Fuse - Steam Version vs Website Version. Just what are we getting?

[Tabriel]

Hi there,

As someone who's spent an extortionate amount of money on steam I like to know what I'm getting for my money - and when I looked at this program I thought "This sounds interesting, but the Steam Store page doesn't really tell me everything.

Granted this is early access, I'd like to know that I'm not throwing money into the wind and watching it blow away, so I visited the Mixamo.com store to check out the pricing and options on the official store... and I did not like what I saw, it put me in mind of "Buy the game, 90% of it's locked behind a paid content wall", and the Steam Store doesn't give any indication of this.

The pricing page for Fuse:
http://www.mixamo.com/pricing

Checking this out shows that "per year" a Fuse All Access pack is $1499, and this includes full access to everything the software has to offer; models, rigs, facial capture, the whole 9-yards.

So what does our 40 euros get us? I really don't know, because the Features List and About The Game section of steam doesn't really say. It flaunts the ease of use, the unparalleled technology and the amazing options - but are we getting that?

The only thing the Early Access bar says is ""The Scout, Spy and Sniper from Team Fortress 2 are included in the free release content, and additional TF2 characters will be added in the near future!”" - so are we going to see all the models included on the webite? Are we going to be able to upload and download the animations/rigging via the website just for this 40 euro purchase? I have no idea, and it doesn't look like any official page on Steam or Mixamo.com will tell me.

Then I noticed the word "Credits" on the website. It appears different models cost "credits", different animations and animation packs cost "credits". So, do we get any credits with this purchase? Does this purchase act as the "All Access" pack? I suspect that won't be the case, as I doubt they'd give away a 1.5k (per year) program for the one time low price of 40 euros.

To me this looks like "Get in now, you get the base software, access to the TF2 Models, and PERHAPS the ability to rig those models for free, then for everything else... you pay credits. And if you want credits, they ain't cheap!". For example, from the website:
"Using the Auto-Rigger on Mixamo is free, downloading the rigged characters costs 79 Mixamo credits" - so hang on there, I can use the rigger but I have to pay to download what I rig? Does that also count for the TF2 models included with this Steam purchase?
And let's also look at the price of the credits themselves if you're not on the All Access pack:
$32 for 40 Credits, $90 for 120 Credits, $253 for 360 Credits, $465 for 720 Credits.
And this is WITH a 20%, 25%, 30% and 35% discount respectivly (20% off the $32 for example). So to download my ONE rigged character, I essentially have to buy either 2x $32 pack of credits or a $90 pack of credits?

So I ask the earnest and last questions below:
1. Can we get a clarification of EXACTLY what the 40 euro price gets us? Not the list of features the software itself has. Just having access to the TF2 rigs is pointless if we want something to make our own characters.
2. Does this 40 euro TF2 version (if that's what it is) get all the options to upgrade to the All Access pack? And if so, why is that not all detailed in the Steam Store?
3. Just what else are we not being told about this Steam version of Fuse that we should be being told coming into this purchase?
4. Why is there no FAQ on the Steam version on your official website?

My intent here is not to put people off, but to get some clarification, to get some light shed on what we are putting our money towards.

Thank you to whoever officially responds to this, I look forward to getting your reply.
- Tabriel

[Darrok]

Wow...just wow... "All Access - 5 Users for $5999 a year" i don't get it? Are the devs starting going the same way like the Devs from Planetary Annihilation charging much money? This is definitly not good! I spend myself much money and i also want to know for what i'm paying for, but that price on the Website made me think how greedy the are. Of course the have to pay bills and so, but still it's entirely ridiculous. The cannot expect to get much customers and i will not spend my money on that! I wanted to make myself animated Models, but this dream just exploded in little pieces.

[Chrome]

$1500/yr is an all access thing for everything (the whole site, not just fuse). Basically you can add any animation sequence you want (and there's a lot) and export and start using in whatever program you use. You also have access to all of their characters to mess with, and not have to deal with the nickle & diming of the credit system.

