This is the complete antithesis of the original game.

[outcast]

I just want to say that I will be very critical in this post but by laying out all that I feel is wrong with this game I still hope it can be seen as "constructive criticism" as I truly wish for nothing more than to get a follow up to Outcast that is really true to the original instead of something that feels like a tired copy paste of other games.

Just finished the game and almost feel physically ill.
This is the complete reversion and Antithesis of everything that made the original Outcast so great.

You can't find a bigger fan of the original Outcast than me (just look at my username) and it is my most favorite game of all time. I have preached about it to everyone I know for the past 25 years since I played the original and it has followed me like a dead lover that can't be replaced by anything else as nothing compares to it. And while that game is still ahead of many games even today with features that still no other game has replicated this sequel rips all that out of it to instead take everything that is wrong with games today to cram that into one single package.

In the original Outcast you where dropped in an alien world that immersed you into it like no other and it felt magical, dynamic and like a REAL ADVENTURE with a sense of internal logic and explanation for every feature and game element where you had to find your way by talking to its inhabitants and learning about the world and its interesting lore. It truly felt like a real adventure where you where exploring a mysterious alien world.

In the sequel all that is gone and it is the most bland generic cookie cutter handholding game you can find with the same tired mmo style dull formula we have seen a thousand times before. Just disconnect your brain completely and follow that breadcrumb "magic arrow" to its next destination. The game could essentially play itself if you could just program it to follow the marker. You could skip every single conversation in the game and it would not matter as you don't need to actually learn or think in any way. Just be dragged by the hand with the "quest" plastered on the screen to "kill x amount of this enemy" or "pick x amount of that plant". Or do some stupid isolated nonsensical minigame that feels ripped out of a mobile game. Again while the original game felt real, logical and immersive this does everything to throw all that out the window and feels artifical and fake at every turn. Like everything is just a theme park version of Adelpha where you fly to the 25:th iteration of the same dull task that you have done innumerable times before doing some parkour race with glowing lights or fighting the same copy paste battle that you have done before. It is the most lazy copy paste "quests" and activities you can think off and if you have played any number of games you have done the exact same thing to death untold times before. Then you enter a city and go to the static signposts NPC with big "!" signs over their heads. Again it just reeks of fake and artificial with zero inclination of even trying to feel immersive. Compare these NPC:s and "AI" that behaves as signposts to the original which still 25 years later has features that not even new games have. You could ask NPC:s for the location of other NPC:s and they would tell you where they saw them last, or even point at them if they are close. They would not want to gossip about other NPC:s if that NPC actually was near them and if you talk to a Talan other Talans will often stop and eavesdrop etc. And converations could even be interrupted by enemies mid dialogue if they got to close. Everything was made to feel real, immersive, dynamic and authentic. This time it is the complete opposite and to call this even a "downgrade" in terms of these system would be an insult. It is like the game is constantly trying its best to drag you out of the illusion of its world and to remind you that you are just playing a game.

Speaking of the Talans they don't even look like the original design where they actually looked like aliens, now they look more like humans in rubber suits. Even the dialogue and voices often sounds really off and is filled with inconsistencies where they sometimes use words that does not fit at all to how they normally speak. Some use words like, "dude" and "cool" and even use some of the human expressions that normally they would take litterary and not understand like "busting my balls" or "taking a raincheck". It all feels very sloppy and not at all as involving, interesting or consistent like the original. Many times the dialogue like the rest of the game feels like it is full of pointless filler. And while the original also had a big dose of humour it felt fitting while here often the Talans come across as cartoonish and silly. Like something out of a kids show.

