This is the complete antithesis of the original game.

[outcast]

I just want to say that I will be very critical in this post but by laying out all that I feel is wrong with this game I still hope it can be seen as "constructive criticism" as I truly wish for nothing more than to get a follow up to Outcast that is really true to the original instead of something that feels like a tired copy paste of other games.

Just finished the game and almost feel physically ill.
This is the complete reversion and Antithesis of everything that made the original Outcast so great.

You can't find a bigger fan of the original Outcast than me (just look at my username) and it is my most favorite game of all time. I have preached about it to everyone I know for the past 25 years since I played the original and it has followed me like a dead lover that can't be replaced by anything else as nothing compares to it. And while that game is still ahead of many games even today with features that still no other game has replicated this sequel rips all that out of it to instead take everything that is wrong with games today to cram that into one single package.

In the original Outcast you where dropped in an alien world that immersed you into it like no other and it felt magical, dynamic and like a REAL ADVENTURE with a sense of internal logic and explanation for every feature and game element where you had to find your way by talking to its inhabitants and learning about the world and its interesting lore. It truly felt like a real adventure where you where exploring a mysterious alien world.

In the sequel all that is gone and it is the most bland generic cookie cutter handholding game you can find with the same tired mmo style dull formula we have seen a thousand times before. Just disconnect your brain completely and follow that breadcrumb "magic arrow" to its next destination. The game could essentially play itself if you could just program it to follow the marker. You could skip every single conversation in the game and it would not matter as you don't need to actually learn or think in any way. Just be dragged by the hand with the "quest" plastered on the screen to "kill x amount of this enemy" or "pick x amount of that plant". Or do some stupid isolated nonsensical minigame that feels ripped out of a mobile game. Again while the original game felt real, logical and immersive this does everything to throw all that out the window and feels artifical and fake at every turn. Like everything is just a theme park version of Adelpha where you fly to the 25:th iteration of the same dull task that you have done innumerable times before doing some parkour race with glowing lights or fighting the same copy paste battle that you have done before. It is the most lazy copy paste "quests" and activities you can think off and if you have played any number of games you have done the exact same thing to death untold times before. Then you enter a city and go to the static signposts NPC with big "!" signs over their heads. Again it just reeks of fake and artificial with zero inclination of even trying to feel immersive. Compare these NPC:s and "AI" that behaves as signposts to the original which still 25 years later has features that not even new games have. You could ask NPC:s for the location of other NPC:s and they would tell you where they saw them last, or even point at them if they are close. They would not want to gossip about other NPC:s if that NPC actually was near them and if you talk to a Talan other Talans will often stop and eavesdrop etc. And converations could even be interrupted by enemies mid dialogue if they got to close. Everything was made to feel real, immersive, dynamic and authentic. This time it is the complete opposite and to call this even a "downgrade" in terms of these system would be an insult. It is like the game is constantly trying its best to drag you out of the illusion of its world and to remind you that you are just playing a game.

Speaking of the Talans they don't even look like the original design where they actually looked like aliens, now they look more like humans in rubber suits. Even the dialogue and voices often sounds really off and is filled with inconsistencies where they sometimes use words that does not fit at all to how they normally speak. Some use words like, "dude" and "cool" and even use some of the human expressions that normally they would take litterary and not understand like "busting my balls" or "taking a raincheck". It all feels very sloppy and not at all as involving, interesting or consistent like the original. Many times the dialogue like the rest of the game feels like it is full of pointless filler. And while the original also had a big dose of humour it felt fitting while here often the Talans come across as cartoonish and silly. Like something out of a kids show.

If there is anything positive I can say about the game it would be that the graphics and environment are actually quite beautiful. The environment is lush and has a great deal of verticality. I do think things look a bit too colorful and cartoonish and more like something out of the Avatar than the original Outcast that felt more gloomy, unique and mysterious, and some of the Talan buildings also look "off" to me somehow like they are not as throughout and consistent with the original style of the game, but it still looks nice to look at and if the rest of the game actually was faithful to the original I would be content with this new direction. Though the vast environment also makes me sad since it all just reminds you of all the wasted potential. I imagine how it would be like to actually explore this world if the gameplay and immersion was even anything close to the original. But there is zero purpose to even exploring the world as all you have to do is look out for the "markers" and all is just a fake purposeless backdrop to fill with dull copy paste filler content.