If you're working with games, you'd see that those prices aren't actually all that bad considering someone who never did animating before could now do it relatively easily, and you'd pay a ton more for an actual modeler/rigger/animator that went to school for the stuff and does it professionally.

As for the steam version, the price gives you access to a bunch of different parts that you can piece together and create your own characters. I don't recall the exact number unfortunately, couple hundred total I imagine, and that's before any upcoming DLC & Community Created stuff.

Last time I used the Auto-Rigger on the site, it was free to do (for basic bi-peds) and free to download and just the basic T-Pose, and there was a free plugin for 3ds max to import the rigging.

[mouxe]

Originally posted by Tabriel:

1. Can we get a clarification of EXACTLY what the 40 euro price gets us? Not the list of features the software itself has. Just having access to the TF2 rigs is pointless if we want something to make our own characters.
2. Does this 40 euro TF2 version (if that's what it is) get all the options to upgrade to the All Access pack? And if so, why is that not all detailed in the Steam Store?
3. Just what else are we not being told about this Steam version of Fuse that we should be being told coming into this purchase?
4. Why is there no FAQ on the Steam version on your official website?

1. Fuse comes with a ton of characters that you can remix to create your own content, in addition to the TF2 characters. It is a modeling tool, that easily connects to Mixamo's other game production services. Your creations are yours, and you can export them as OBJ from the app, or upload them to keep working with other Mixamo services, like creating a rig, or shopping for animations.
2. The purchase of Fuse does not include access to Mixamo's "All Access" pass. The "All Access" pass is for all of Mixamo's services, which includes access to Fuse, but you don't need it to use Fuse successfully. It just gives you a great deal if you plan to use our other services, which include unlimited autorigs and access to our animation and character collections, among other things. It's more geared toward heavy users or production facilities, so it may or may not make sense depending on your use case. The demo comes with just the TF2 characters and a few others, if you're interested in trying it out.
3. You'll get 2 free autorigs when you create a mixamo account, and 1 free autorig each week because you are a Fuse user.
4. Please pardon our dust, as we're just launching today. A FAQ on our website is a great idea.


With the Steam version of Fuse, you will be able to create a character in Fuse, upload it to Mixamo for a rig, and download your character (select the free T-pose animation) to start using the rig to animate. The rig won't cost a thing if you're just rigging a new character each week. If you're interested in Mixamo's pre-made animations, they are also available, but as you mentioned, they are not all free, though there are a few.

I hope this is helpful! Thanks for your interest in Fuse,
Charles

[Tabriel]

Thanks for the reply to my questions Charles, I do appreciate it - and I am sorry if my post seemed a little "Me want everything!", I know you just launched it today (which is why I jumped on it), as it just seemed like there were a lot of unanswered questions, and you've done just that - answered them. :)

I was mainly concerned about the lack of detail about just what you get for having the Steam Version, I knew it wasn't going to be the "full thing" but as it didn't state anywhere it just seemed like it was one of those "Tempt you in and then get you paying" sort of deals, but for a free user getting one free rig (plus two for purchase) and then the free animations per week isn't a problem and I think for the pricepoint that's pretty good, as 1x rig in your credit system is around 60 bucks - just wanting to make sure people are getting a fair deal, and you've answered with a very clear "It does appear the deal is fair". And then of course people can pay for more depending on what they want and if they want to take it further.

As I mentioned before about an FAQ, that would be a good thing to edit your Steam Store page with and just pop a short rundown of that on the website, even linking to the Steam Store page - sounds like a wonderful piece of software, just needed that dust blowing off! ;)

So once again, thanks for the answers, as someone now leaning towards the "buy" button... you've cleared it all up.
- Tabriel

[mouxe]

Originally posted by Tabriel:

Thanks for the reply to my questions Charles, I do appreciate it - and I am sorry if my post seemed a little "Me want everything!", I know you just launched it today (which is why I jumped on it), as it just seemed like there were a lot of unanswered questions, and you've done just that - answered them. :)

I was mainly concerned about the lack of detail about just what you get for having the Steam Version, I knew it wasn't going to be the "full thing" but as it didn't state anywhere it just seemed like it was one of those "Tempt you in and then get you paying" sort of deals, but for a free user getting one free rig (plus two for purchase) and then the free animations per week isn't a problem and I think for the pricepoint that's pretty good, as 1x rig in your credit system is around 60 bucks - just wanting to make sure people are getting a fair deal, and you've answered with a very clear "It does appear the deal is fair". And then of course people can pay for more depending on what they want and if they want to take it further.