If there is anything positive I can say about the game it would be that the graphics and environment are actually quite beautiful. The environment is lush and has a great deal of verticality. I do think things look a bit too colorful and cartoonish and more like something out of the Avatar than the original Outcast that felt more gloomy, unique and mysterious, and some of the Talan buildings also look "off" to me somehow like they are not as throughout and consistent with the original style of the game, but it still looks nice to look at and if the rest of the game actually was faithful to the original I would be content with this new direction. Though the vast environment also makes me sad since it all just reminds you of all the wasted potential. I imagine how it would be like to actually explore this world if the gameplay and immersion was even anything close to the original. But there is zero purpose to even exploring the world as all you have to do is look out for the "markers" and all is just a fake purposeless backdrop to fill with dull copy paste filler content.

I have waited 25 years for this and it feels sad to think now that I wished this game was never made. It taints and corrupts everything that was so great and special about the original game. Replacing it with the complete opposite of what made that game so magical with the most tired generic Ubisoft style mmo gameplay there is. It is truly sad beyond belief.

I don't know if this was the nail in the coffin for Outcast. The original game recieved great reviews (about 90% on metacritic) and I know many people who played it still also put it at the top of their all time favorites, and the only reason it did not get better reviews was because of some issues with bugs and possibly also the voxel graphics (which I absolutely love). Unfortunately it did not sell well enough but it had nothing to do with the quality of the game which was stellar and probably more a mix of bad luck and perhaps lack of marketing (the trailer made it look like a stupid action game, instead of the great adventure game that it was with a deep world and interesting lore to explore.) I don't know how this game will sell and it seems many mistakes where made again with the marketing (really bad idea to release it on the Steam Spring Sale for example) and it will not get near the same appraisal as it has nothing original or groundbreaking in it. I think Appeal really could have resurrected the franchise with this game if they had only stuck to what made the original game so special. If there ever was a third one I don't know if there is any chance that they could go back to that and make it justice and make something truly special. I don't even know if the people who made that game the genius it was are still on the team anymore as I only recognized a couple of names from the credits and judging by this game they don't seem to understand what actually made the original so special. Or they where afraid and tried to "play it safe" by doing a copy of other games. I had no hope that there would actually even be a sequel to the original Outcast so perhaps there can still be a miracle. I can wish for it, but by judging by the complete wrong direction of this game it feels really dark.

As I wrote at the top this game truly feels like the complete antithesis of the original. The original felt authentic, mysterious immersive and dynamic and this just feels like the complete opposite of being fake, gamey and artificial.

[Engels78]

Originally posted by Johnathon Fortnite:

Originally posted by Dude:

So where are those masses?




So how did Elden Ring sell? Where is the "majority" of gamers? certainly not playing outcast 2

Elden ring was a hugely hyped game and just because one game was the perfect example of open world done right doesn't mean my point doesn't stand. When you take a look at the average triple a game most of them tend to be pretty casual.

The masses are currently playing cod or the new fifa etc. Franchises like Outcast are niche and have small communities for a reason. Hell the peak for the original game was a total 130 (half a year after release) in comparison to the new game having a peak of a little over 1k.

The average gamer just wants to have a nice fun time while the more niche community want complex games. (elden ring, baldurs gate 3 etc) It's better to pander towards the bigger number because it offers more potential profit than the whole 130 people on steam who had been playing the original game 6 months after release.

The main reason bg3 and elden ring got such an insane amount of numbers is because of the hype surrounding it and the companies behind them.

and congrats you enjoy the original game more, I for one find the new dragons dogma very boring

edit : apparently there was another remake called second contact, that also had a very low peak of 247 players

Yeah I am playing games for 38 years, and I like to have quest marks on the map! I want to have joy not to be lost what to do 😛

However! I love Souls Like too! And have Elden Ring made on Platinum!!! 😈 BUT!!! I've spent tons of hours out of game watching and reading guides and wiki... Same with Dark Souls 3... So instead of marks in game, I had them out of game! And I want challenge in beating enemies, NOT IN FINDING WHAT TO DO NEXT?!? Elden Ring having map, was BEST QUALITY of LIFE feature!

[chakkman]

To be fair, you also had important NPCs marked on your minimap in the original game.