I have waited 25 years for this and it feels sad to think now that I wished this game was never made. It taints and corrupts everything that was so great and special about the original game. Replacing it with the complete opposite of what made that game so magical with the most tired generic Ubisoft style mmo gameplay there is. It is truly sad beyond belief.

I don't know if this was the nail in the coffin for Outcast. The original game recieved great reviews (about 90% on metacritic) and I know many people who played it still also put it at the top of their all time favorites, and the only reason it did not get better reviews was because of some issues with bugs and possibly also the voxel graphics (which I absolutely love). Unfortunately it did not sell well enough but it had nothing to do with the quality of the game which was stellar and probably more a mix of bad luck and perhaps lack of marketing (the trailer made it look like a stupid action game, instead of the great adventure game that it was with a deep world and interesting lore to explore.) I don't know how this game will sell and it seems many mistakes where made again with the marketing (really bad idea to release it on the Steam Spring Sale for example) and it will not get near the same appraisal as it has nothing original or groundbreaking in it. I think Appeal really could have resurrected the franchise with this game if they had only stuck to what made the original game so special. If there ever was a third one I don't know if there is any chance that they could go back to that and make it justice and make something truly special. I don't even know if the people who made that game the genius it was are still on the team anymore as I only recognized a couple of names from the credits and judging by this game they don't seem to understand what actually made the original so special. Or they where afraid and tried to "play it safe" by doing a copy of other games. I had no hope that there would actually even be a sequel to the original Outcast so perhaps there can still be a miracle. I can wish for it, but by judging by the complete wrong direction of this game it feels really dark.

As I wrote at the top this game truly feels like the complete antithesis of the original. The original felt authentic, mysterious immersive and dynamic and this just feels like the complete opposite of being fake, gamey and artificial.

[Dasparado]

Well said

[Righard]

Our love for the original Outcast might be on-par with each other. When I finished it at 13 years old it made a lasting impression upon my soul. I honestly think I would be a different person without it with different tastes and ideas. 25 years later and the original box is still the center piece on my book shelve.

I am much more positive about this game but can understand your dissapointedment fully. First to get my huge disappointment out of the way.

The original from a gameplay perspective was very innovative, daring and special for these reasons:

1. You did not become stronger but made your enemy weaker.
2. Saving the game required an item, the 'gamesav' using it took time and made sound, attracting the enemy. This is genius.
3. No objective markers but getting directions and clues, asking NPC's for directions along the way. I haven't seen that in any other game as of yet.
4. The sneaking, in a way clunky, yes, but it was nerve wrecking and rewarding. Exploring places you should be, getting deeper and deeper, discovering more and more. One of my favorite memories in video games.
5. The simulated lives of the NPC's, extremely innovative around that time, didn't see it back in such a degree in other games even now.

None of these things made it to the sequel. Playing it and getting disappointed for each and every one of these points made me want to cry somewhere in a corner.

But! While I continued playing, the conversations and detail of the world slowly lift my spirit. I made sure to do a couple of things. Never track the missions. I don't want to see any waypoints. Need to figure out directions myself. Sure, I would sometimes check the rough location on the map but not just glue my brain to a marker.
Walk as much as I can, not jetpack from one NPC to the next. Taking my time to get the atmosphere in. I believe the atmosphere is still there. Not sure how to recreate the original magic now I am so much older and my brain has lost the childish wonder. (I believed that if I found a way to pass the inivisible walls in the original I would find a new world that nobody saw before yet.). Also, I try not to use fast travel too much.

I can say, I am actually enjoying it. I have a fondness for the characters. The cheesy humor, I admit that I like it. I find the world believable.

It is clear they wanted it to appeal to a broader audience. All the gameplay elements that made the original special where too risky for that. It got replaced by something less. But for me the soul, or essence, of Outcast remain.

I am greatfull that after so many years of the developers had the courage and perseverance to come with a sequel. I am enjoying exploring Adelpha again.

Thank you devs.