As I mentioned before about an FAQ, that would be a good thing to edit your Steam Store page with and just pop a short rundown of that on the website, even linking to the Steam Store page - sounds like a wonderful piece of software, just needed that dust blowing off! ;)

So once again, thanks for the answers, as someone now leaning towards the "buy" button... you've cleared it all up. :D:
- Tabriel

Thanks Tabriel! I'm glad I was able to answer some of your questions. This is new software, and we're very much looking forward to hearing from users like you about the directions it should go. I hope you do try it out, as I'd love to hear your feedback as we plan for our next set of features.

Best,
Charles

[priest865]

Originally posted by charlespina:

3. You'll get 2 free autorigs when you create a mixamo account, and 1 free autorig each week because you are a Fuse user.
Charles

I can live with an autorig every week. So when I don't use up my autorig in a week I could autorig 2 meshes the next week?

[TheStoryteller01]

Guys, that short thread here answered more than the official release text does - so it's a big thanks from me.

As an FPSC user I am also interested in the question of usage policy. Can I actually use the characters I tinker and download in a game built with a non-valve engine which I then upload (99% probablity it's going to be non-profit) for others to play?

[mouxe]

Originally posted by TheStoryteller01:

Guys, that short thread here answered more than the official release text does - so it's a big thanks from me.

As an FPSC user I am also interested in the question of usage policy. Can I actually use the characters I tinker and download in a game built with a non-valve engine which I then upload (99% probablity it's going to be non-profit) for others to play?

Yes, the characters you create belong to you, and you can use them royalty free.

[TheStoryteller01]

Never got an answer from a dev that fast. I'm your fan ; )

[mouxe]

Originally posted by priest865:

I can live with an autorig every week. So when I don't use up my autorig in a week I could autorig 2 meshes the next week?

It's structured such that you can't save up autorigs, unfortunately. After you've depleted your free rigs from signing up, you'll get one autorig enabled one week after your last rig, so you'll essentially always have one in the bank, and not, say 52 if you waited a year.

[priest865]

Thats ok with me. Just wanted to clarify. :)

[Darrok]

Originally posted by charlespina:

Originally posted by TheStoryteller01:

Guys, that short thread here answered more than the official release text does - so it's a big thanks from me.

As an FPSC user I am also interested in the question of usage policy. Can I actually use the characters I tinker and download in a game built with a non-valve engine which I then upload (99% probablity it's going to be non-profit) for others to play?

Yes, the characters you create belong to you, and you can use them royalty free.

It's always good to see how fast Developers respond to questions! Keep up the work and give your best! ;) Be aware that many peoples get angry when not everything runs as expected. I seen many comments from Steam Members getting very angry, but you doing your Job perfectly.

[76561198026248546]

For one, this dev is amazing. For two: I'm dumb. Therefore, I'd like to ask if the program allows you to use your own models from programs like Maya and ZBrush and things like and also the reverse (use models you create within Fuse to edit within those programs). Please educate my ignorance.

[BadTertle]

We are looking into simplifying the import process to allow for user models to get into Fuse. Its a very high priority for us. But, a big yes to the second part. Most 3d packages can import and use .objs (the file type Fuse exports directly) and .fbx (the file type that an autorigged character from Mixamo.com gives).

[76561198026248546]

Originally posted by BadTertle:

We are looking into simplifying the import process to allow for user models to get into Fuse. Its a very high priority for us. But, a big yes to the second part. Most 3d packages can import and use .objs (the file type Fuse exports directly) and .fbx (the file type that an autorigged character from {LINK REMOVED}Mixamo.com gives).

Thank you good sir!