop count and EXP.

[Senlin]

EXP is shared between all units that are within some range (from the killed unit). It's not all taken by the unit that makes the kill.

[VladK02]

all my troops are max level. the summons are not purely to kill everything. in my case, i use utility - storm elementals to take out key enemy casters - witch doctors - spiders to web skirmishers/fliers, bears to morale nuke strong points. Then my main units come in. usually my heroes take everything, not the summons.

[primetide_dev]

Thanks for the explanations. This will be something we will need to tackle.

[Malfias]

I like having multiple summons and it's not a game play nerf that I would apreciate. IMO this is easily offset by the low availability on a plenty of the maps of mana pools.

AND this is also offset by the high number of summons by transmuters...

[Stinkflipper Incarnate]

I also like summons a lot. Yeah, maybe they're a bit powerful, but if I ever lose any of my permanent units, I reload. I don't feel I have any other options. So being able to use summoned units to remove some of that pressure is a godsend. Limiting to 1 per hero would be terrible.

[Sanger Zonvolt]

6 wolfes, those are rookie nombers. Com back when you have 6 air elementals like I did in the cursed wood. Giving everyone speed and then running into enemy lines nuking them with the storm ability.

[prasejednomalo]

Escrito originalmente por primetide_dev:

Thanks for the explanations. This will be something we will need to tackle.

<3

[VladK02]

Escrito originalmente por primetide_dev:

Thanks for the explanations. This will be something we will need to tackle.

keep in mind though that if you do rebalance summon mechanics....you will need to adjust stats as well.

my humble opinion - currently in the summons

5-mana undead unit is worthless. should cost 2 or 3. nowhere near tanky enough to justify cost.

7-mana air elemental is probably not correct. it wants to be dps, its priced as dps, but it feels like a recon unit. cant be both. speed buff should be something built into the elemental itself, not grantable to other units, its a bit overpowered tbh. and AE....well, in packs of 3-4, the attack is devastating. if only 1 unit allowed....its okay. but to me, main utility of this thing is its mobility however. capturing stuff on water behind the lines, crossing rivers, recon, etc. it should be able to pillage as well, and have larger sight radius.

12-mana elemental is worthless, dies in 2 hits, only redeeming feature is his lightning bolt- and that only in packs of 3. its meant as a scary monster, but its really not. if you nerf summons, make storm elemental more evasive or more tanky. it shouldnt die to 2 ranged units.

bats/crows for 2 mana as a recon unit....just right. the only issue here is, there is no functionla difference between a crow and a bat. vampire fangs? not really effective in aerial combat of crow on bat. bats should be more tanky, more regen, but slower i guess. crows should have larger sight radius maybe but weaker in aerial combat. pet peeve - scout enemy wolf mother, she immidiattely charms your ravens. not cool :P

wolves for 3, spiders for 4.....spiders overpriced. main utility here is ambush capability, a cheap roadblock if you will. im not paying 4 if i can pay 3. and wolves have track, which makes them arguably better unit.

web spider for 7 is just right. actually extremely versatile unit, but it should NOT be able to web dragons in the air. thats just cheezy. Also, webbing bosses like the spider boss that guards the magic wand in lizard lands....makes the fight trivial. bosses should be immune of chance to break free.

pegasi for 6 - pegasi is worthless with a capital W. they die as fast as bats. never used, never will use again. if they could have dedicated anti-air role and drop a skirmish dragon in 1-2 hits - then we could talk. but they cant. easier to summon 3 bats.

owl bear for 9 - no different from regular bear for 7, both used as tanks and morale bombs, and only in quantities that count. If i can have only 1 bear - it should cost a lot less. and owlbear should be buffed to reflect its price of 9.

what other summons were there? so far for me thats about it...

[Zhein]

Summons should be balanced regarding other spells. Why would I cast a buff or a damage spell when I cast a meatbag that can tank for me, has abilities of it's own, and deals damage ?

Compare lightning strike and a bear. I can cast 2 strikes or invoke a Bear ? Bear any day : It will deal more damage, it will take a space in my line, it can debuff moral, and I don't even have to get close to invoke it !

I can invoke him early, meaning that my mage still has his action when we make contact.

And cherry on cake, the bear can rest to get full health for another engagement.

[Agent]

Well, if you only get 1 summon you would summon early and then you would cast buffs or damage spells because you've already cast your summon.

But yeah the summon costs should be tweaked since some summons are too expensive for what they are and some are too cheap.

[DaviddesJ]

I agree that the +2 mana item is super strong. But a fix for some of what's discussed here is to have mana pools stop generating mana after wealth reaches zero.