Production and Unit Creation

[Bloodthirst]

Is anyone able to give a breif explanation on how production works?
I cant tell if production is completely automated or if I am able to request x amount of y and if I am able to form new units from scratch? I think I have the hang of attaching elements to units but I cant tell if its possible to build/create from the ground up.
Is anyone able to shed some light on this?
Thanks in advance.

[loki1006]

its a mix and its different for both sides.

For the Germans its automated, both the generation of new units and the creation of upgrade/replacement elements. The recent patches have really improved how this routine works.

For the Soviets you get some automatic new units (combination of historical arrivals and the return of units you lost between June-Nov 1941) and you can raise both on map units and support units as you need. The creation of elements to fill out these units (rifle squads etc) is on the basis of need, so if you never raise a unit that needs a given element (a good eg is the Soviet 107mm AT gun you can use in mid-42), then that will never be produced.

also remember for both sides there is the distinction between named vehicles (mostly AFVs) and tanks which must be produced in particular factories (this means for the Soviets in 1941 you have to make sure you evacuate these) and generic armament factories that generate the rest of the equipment (artillery, infantry squads etc).

[Bloodthirst]

Thanks Loki, a bit of a shame about having no hand in production on the German side to suit my strategy/situation but the games plenty big enough already I guess.

[hertston]

It is, but the point is more that such decisions were not under the control of OKW, and hence are not really appropriate to the game - they would impact adversely on realism and indeed 'immersion', if you like.

Even Hitler could not have practically changed production in that way, at least without causing such chaos and confusion it could never have been worthwhile. He did make some notorious production decisions, of course, but on a wider strategic scale, and certainly not in response to any particular operational strategy/situation of his generals.

[Sterling Archer]

I have seen hertston bring up the realism issue regarding the players ability to change production on other threads. Though he is correct that production decisions were technically outside the scope of OKW, it is well known that German production decision were often changed due to information received from the front.

To look at it from another perspective, STAVKA would have little control over when a factory re-located, since this was decided by a separate committee at the Kremlin, yet in the game the player has full control. Technically the player should have no control and should be biting his/her nails hoping the factories relocate before the cities fall.

Realism is great, but limiting your options can also limit your enjoyment of rewriting history.

[Dant Perst]

I played Second Front: Germany Turns East (Grigsby's forerunner to WITE) many years ago, and I am disappointed that his latest version does not allow players to change factory production, change out AFVs and planes in unit assignments, and engage factories in R&D to speed up the schedule of implementation of new AFVs and planes. In addition, there were opportunities to take units from or release units to the Western Front, which led to changes in that historical timeline. The rationale for eliminating these functions from WITE appears to boil down to "historical accuracy." Given that wargames, in general, are designed to enable the player to examine and alter the outcomes of battles or wars, it would seem that historical accuracy is not a sufficient reason to eliminate more extensive production capabilities from the game. Historical accuracy does not preclude the player from withdrawing the Sixth Army from Stalingrad before it is decimated and, like the Afrika Korps, it's manpower and experience is lost to the German war machine -- just two of Hitler's critical mistakes which the game does not require in order to maintain the historical accuracy of Germany's final defeat.

Regardless of the argument for or against historical accuracy, perhaps GG could have included a more vital production capability as a preference or scenario alternative. It would have added dimension to a game that, despite it's massive size and number and variation of units, lacks the logistical and technological factors were likely to have been just as important to the final outcome of the Eastern Front as the movement and commitment of units on the battlefield. I would encourage GG and Matrix to consider such an addition to WITE in future upgrades.

[doomdecker]

@Schockdavid47 Yes I played SF too and was disappointed as well when you could not do R&D anymore or change stuff in WITE. I also always removed the crappy SS units from the East and put them in the West to pasture. Since 2.0 doesn´t contain the features I can´t get myself to buy it ( even though its a nitpick I guess ). And yes, I share your sentiment about historical/what if. Get it as historical as possible but leave my what ifs alone as much as you can....

[identifiedasbeingdisrespectful]

The scenario itself determines what is produced where, there's a chance for factories to expand production up to a certain point, and the AI decides when to swap equipment or upgrade it, but you do have minor control over the flow of where things go.