[legaiaflame]

@Outcast, I completely disagree with you and I'm a major fan of this series as well. So, while the original game while amazing and a milestone for its time; it is completely outdated now in terms of quality-of-life features and gameplay. The combat was incredibly boring and dull and you fought the same enemies over and over again. Yes, you had to use your brain and the game didn't hold your hand, but that also made things even more aggravating, especially when you would be lost, not knowing where to go or do next.

Outcast: A new beginning is an evolution of the series in every way that matters. We have a fully tracked map, and every quest is organized so there is absolutely no confusion. The enemy variety is much better than the first game as well: Creatures, robots etc. Yes, the enemy bases can get repetitive but there is always some aspect of repetition in an open world game. I remember just fighting the same Talons over and over again at the enemy camps in the first game and it got boring real fast.

The gameplay is also miles better than the first game. Better gun combat, better upgrades to unlock, the amazing jetpack boosting, gliding and hovering. It can't hold a candle to the first game. Again, not saying the first game is bad just outdated.

The original was good. but these things needed to be improved upon. Every open world game has these quality-of-life necessities. The game would be worse without them. Concerning the Alien's faces in the old game, everything was voxel art and pixelated, so you could only have so much detail. I think the evolution of the Telon's faces is a good choice. They still have elongated heads and are even more expressive now.

I'm just glad this ISN"T so much a copy and paste of every other open world game. There are no generic open world towers you have to climb, that show the locations of everything. It's why FF7 Rebirth feels so generic and artificial because you do the same activities over and over again. This game feels more organic. Sure, you go on similar quests to get materials and items but it feels more integrated into the world and natural to what's going on in the story. And without the open world staple of towers, you can actually explore and find things on your own.

This game feels just as much like an adventure as the first game did. Even more so, as the world of Adelpha is finally fully realized in such a way that wasn't possible in 1999. Although Second Contact did an okay job as well.

[outcast]

Początkowo opublikowane przez legaiaflame:

@Outcast, I completely disagree with you. The original game while amazing and a milestone for its time is completely outdated now in terms of quality-of-life features and gameplay. The combat was incredibly boring and dull and you fought the same enemies over and over again. Yes, you had to use your brain and the game didn't hold your hand, but that also made things even more aggravating, especially when you would be lost, not knowing where to go or do next.

Outcast: A new beginning is an evolution of the series in every way that matters. We have a fully tracked map, and every quest is organized so there is absolutely no confusion. The enemy variety is much better than the first game as well: Creatures, robots etc. Yes, the enemy bases can get repetitive but there is always some aspect of repetition in an open world game. I remember just fighting the same Talons over and over again at the enemy camps in the first game and it got boring real fast.

The gameplay is also miles better than the first game. Better gun combat, better upgrades to unlock, the amazing jetpack boosting, gliding and hovering. It can't hold a candle to the first game. Again, not saying the first game is bad just outdated.

The original was good. but these things needed to be improved upon. Every open world game has these quality-of-life necessities. The game would be worse without them. Concerning the Alien's faces in the old game, everything was voxel art and pixelated, so you could only have so much detail. I think the evolution of the Telon's faces is a good choice. They still have elongated heads and are even more expressive now.

I'm just glad this ISN"T so much a copy and paste of every other open world game. There are no generic open world towers you have to climb, that show the locations of everything. It's why FF7 Rebirth feels so generic and artificial because you do the same activities over and over again. This game feels more organic. Sure, you go on similar quests to get materials and items but it feels more integrated into the world and natural to what's going on in the story. And without the open world staple of towers, you can actually explore and find things on your own.

This game feels just as much like an adventure as the first game did. Even more so, as the world of Adelpha is finally fully realized in such a way that wasn't possible in 1999. Although Second Contact did an okay job as well.

I don't know how many other open world games you have played but there is zero originality in this game if you have played numerous other open world games (honestly much of the mission structure in this game is even worse than the usual generic open world game and more akin to an mmo). It is the same tired filler quests and copy paste things dotted on a map. There is nothing that is an "evolution". I have seen this exact same cookie cutter formula in more games than I can count. The original Outcast was unique in what it did, even now 25 years later it is still unique and groundbreaking in many things it did and I know many people who still hold it as their all time favorite to this day. There is nothing unique here to be found or to be remembered by 25 years from now. It is just another generic game you have seen before in another costume to add to the pile. Also I don't understand players who actually can even be involved or invested in something where you can't get lost for a second but just be dragged around like a child with a magic marker guiding your every step. Zero thinking involved and the game basically plays itself.

