Story?

[Đeath’ş Aļļ | Horst Fuchs]

I saw this word in more reviews here on Steam. Can you DE fans explain me that "story"?

Cause even after two runs throught the game, one with original subtitles and second with good fan translation, i see nothing like a story in this. My only theory, based on that only ugly ingame scene with hospital bed, is that all these ♥♥♥♥♥ are just an images of dying man in a hospital. I hope i'm wrong.

This new edition seems to be a good pretext to run it once more, but with no story it's nothing more than nice benchmark.

[EdmeXIII (Alex)]

There's a story to it, though it's not plainly obvious what the story is. Which is what the developers intended. They wanted people to play through the game, and discuss what they thought the plot of the game was. You have to pay attention to what the narrator says, and also pay attention to the surroundings.

The narrator's wife is pregnant (the ultrasound pictures inside the house in the 2nd chapter), while the narrator was in the hospital recovering from kidney stones (the multiple references to the stones, and when Esther came to visit him in the hospital). Shortly after he gets out of the hospital, Esther is in a car crash, and doesn't survive. The island is (in my opinion) created as a result of the narrator's "descent into delusion/madness" as a result of her death. Though he's, to some extent, able to come to terms with her passing (when you see the paper boats being sent out to sea near the end of the game), he doesn't fully 'recover', which is why he jumps from the tower at the end of the game. So he can be with her again.

But then again, the above paragraph is just my (paraphrased) opinion of the story.

[King DaMuncha]

I thought they both died in the car crash and the island was his limbo, or he died in hospital but then, the narrarator says he visits Paul later after the accident, "Although he knew I hadn’t come in search of an apology, reason or retribution, he still spiralled in panic, thrown high and lucid by his own dented bonnet." I think the story about the kidney stones was another part of story being told about before the accident. I could go on, theres so many intertwining stories in this its hard to piece together what happened when. In the first chapter he talks alout about Donnely's book he wrote about the island and stealing it from the library (third person) and then says "I" when he talks about the car crash in the first person with Esther Donnely in the car with him. He insunuates that it was he who was drunk and not Paul Jacobson. So was the "bonnet of a drunk driver" his own or Pauls? Its hard to make sense of a dieing man.

[Wiesenknopf]

Just played through it, and while I feel I've got a sense of what the "story" is about, I doubt there's supposed to be one definite solution. I'm always amazed when people come up with wild theories that they claim are "correct" when ultimately it's all just speculation.
In this particular instance, there are too many holes in the plot to make for one definite version.
There is very little we do know, a lot of stuff is up to interpretation. For example, while it's likely that Narrator is Paul, there are some arguments to be made against it. We don't even know for sure whether Esther is dead, she might just be in some sort of vegetative state/coma with no hope of recovery.
The only thing that is quite certain is that Narrator has mental problems and dies in the end.
Personally I don't necessarily think that this is great storytelling - but I understand many people go crazy for that sort of thing ;)

[Madbat]

It's fairly clear (as much as anything in this heap of ambiguity is) that Ester is dead, and that she was pregnant. The narrator mentions her ashes, that he stole some and put them in his pocket, and some of them spilled out into the car upholstery (what car was he in?). There's also an achivement to find 4 funerary urns. Beyond that, it's really anybody's guess as to what's going on beyond The narrator is mentaly broken by her death, and he is never released from his (self imposed?) purgatory until he comes to grips with whatever happened. The developers commentary indicates he's actually in a coma, but that never comes through in game itself as far as I noticed. I don't think the developers themselves really thought and planned out anything specific beyond 'This guy's messed up.'

[Wiesenknopf]

It is fairly clear that Esther is dead, although I'd still say vegetative state could work (death of the mind rather than death of the body), the narrator has gone off the rails so much it's pretty hard to say what is imaginary or simply symbolic and what actually happened.
I find the claim "she was pregnant" to be a bit curious, though. Are there any more hints than the ultrasound pictures in that one building? Because, those didn't look like they depicted an embryo/fetus or anything of the sort. I'd also have thought the narrator would have goshed some more about this supposed pregnancy, in some obscure way or another?

[Madbat]

That's an ultrasound picture on the table, in media that's almost always associated with pregnancy. The developers comments also confirm she was pregnant when she was killed in the car accident, as well as the narrator being in a coma, as opposed to being dead himself.