I think the main point is, though, that games in the past made you figure them out. Not hold your hand, and explain everything to you in the first 5 minutes of the game. That's the main criticism I have with games these days, apart from also always bringing some kind of political and sociological note into the games, which always leaves a foul taste in my mouth, and makes me wonder why game developers abuse entertainment to get their political messages out. I hope that there's none of the crap in Outcast New Beginning... I fear that there is though. You basically get pumped full of (left-wing) politics on every corner these days.

[legaiaflame]

There is no political messaging in this game, thank God. It's just telling a story, like every game should. Yes, if you want to stretch that and say the women in the world are separated from the men and are sort of ruling in Kazaar. Well, that's just part of the story and culture of the world.

[chakkman]

Thanks. 👍 Sounds fine to me.

[Vaporwave Spirit]

I think the underlying issue here is not the game thats the problem. The real problem is that you are seeing through the lens of a nostalgia filter, making you believe that a game from the past was better than it actually is. I didnt even know outcast even existed before this game got released. I played this game first and I had an absolute blast with it. The gameplay was fun and the lore and cultural aesthetics of the world in the game are amazing, the level of lore detail kinda reminds me of the Navi from the movie Avatar and how their world was built by the people that made that movie. I can tell alot of love went into this game and i enjoyed it. I think your just overthinking things because no 2 games in a series are going to be the exact same (unless they are, which would make them suck). Its 2024, a long way from 1999, the technology is more advanced, game-making basics have changed, and as a result, we got this beautiful game. Ive tried playing Outcast: second contact but i couldnt really find myself getting into it, probably because i just started. I feel like this forum post would of done better as a game review instead of a discussions post because all its accomplishing is getting people to argue with eachother in this thread

[Dude]

for me ia just player outcast 1.1 completly so no nostalgia filter DirectX comparison. apart from graphics outcast 1.1 is much more involving the humor is less cringeworthy. I would say it wins everywhere except graphics (of course)

[Armilus]

Outcast Second Contact is pretty much original outcast with pretty graphics. Sure, not 2020s graphics, but still pretty graphics. Gameplay, mapdesign, story, quests, all near perfect copy. I even believe they copied the original sound files over for the dialogues.
I only learned the franchise existed because of the release of this game as well, so no nostalgia goggles for me either. I played through Second Contact and had a great time.

[chakkman]

Originally posted by Armilus:

I only learned the franchise existed because of the release of this game as well, so no nostalgia goggles for me either.

I remembered it from back in the days, when a friend used to play it after release. I then bought Outcast 1.1 and Second Contact a while back, remembered them when A New Beginning was released, started to play 1.1, and remembered the ♥♥♥♥♥♥ voxel graphics (never was a fan of that...), and rather started Second Contact after that, and I really like it.

I bought A New Beginning yesterday, and will play it after I finished Second Contact. I surely don't expect more of the same, after all I read, but, you have to be content with half decent games these days... They make them for a target audience which is... pretty simple-minded, to say the least.

[chakkman]

Well, I played about half an hour yesterday, and compared to Second Contact, it's utterly disappointing. Just like the OP said, close to no resemblance of the original. It's a modern game, which plays like a movie, and holds the player's hand the whole time.

Now, knowing that the start of modern games usually sucks big time, I'll give it another shot once I'm done with Second Contact, but, really, I don't expect much. I expect it to be a modern game, with all the negative things I consider about them: Totally dumbed down gameplay, loads of cut scenes, which rip you out of the game, and unlikeable and weird acting characters.

Could actually kick myself that I didn't see the signs again, because, they literally scream at you. Another 50 € wasted, and I even made the mistake to buy at a retailer, so I can't even refund the game. And, I basically told the developers that the game is cool by buying it.

[legaiaflame]

I don't know what people are expecting. Aside from the quest markers and quest interface, the actual game still has all of the charm, atmosphere, great music and unique characters that the first game has. The cutscenes only serve to further the mystery of the story and what's happening to Cutter and the world.

Considering all of these so-called negatives people keep throwing around back and forth, compared to other games, this game is still unique in its atmosphere, world and characters. There are very few games that have this level of adventure and charm.