I agree that the actual combat and movement is more fluid than the original, but that is the only thing.

[Andy79rus]

It feels like Devs team just woke up from a lethargic sleep and haven’t seen any true action-adventure games with an open world since the first Outcast.
This game is build like "copy-and-paste" and nothing more - 30 Outposts to clear, 43 Gork Eruption to clear, 20 Shrines to fly-and-jump, 50(oh-my-god) Orym trials to jump.
This game is not more organic, it is the apotheosis of the players' hopes dashed.
I'm not arguing - there are a good ideas and moments in this game. It just feels like at some point they significantly got tired of making variety.

[Freddyk]

I understand what you feel, immersion is really harmed by all those said "quality of life" features.
But the world is so huge that it would be quite difficult to remove markers. That was possible in old games because they were much smaller and less cluttered. I still also wish they tried, but that would have required tons of work to make you find what you need naturally through hints, dialogs, landmarks...
Generic content like orym and gork are clearly bad, I dislike them.
Otherwise, the game is wonderful ! Jetpack is great and consistent with the world design, quests are well designed and very close to the spirit of the first game.

[flippy232]

The game has lost half its peak player base in the last three days. Its review score is lower than Outcast 1.1. There will be a couple of die-hard fans but nothing like the original. I was thinking it would go on sale within the first three months but now it will likely be much sooner. The peak player base will be below 100 by the end of next week at the current rate.

Sadly I think this is the death knell of the franchise. Swing and a miss. What a waste. This is what happens when you sacrifice originality and creativity to making a cool looking game trailer.

[legaiaflame]

still, If I had to choose, I would rather play this game over the original, even Second Contact. The original game was repetitive as well. Even more so. Just because you have to find everything yourself doesn't mean it didn't get boring. With how big the world is, this game would be horrible if you got a quest to talk to person A, go to point D, and travel to point Z, without any quest markers.

Plus, not every quest is copy and paste. A lot of quests have you gathering materials yes, but many quests had me:

leading a queen insect back to the Library, one had me climbing a massive tree, another had me taking the giant Gelanta for a walk as I protected it from enemies, one quest had me escorting those flying creatures to Sappa as you shot pods of larvae, another had me jumping onto the backs of and healing those flying creatures in the desert village, another where I had to find a junkyard at the bottom of a ravine and destroy toxic barrels, another where I had to herd those sheep creatures, one where I had to shoot the projectile into the mouths of those giant worms, and one where I had to find hidden children and shoot bells to make music etc. , etc. on and on.

So, it's not all copy and paste quests like you say. There is variety. And those temple trials where you have to follow the light are incredibly fun: jumping, hovering, flying, turning as you fly in the sky following their movements, to your reward. It's not as dull as you make it out to be.

[flippy232]

Początkowo opublikowane przez legaiaflame:

So, it's not all copy and paste quests like you say. There is variety. And those temple trials where you have to follow the light are incredibly fun: jumping, hovering, flying, turning as you fly in the sky following their movements, to your reward. It's not as dull as you make it out to be.

Just a difference of preference, but man...those follow tinkerbell quests were the absolute worst. It felt like a pointless and boring waste of time to me. Definitely felt like mindless filler.

To each their own...

[outcast]

Początkowo opublikowane przez legaiaflame:

still, If I had to choose, I would rather play this game over the original, even Second Contact. The original game was repetitive as well. Even more so. Just because you have to find everything yourself doesn't mean it didn't get boring. With how big the world is, this game would be horrible if you got a quest to talk to person A, go to point D, and travel to point Z, without any quest markers.

