Preservation spell & Priest destroying spirit

[Gegenstroemung]

Is it correct that the spell does not work when the Priest uses his special ability?

[Umbrella Incorporated]

Yes, because no battle takes place. The Priest simply uses his ability to instantly destroy the spirit.

[ososober]

Preservation
cast as required, on any character, Follower, or Enemy. It prevents a character from losing a life or a Follower from being killed. When cast on an Enemy, it prevents it from being killed, and the attack is considered a stand-off.

as it is a "cast as required" it does not have to be in the act of battle/psyic combat for the kill effect to happen. the cross/priest destroy spirit both trigger the killed effect, and therefore preservation should be able to cast as there is now a valid killed effect

[Umbrella Incorporated]

Originally posted by ososober:

Preservation
cast as required, on any character, Follower, or Enemy. It prevents a character from losing a life or a Follower from being killed. When cast on an Enemy, it prevents it from being killed, and the attack is considered a stand-off.

as it is a "cast as required" it does not have to be in the act of battle/psyic combat for the kill effect to happen. the cross/priest destroy spirit both trigger the killed effect, and therefore preservation should be able to cast as there is now a valid killed effect

Incorrect. The very last line that states the attack is considered a standoff means that it aplies to being killed from battle only. The Priest's ability bypasses this and simply banishes the spirit. No battle takes place, so Preservation will not work in that instance.

[ToothlessNightFury]

I would tend to agree with Umbrella on this one!

[ososober]

yes, if the spell is used in a combat situation. it can also be used out side combat, such as crags, vampire tower, i agree that most situation when cast on a enemy it would cause a stand off but there are time when it could be cast on an enemy outside of combat, this situation would be one of them,

[Umbrella Incorporated]

Originally posted by ososober:

yes, if the spell is used in a combat situation. it can also be used out side combat, such as crags, vampire tower, i agree that most situation when cast on a enemy it would cause a stand off but there are time when it could be cast on an enemy outside of combat, this situation would be one of them,

No, no and no.

1) If you roll an envounter in the Crags, you have to fight the spirit (although the Priest can banish this spirit as well). In this case, as I said before, the banishment overrides the battle. You can use Preservation against the Crags Spirit (although that would be a waste) if the character goes into physhic combat.
2) At the Vampire tower, you do not engage combat, but you can choose to sacrifice Followers in place of your Lives. Preservation specifically lists stopping Followers from being destroyed. That's why it works there.

Please list other times that you fight something outside of combat that Preservation "might" work.

[ososober]

chasim, lepper, reaper lose a follower, vampire prince, lose a life and a follower, giant beetle, using cross to destroy a spirit, destruction spell of enemy, goblin sapper on enemy, finger of death before combat starts, earthquake, these are some of the examples, that i can think of, that preservation could be used out side of combat, on enemies and followers.

there could be more

[ToothlessNightFury]

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=483709744

1. The Priest cannot destroy the Spirit in the Crags.
   
2. Preservation cannot be cast on a creature; it must be an Enemy.
   
3. Preservation can only be cast on an Enemy that was involved in an attack (battle or psychic combat); it cannot be cast on an Enemy outside of an attack!

[ososober]

where does it state that if cast on a enemy it must be as a result of combat?

[ToothlessNightFury]

"and the attack is considered a stand-off."

The only time a stand-off occurs is as the result of an attack (battle or psychic combat); it doesn't happen at any other time.

[ososober]

it states, "when cast on an emeny it prevents it from being killed, and the attack is considered a stand off"

yes the only time a stand off can occur is during battle/psychic combat.
but it does not say can only be cast on an ememy during an encounter as clearly states "cast at any time"

and the only time it can be cast is when there is a valid target of the spell, (when an enemy is killed) an enemy can be killed out side of an encounter with a player

i guess it all comes down to what defines being killed is?

[sanityismyvanity]

Because the spell includes the phrase "and the attack is considered a stand off" in regards to when it is cast on an Enemy, the spell can only legally target an Enemy just killed as a result of combat, and not at any other time. Spells can only be legally cast when they have a valid target, and any Enemy that has been killed by something other than being defeated in combat cannot fulfill the conditions of the spell. So they would be an invalid target, and the spell cannot legally target them in the first place.

[ososober]

but the phrase "when cast on an enemy it prevents it from being killed" and the can cast as required specifies that it does not need to be in combat to cast, just any enemy kill should trigger it

[ToothlessNightFury]

You are taking certain extracts from the Spell osos and ignoring the whole text. It can only be used on Enemies defeated in battle or psychic combat preventing them from being killed. You cannot just look at the cast as required part.

[ososober]

no, not igoring the whole text, just as required i take as just that can be cast as required when any enemy dies, either in or out of combat, if in combat then the attack is considered a stand off is correct and applies, if out of combat "the attack is considered a stand off"does nothing