[chakkman]

You know, I think it's perfectly fine that opinions differ. 🙂

That said, admittedly, I may have judged the game too early. As I said, the start of modern games is pretty bad usually anyway, as they need to pick up the kids who smash the gamepad to the wall when they don't get impressed in the first 5 minutes. Need to play some more to get a better verdict.

[Armilus]

You're right. We're judging the game for being a product of it's time. What are we expecting? That it'll bring back better times? Of which the original was a part, sure, but anything but a major one. So, not really a reasonable thing to expect.
It sometimes feels like the only thing that has improved in Gaming over the years are the graphics, while other areas have stagnated, and some, like storytelling and design philosophy, got worse. Especially recently.

We can't really blame the devs for following industry standards, when they have to please investors and executives with their jobs at stake, and those don't know what "Outcast" is, other than the name of the thing they're pushing.
(And those in turn have things like DEI standards and ESG scores to look at, which are requirements to even be eligible for certain awards, and gets them boatloads of money if they follow them. It's rare for studios and publishers to say no to those things, simply for positive user feedback that's by no means guaranteed either way. We need to really support it, when a product is actually made with love, even if they are forced to get some of that stuff into some part of the game, or they loose their jobs.)

[legaiaflame]

Originally posted by Armilus:

You're right. We're judging the game for being a product of it's time. What are we expecting? That it'll bring back better times? Of which the original was a part, sure, but anything but a major one. So, not really a reasonable thing to expect.
It sometimes feels like the only thing that has improved in Gaming over the years are the graphics, while other areas have stagnated, and some, like storytelling and design philosophy, got worse. Especially recently.

We can't really blame the devs for following industry standards, when they have to please investors and executives with their jobs at stake, and those don't know what "Outcast" is, other than the name of the thing they're pushing.
(And those in turn have things like DEI standards and ESG scores to look at, which are requirements to even be eligible for certain awards, and gets them boatloads of money if they follow them. It's rare for studios and publishers to say no to those things, simply for positive user feedback that's by no means guaranteed either way. We need to really support it, when a product is actually made with love, even if they are forced to get some of that stuff into some part of the game, or they loose their jobs.)

Well, despite modern game mechanics like the map markers and some open world tropes, imo this game was still made with love and care. And there are no forced DEI/Woke standards in this game either. Thank God!

[chakkman]

Originally posted by Armilus:

We can't really blame the devs for following industry standards, when they have to please investors and executives with their jobs at stake

That's why I tend to Indie games these days. They don't have these restrictions.

They have other issues, of course. Like the obvious lack of manpower, and financial backing.

[Armilus]

Originally posted by legaiaflame:

And there are no forced DEI/Woke standards in this game either. Thank God!

I do hope you are right about this one.
I did see some NPC dialogue and cutscenes on YouTube that do leave a foul taste of that. If those are rare an in-universe enough that they can be seen as one-off jokes or single NPCs that have a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ personality (which is good for variety), or story writing that looked good on paper, but turned out to not work as well as intended, but was too late to redo stuff, It's alright.
As you said, Talans being gender segregated is just how the world works. The women ruling over the planet does make sense, when you think about it, as a consequence of the segregation, since they control the reproduction via Okostok.

But when an NPC in Kizaar constantly utters lines such as "What kind of backwater planet are you from? Women don't have time to look after children. We're too busy running the planet." it leaves a foul taste. But as far as I could tell, it's just that one NPC, and one or two lines from one or two other NPCs. And the cutscenes I mean, are pretty much at the end, if I understood this correctly. If that's all there is, that's less than several modern games have that I actually enjoy.
Camillas Existence not making sense, given how Cutter and Marion talk to each other and treat each other during Outcast 1 (and Second Contact), that's a continuity error, and has nothing to do with woke.

I will buy the game at some point, for sure. I still need to decide if I pay full price or wait for a sale. Then I'll see for myself for sure.