Plus, not every quest is copy and paste. A lot of quests have you gathering materials yes, but many quests had me:

leading a queen insect back to the Library, one had me climbing a massive tree, another had me taking the giant Gelanta for a walk as I protected it from enemies, one quest had me escorting those flying creatures to Sappa as you shot pods of larvae, another had me jumping onto the backs of and healing those flying creatures in the desert village, another where I had to find a junkyard at the bottom of a ravine and destroy toxic barrels, another where I had to herd those sheep creatures, one where I had to shoot the projectile into the mouths of those giant worms, and one where I had to find hidden children and shoot bells to make music etc. , etc. on and on.

So, it's not all copy and paste quests like you say. There is variety. And those temple trials where you have to follow the light are incredibly fun: jumping, hovering, flying, turning as you fly in the sky following their movements, to your reward. It's not as dull as you make it out to be.

We clearly value completely different things in the original game and games in general. Again my main gripe is that this game does much of the complete opposite of what the original did. And like I wrote to me it is really much of the complete antithesis in terms of design philosophy compared to the original game. While that game had everything I love, this game has pretty much everything I loathe in gaming today. The reason the original is still my favorite game 25 years later after having played 1000:s of other games is that that game focused on feeling authentic, immersive, dynamic and like everything had a reason and explanation in the world to drag you into that world and believe it was almost real. Even how the save system was not just a tacked on menu but you actually had the crystal that you had to take out and squeeze and it emitted a light that could alert enemies. Everything had deliberate thought behind it and like every part had a reason and internal logic to make you believe in the world all the more.

Compare all that to this that is as artificial and fake as it comes. Everything feels like a theme park with fake scaffoldings and does not even try to be convincing as you do another race against a light with a big "RESET" button prompt on the screen while bouncing around on flowers like in a Mario game. Or doing the 25:th iterations of the exact same activity on another marker on the map while at the end opening a glowing chest or punching a flower to get the reward. Or doing one of the isolated minigames with tutorial prompts that pop up to explain the current minigame. It is bland, fake, artificial and the complete opposite of believable or immersive and have been done to death in other games. It is just filler "content" to spoon feed the player to fill up time. It does not help that every quest feels completely trivial and there is zero challenge and you just have to go through the motions. I played on Hard but I never once felt the slightest challenge or even pushback from the game in any way. It was really like being dragged around from one point to another to just do the next busy task.

About the map markers, I do loath map markers but honestly they are not the main gripe as most other games these days have them and still can manage to feel interesting in other ways. Games like The Witcher 3 and Baldurs Gate 3 etc have map markers but the actual quests are still engaging and involving so it is possible. The issue with Outcast "2":s quests though is that they are as bland as they come and to me they reek of MMO style with small bite sized quick missions that all feel bland and like busy tasks. All the quests you describe have mechanics that have been done to death in other games and only adds to the feeling of the game feeling artificial and fake as opposed to dynamic and immersive. Take the escort missions, it is the usual thing where you are locked into a route where your escort moves on a set route a bit and then at predictable intervals there comes a wave of enemies then you move a bit and another wave comes. You could predict it in your sleep. Repeat 3-4 times and the "mission is completed". The herding mission is the same, a tutorial prompt pops up on the screen informing the player that he needs to herd the sheep into the pen, completely artificial and gamey and anyone who has even played a handful of games have done the exact same things more times than can be counted in other games. "find a junkyard at the bottom of a ravine and destroy toxic barrels" consists of just flying to the magic marker and destroying x amounts of mounds and shooting x amount of barrels. Very involving.

As for navigating without quest markers it would be a challenge indeed but it could be done as other big games have done it (Morrowind is one example of a huge game without them etc). They could have used the same system from the original Talans pointing the way or honestly if the game even cared about even trying to have some sort of internal logic and explanation for things they could have gone with having glowing lights that showed the way and the explanation could be that it is the Yods that is guiding the Ulukai. Anything to at least *try* to make things feel believable in some way. Honestly the hugely popular Elden Ring would be a great inspiration of a huge open world game without map markers and where you instead get some guidance from speaking to the NPC:s, just exploring and even the guidance of grace light that points the way. But this game completely lacks even trying to do that even though it could have a good context for it with the Yods and the general magical fantastical nature of the game (it is harder to make a logical explanation in a purely realistic game) and instead just slaps on the usual generic hud interface with a magic marker and quest panel cluttering up the screen that have no context at all and just screams at you that you are just playing another generic game.