But yes, the narrator has gone off the rails so you can't trust anything he says as fact. The Dear Esther game before this version warned you of that. You really need to take cues from the environment as to what's going on, but even so, it's designed to be ambiguous with a 'whatever you want' interpretation.

[Wiesenknopf]

Ah, thanks. I haven't played with dev commentary yet. Well, it feels a bit like "cheating" when they actively have to tell you "he's in a coma"/"she was pregnant" rather than the actual story speaking for itself, but obviously they have the last word on that.
You are right, an ultrasound picture usually implies pregnancy, but it is a bit surprising how utterly, utterly inconsequential this ends up being - with the narrator never actually commenting on it and no references to it made elsewhere.
Not to be too contrary now, but I feel this is akin to saying "she was blind/crippled/a rape victim" or similar - a quick way to ensure a player's sympathy without actually having to work for it ;) We actually don't know a thing about Esther - except she was pregnant, and now she is dead.
Anyways, it doesn't really seem to matter in the grand scale of things, but thanks for the reply and the clarification!

Edit: Didn't know "rape" was censored! So: "A victim of unwanted carnal attention"

[Madbat]

Yup, basically it's a story about a happily married bloke expecting a child, then whap, it's all gone, and he has to come to grips with it before he releases himself from his self imposed comatose purgatory he's put himself in. At least, that's what I gather from it.

I'm not clear as to why he's in the state he's in; from his dialogue, his kidney stones are long past, and the car accident was long past. Esther has been dead for a while, so what happened to him? He says he has talked to Paul since the accident, and he stole some of the ashes from the funeral (Why would he need to steal them if Esther was his wife?) If he's in a coma as the dev commentary suggests, how did he get in that state. Is his theft of the Hebrides book a coma dream, and was his conversation with Paul also a dream, or did any of these events happen in his real life. It's certain the place he is in is not normal. There are ghosts, and bits of the car wreckage, shrines, urns, not to mention all the books at the bottom of that one gully. He has also mentioned he thinks he's done all this before.

[[JC]Westenra]

"no story"

LOL

Thank you for the laugh. It's been a long day.

[[JC]Westenra]

"Proper Half-Life 2 mod"? The dev's received amazing reception and feedback from the HL2 community, one of the soul reasons they were able to move forward commercially.

And how is a story left open to interpretation not a story? You just posted your own interpretation, showing that they did their job, even if you are clearly an insecure bible-thumper. How is the presentation of music, narration, and setting inherently "wrong" if it's what the dev's intended? It's not a demo, it's exactly as long as the dev's intended it to be.

We get it, you're scared of the unique. I'm sorry you were unable to appreciate this little nugget of art, typical jealous reaction from someone who has accomplished so little in their own life. I guess anything more high-minded that driving a dune buggy down a beach crushing giant ants is too "pretentious" and "vain".

I'd recommend reading my review (I posted it last night) if you need a clearer explanation.

[[JC]Westenra]

Originally posted by Matthew 3:10:

First off, how do you classify this as a game? Please, elaborate on all the elements that makes this a game?? Why isn't this software under my software folder in my steam library???

Secondly, what's unique about this?? Besides this not being a game, yet people call it that (even the devs!)

Well, it's in your Steam library for one, and that means it's enough of a game that Valve saw fit to allow it on their platform. You start it up, you have the option to "start new game", there are graphics, audio and control options. You use ASDF to move around, and mouse to look. You manually move through the gameworld taking in the experience, and the dev's trickle-feed you story, atmosphere and presentation entirely as they intended. If it were "software", then you would be using it to draw a picture or compile PDF files or something. It's a game, just one of the first of its kind, which is why it grates on people like you so thoroughly. You afraid of change. Then again, it's all subjective anyway.