So yes we clearly value completely different things. I could see how this could be entertaining like other games like it if one just wants to disconnect the mind and zone out. It is the exact same formula of other Ubisoft type titles or mmo:s that also serve a buffe of repeating busy tasks. But it is nothing like the original Outcast.

[nerdcommando.gamestudios]

By all the metrics this one is a financial failure of so colossal proportions that it'll easily bury the series for 25 years more, if not forever. Forget it Jake, it's Chinatown.

[legaiaflame]

Początkowo opublikowane przez outcast:

Początkowo opublikowane przez legaiaflame:

still, If I had to choose, I would rather play this game over the original, even Second Contact. The original game was repetitive as well. Even more so. Just because you have to find everything yourself doesn't mean it didn't get boring. With how big the world is, this game would be horrible if you got a quest to talk to person A, go to point D, and travel to point Z, without any quest markers.

Plus, not every quest is copy and paste. A lot of quests have you gathering materials yes, but many quests had me:

leading a queen insect back to the Library, one had me climbing a massive tree, another had me taking the giant Gelanta for a walk as I protected it from enemies, one quest had me escorting those flying creatures to Sappa as you shot pods of larvae, another had me jumping onto the backs of and healing those flying creatures in the desert village, another where I had to find a junkyard at the bottom of a ravine and destroy toxic barrels, another where I had to herd those sheep creatures, one where I had to shoot the projectile into the mouths of those giant worms, and one where I had to find hidden children and shoot bells to make music etc. , etc. on and on.

So, it's not all copy and paste quests like you say. There is variety. And those temple trials where you have to follow the light are incredibly fun: jumping, hovering, flying, turning as you fly in the sky following their movements, to your reward. It's not as dull as you make it out to be.

We clearly value completely different things in the original game and games in general. Again my main gripe is that this game does much of the complete opposite of what the original did. And like I wrote to me it is really much of the complete antithesis in terms of design philosophy compared to the original game. While that game had everything I love, this game has pretty much everything I loathe in gaming today. The reason the original is still my favorite game 25 years later after having played 1000:s of other games is that that game focused on feeling authentic, immersive, dynamic and like everything had a reason and explanation in the world to drag you into that world and believe it was almost real. Even how the save system was not just a tacked on menu but you actually had the crystal that you had to take out and squeeze and it emitted a light that could alert enemies. Everything had deliberate thought behind it and like every part had a reason and internal logic to make you believe in the world all the more.

Compare all that to this that is as artificial and fake as it comes. Everything feels like a theme park with fake scaffoldings and does not even try to be convincing as you do another race against a light with a big "RESET" button prompt on the screen while bouncing around on flowers like in a Mario game. Or doing the 25:th iterations of the exact same activity on another marker on the map while at the end opening a glowing chest or punching a flower to get the reward. Or doing one of the isolated minigames with tutorial prompts that pop up to explain the current minigame. It is bland, fake, artificial and the complete opposite of believable or immersive and have been done to death in other games. It is just filler "content" to spoon feed the player to fill up time. It does not help that every quest feels completely trivial and there is zero challenge and you just have to go through the motions. I played on Hard but I never once felt the slightest challenge or even pushback from the game in any way. It was really like being dragged around from one point to another to just do the next busy task.

About the map markers, I do loath map markers but honestly they are not the main gripe as most other games these days have them and still can manage to feel interesting in other ways. Games like The Witcher 3 and Baldurs Gate 3 etc have map markers but the actual quests are still engaging and involving so it is possible. The issue with Outcast "2":s quests though is that they are as bland as they come and to me they reek of MMO style with small bite sized quick missions that all feel bland and like busy tasks. All the quests you describe have mechanics that have been done to death in other games and only adds to the feeling of the game feeling artificial and fake as opposed to dynamic and immersive. Take the escort missions, it is the usual thing where you are locked into a route where your escort moves on a set route a bit and then at predictable intervals there comes a wave of enemies then you move a bit and another wave comes. You could predict it in your sleep. Repeat 3-4 times and the "mission is completed". The herding mission is the same, a tutorial prompt pops up on the screen informing the player that he needs to herd the sheep into the pen, completely artificial and gamey and anyone who has even played a handful of games have done the exact same things more times than can be counted in other games. "find a junkyard at the bottom of a ravine and destroy toxic barrels" consists of just flying to the magic marker and destroying x amounts of mounds and shooting x amount of barrels. Very involving.

As for navigating without quest markers it would be a challenge indeed but it could be done as other big games have done it (Morrowind is one example of a huge game without them etc). They could have used the same system from the original Talans pointing the way or honestly if the game even cared about even trying to have some sort of internal logic and explanation for things they could have gone with having glowing lights that showed the way and the explanation could be that it is the Yods that is guiding the Ulukai. Anything to at least *try* to make things feel believable in some way. Honestly the hugely popular Elden Ring would be a great inspiration of a huge open world game without map markers and where you instead get some guidance from speaking to the NPC:s, just exploring and even the guidance of grace light that points the way. But this game completely lacks even trying to do that even though it could have a good context for it with the Yods and the general magical fantastical nature of the game (it is harder to make a logical explanation in a purely realistic game) and instead just slaps on the usual generic hud interface with a magic marker and quest panel cluttering up the screen that have no context at all and just screams at you that you are just playing another generic game.

So yes we clearly value completely different things. I could see how this could be entertaining like other games like it if one just wants to disconnect the mind and zone out. It is the exact same formula of other Ubisoft type titles or mmo:s that also serve a buffe of repeating busy tasks. But it is nothing like the original Outcast.

Sorry, but again I respectfully disagree. Open world games need good user interface options and quest trackers. It's 2024 and is pretty much a basic requirement of all open world games. Not having them, makes the game feel archaic and dated or quite frankly, not made well. The world is far from artificial with them in place. Sure the Gamsav was cool for the time, I get that. But that doesn't work in a massive open world game today, where you need to save your progress fast and efficiently.

Bouncing off of flowers is a mechanic that helps and aids the gliding. As to give you height fast. Which makes the gliding mechanic more fun and easier to use throughout the world. Without it you would spend needless time jumping up cliffs to even get the needed height You need. It's there for a faster alternative to get places. Which is great.

As for the issue you have with repetition. Almost every open world game has repetitive aspects to it. No open world game can escape it. Breath of the Wild/Tears of the Kingdom, had excessive resource gathering and dull npc sidequests, The Witcher 3 had copy and paste monster hunts, Skyrim had copy and paste dungeon aesthetics, Starfield has copy and paste planet exploration. The list goes on. At least this game has a beautifully crafted world to explore, fun character interactions and dialogue and a fun story. Some open world games don't even have that.

[Dude]

i whole heartedly agree with outcast. Quest Markers are one of the worst things that happend to gaming.

"walk to marker press X" that is what games have been since then. There i no effort in the quest dialoque no variation just stupid time wasting walking to marker.

And to make it worse there is also glowing objects. Completly pathetic.

[Blackened Halo]

Im not a fan of the series but I am a fan of immersive gameplay and games that are fresh and innovative.

Sadly I cannot say it about this game. While i love the world and the graphics, the whole game is just about running from an icon to an icon in an open world.

There is no sense of discovery like for example in Skyrim. At least judging from what I have played so far. Everything here is based on icons and thats so archaic.

[outcast]

Początkowo opublikowane przez legaiaflame:

Początkowo opublikowane przez outcast:

We clearly value completely different things in the original game and games in general. Again my main gripe is that this game does much of the complete opposite of what the original did. And like I wrote to me it is really much of the complete antithesis in terms of design philosophy compared to the original game. While that game had everything I love, this game has pretty much everything I loathe in gaming today. The reason the original is still my favorite game 25 years later after having played 1000:s of other games is that that game focused on feeling authentic, immersive, dynamic and like everything had a reason and explanation in the world to drag you into that world and believe it was almost real. Even how the save system was not just a tacked on menu but you actually had the crystal that you had to take out and squeeze and it emitted a light that could alert enemies. Everything had deliberate thought behind it and like every part had a reason and internal logic to make you believe in the world all the more.