Thirdly, the true interpretation of a story is the truth of a story. Every interpretation that is not 100% truth is a lie. Look at all those lies people have stated. Is that what makes this software amazing? THat people lie about the story?? THat not a soul can tell the truth of it??? Not even the devs can tell ths story.. on the contrary, in the dev commentary, they consistently, persistently state the interpretation of the story is left up to the player. That... is f-cking horrible story-telling, That means to me that they never wrote a story, but instead, want the player to write the story for them. What a f-cking joke. Go away on this point. You're not a story-teller unless you tell a story, and from the looks of it, its the users of this software that are the story-tellers, not the software, or the devs What a f-cking bad joke on all of us,

On the contrary, they very specifically wrote multiple overlapping interpretations, with the intent of keeping the player guessing, and leaving it up to their imagination. Nothing wrong with that, it is a common trope in some of the best literature. Every time you think you have it figured out, something comes along to cause a shard of doubt. They very explicitly state in the commentary that this was their intention, because it respects the most important storytelling aspect of all-- the player's imagination. If you are someone who needs everything to be cut and dry to fit your narrow little worldview, look elsewhere. All of the different theories proposed on the forums is testement to the game's longevity, and plenty of games use this storytelling tactic and are wildly successful. What is "100% truth" anyway? There's no such thing. I've seen thermal imaging maps of the visible universe stretching back to the Big Bang, I've seen museums filled with fossils in varying states of change, I've watched bacteria evolve anti-biotic resistences in real time through a microscope, I've observes trillions of varieties of insects that would never have fit on an Ark. "God did it" isn't something you can test in a laboratory.

The dev's aren't lying to the player. You are lying to yourself.

Lastly, be grateful there's a Christian on Steam thumping the bible on you lost souls. I pray one day you wake up to the truth of life, realize the dire circumstance your soul is in, and that you get it saved. Until then, you are of the devil (he owns you) and you will continuously sin, such as lie lie lie, covet covet covet, seek after lusts of the flesh, and all that makes you feel like you are special in your own wretched skin. It's sad these devs are anti-Christs and chose to project this angst in their perversion of Paul's journey to Damascus. If you read and learned the bible, you'd despise these devs for their satanic insertion into this game. It's obvious beyond obvious that the devs, on one hand, despise the truth of the bible and pervert it, and on the other hand, honor it enough to go to it and draw from it. But what they do with what they draw from it is perversion. Shame. Sad saps such as yourself eventually believe this anti-christ sh-t because sad saps like you want to continue to do evil. As the scripture say.

I'm evil for liking a game with no gore and no violence? Yet you claim Dear Esther isn't up to the standard of Half-Life 2, a game about murder and mayhem? My my, so much hypocrisy and judgment over a harmless game. How un-Christ like. I know atheists who are better Christians than you. Perhaps they could give you a few pointers on how to be a better human being. Let me know if you'd like me to hook you up.

And how hilariously presumptuous and patronizing of you to assume I'm not a "true believer" just because I disagree with you. Isn't it blasphemous to presume that your interpretation is the correct one, or the only one? An omnipotent, omnipresent God is far larger than anything your little mind can comprehend. Yet here you are, putting everything you believe about God into a little carefully-labelled box, and then worshiping the box instead of God.

I finally see what's really going on here. In one of the commentary nodes the (extremely talented) Jessica Curry asks Dan why he is an atheist, and he gives an incredibly throught out and humanistic response, wherein he draws on all aspects of life instead of the narrow one you arbitrarily chose to adhere to, and it drove you crazy, because you've been brainwashed into believing that anyone who doesn't prescribe to your personal cut-and-dry perversion of belief is SATAN! You've made a virtue out of ignorance, and have once again had that horrible epiphony shoved in your face... by a GAME. How brittle is your belief system if that is all it takes to get a rise out of you.

This is a half-life 2 mod that is incomplete, and instead of being finished, it went on to kill itself off the top of a tower. Wow. Just.... amazing. Unique!!!

Ah, so you went with the "killed himself" interpretation. That's... shallow, but judging by your attitude thus far it's not a stretch that you missed out on a lot of symbolism because you were stuck up on a bible verse.

Sorry, I'm going to have to go with the cumulative positive Steam user rating over some quack who believes in a deity that drowns his children. Such insecurity from a higher power.

[Madbat]

Whelp, there goes an interesting discussion out the window.

[dima_]

religious nut ♥♥♥♥♥ literally thinks the earth is flat ♥♥♥♥ outta here with that ♥♥♥♥

[DyNaMiX]

Originally posted by John 11:21-27:

Originally posted by dima_:

religious nut ♥♥♥♥♥ literally thinks the earth is flat ♥♥♥♥ outta here with that ♥♥♥♥

Another sad story of a mind filled with lies. Dear Esther is perfect for you. A fitting way to let go.

I reckon your mind would make a brilliant Dear Esther 2...

[C-zom]

He doesn't kill himself at the end, he soars free like a bird. Thought that was ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ obvious.