Compare all that to this that is as artificial and fake as it comes. Everything feels like a theme park with fake scaffoldings and does not even try to be convincing as you do another race against a light with a big "RESET" button prompt on the screen while bouncing around on flowers like in a Mario game. Or doing the 25:th iterations of the exact same activity on another marker on the map while at the end opening a glowing chest or punching a flower to get the reward. Or doing one of the isolated minigames with tutorial prompts that pop up to explain the current minigame. It is bland, fake, artificial and the complete opposite of believable or immersive and have been done to death in other games. It is just filler "content" to spoon feed the player to fill up time. It does not help that every quest feels completely trivial and there is zero challenge and you just have to go through the motions. I played on Hard but I never once felt the slightest challenge or even pushback from the game in any way. It was really like being dragged around from one point to another to just do the next busy task.

About the map markers, I do loath map markers but honestly they are not the main gripe as most other games these days have them and still can manage to feel interesting in other ways. Games like The Witcher 3 and Baldurs Gate 3 etc have map markers but the actual quests are still engaging and involving so it is possible. The issue with Outcast "2":s quests though is that they are as bland as they come and to me they reek of MMO style with small bite sized quick missions that all feel bland and like busy tasks. All the quests you describe have mechanics that have been done to death in other games and only adds to the feeling of the game feeling artificial and fake as opposed to dynamic and immersive. Take the escort missions, it is the usual thing where you are locked into a route where your escort moves on a set route a bit and then at predictable intervals there comes a wave of enemies then you move a bit and another wave comes. You could predict it in your sleep. Repeat 3-4 times and the "mission is completed". The herding mission is the same, a tutorial prompt pops up on the screen informing the player that he needs to herd the sheep into the pen, completely artificial and gamey and anyone who has even played a handful of games have done the exact same things more times than can be counted in other games. "find a junkyard at the bottom of a ravine and destroy toxic barrels" consists of just flying to the magic marker and destroying x amounts of mounds and shooting x amount of barrels. Very involving.

As for navigating without quest markers it would be a challenge indeed but it could be done as other big games have done it (Morrowind is one example of a huge game without them etc). They could have used the same system from the original Talans pointing the way or honestly if the game even cared about even trying to have some sort of internal logic and explanation for things they could have gone with having glowing lights that showed the way and the explanation could be that it is the Yods that is guiding the Ulukai. Anything to at least *try* to make things feel believable in some way. Honestly the hugely popular Elden Ring would be a great inspiration of a huge open world game without map markers and where you instead get some guidance from speaking to the NPC:s, just exploring and even the guidance of grace light that points the way. But this game completely lacks even trying to do that even though it could have a good context for it with the Yods and the general magical fantastical nature of the game (it is harder to make a logical explanation in a purely realistic game) and instead just slaps on the usual generic hud interface with a magic marker and quest panel cluttering up the screen that have no context at all and just screams at you that you are just playing another generic game.

So yes we clearly value completely different things. I could see how this could be entertaining like other games like it if one just wants to disconnect the mind and zone out. It is the exact same formula of other Ubisoft type titles or mmo:s that also serve a buffe of repeating busy tasks. But it is nothing like the original Outcast.

Sorry, but again I respectfully disagree. Open world games need good user interface options and quest trackers. It's 2024 and is pretty much a basic requirement of all open world games. Not having them, makes the game feel archaic and dated or quite frankly, not made well. The world is far from artificial with them in place. Sure the Gamsav was cool for the time, I get that. But that doesn't work in a massive open world game today, where you need to save your progress fast and efficiently.

You are completely wrong, open world games does not need quest trackers at all. They are a lazy excuse to just herd lazy players around. Again just one random example is Elden Ring that does not have them and many other games also lack them. Quest markers inherently make things feel artificial and gamey since they ARE artificial in their nature. With them you are guided around like a brainless child who are who are not even tasked with following simple commands on your own. There is zero sense of adventure when all you have to do is just blindly following a glowing marker around. It completely destroys all sense of exploration or agency. It is like fast food for the gaming industry, dumbing people down to just wanting to sit passive and not have to use their brains or figure anyting out themselves. The huge success of games like Elden Ring and others can hopefully face out these crutches though to give us more interesting games again where players are not pandered to in this way.