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We have gone back to that philosophy of early access.
22cans is going to do what 22cans is going do and we can like it or not.
Too bad they took my money with false promises of feature not in a game... I mean that first early access advert here on steam, with its jupiter sized multiplayer wolrd and living terrain.
Same reason why Attridge left, he figured if he were to have any future to speak of, he needed distance from Moly.
Keep that in mind when you see any of the 22 cans staff working for other developers or starting their own business.
Simon's rethoric and phrasing is very reminiscent of Moly. They are cut from the same cloth. If you didn't know that Simon was saying this, it sounds exactly like the things Moly would say. Someone had left this comment on this article "I wanted to like him, but a few too many things he said had the question-dodging victim-complex narrative Molyneux uses. Oh well."
Simon qouted: "It's impossible for me to go out and say, we're going to just fix all this stuff because I'd look like a c**t. It is what it is. Let's work out how we can fix that and be practical about it.
We've got a lot of work to do to get through the general barrier of distrust. We can go out and say, this is what we think we're going to do. So let's try to deliver it. We had updates going out because someone at some point was told to do updates, and they were a bit boring and a bit patronising and just basically a bit ♥♥♥♥.
So let's stop putting this stuff out because we think we should. Let's put some meaningful updates out. Let's show what we've been working on, because it's pretty cool. 100 per cent of people are going to say it's ♥♥♥♥. We know that because we've got this trust problem. But occasionally we'll get a couple of positive things. Let's engage with the positive feedback and start going, that's cool. We are actually working on this stuff. We know you think we're not. That's our problem. We created this problem. But let's keep doing this and make the game right, and keep talking to the community.
Slowly we'll feel there's this, 'Deliver me something good, and then we'll talk as customers.' Okay, fine. I can do that. That's a fair trade in my opinion. It's small steps to build trust. All we can do is deliver a good game at the end of it. That's the ultimate goal. It's going to take a lot of time. We're still getting a high percentage of people just going, 'That's really ♥♥♥♥.' It's like, have you looked at it? It's quite cool, actually. 'Oh yeah, it's quite cool.' We're slowly trying to build that level of trust.
The first release is combat, into Steam opt-in. We know it's going to get slated, even if it's the best thing in the world. So let's just make it as good as we can and then just be prepared for that.
If someone says to me, 'That's just ♥♥♥♥,' f*** off. I'm not going to talk to you because I don't have the time to listen to everyone saying it's ♥♥♥♥. We know you think it's ♥♥♥♥. Tell me something I don't know. Give me some feedback I can do something about, rather than us just going down a blind alley and everyone just throwing ♥♥♥♥ at us all of the time. It's not going to work. At that point you think, f*** it, let's just not bother.
We know what's wrong with the product. We want to get the next update right, and we want to engage the community with it. We don't know how to do that other than just try and be honest with these guys."
Simon, the community has repeatedly told you what's wrong with the game. The community had repeatedly gave you feedback you can do something with. Stop making a f***ing mobile game, and start making a PC focused game, with an engaging AI, resrouces and simulated living world. Oh wait, you have no experience making PC games, and it doesn't look like you want to build any.
Nothing is more telling than seeing history repeat itself.
This is why the RockPaperShotgun interview was completely valid, when Moly was asked if he was a pathological liar.
"Phillips asked Molyneux, directly, "Why did you ♥♥♥♥ up?"
"It was like, 'Well, I really don't know. It just happened. It just f***ed up.'
Funny how you didn't ♥♥♥♥ up any of the microtransaction payment systems.
Pathetic. Truly pathetic."
A tech support question sits on the front page with mod answers... and article about whether or not godus will ever be complete gets shuffled off the front page...
PR icks!
Yup, indeed.
I'm here today because of the article on Eurogamer[www.eurogamer.net] regarding Simon Phillips taking over as CEO from Peter Molyneux.
I don't know how many of the old guard are still around - but I greet you all and admire your tenacity where mine had long since failed this project.
To those newer, I'm sorry you'll have to sit through this wall of text.
First off allow me to say that much like Phillips indicates in the article.
I to believe in Peter's ability as a designer and developer.
Regardless of his history of overpromising I love the previous games (Whether it is Black & White, Fable or any of the others.) dearly, and it has always been my hope that Godus would retain some of that spark. Perhaps with Phillips' guidance some of that can still be salvaged.
However in a similar light I hold no illusions as to the current state of affairs.
22cans is effectively hogtied in a 9 foot deep hole, and the tide is rising on them.
Getting out of that situation is not gonna be an easy task.
Whether it be overcoming the gameplay obstacles or overcoming the public reputation.
Its clear that Phillips has his work cut out for him.
So I will lay out my thoughts. And perhaps some of the 22cans staff will see that underneath the cynicism and doubt - there is something worth salvaging. Something worth delivering.
But lets get down to brass tacks.
He's willing to admit that mistakes were made and willing to come clean.
I certainly hope that this will hold true and that he'll hold onto this both in actions aswell as words.
He got onto this ship which seems to me he believes that there's something WORTH salvaging and that is saying something.
But the question remains. What are the options?
To that end I think it is essential that Simon Phillips and 22cans in general open up the lines of communication.
I've said from day one that honesty and transparancy are key. And while promising features is a tricky business. It is more important than ever to lay down some ground rules at this point.
As stated in the article, they are on a clock. They can't just keep developing indefinitely.
To that end I'd like to see some of the following as an indication of what is to come:
Get a list of points down both based on past feedback and on the Kickstarter pillars of what is "within scope" at this point in time.
I don't expect features to be tied down in detail, but I'd like to see in broad strokes whether certain elements are absolutely out of bounds.
What is desired, but would depend on time and development progress and what is absolutely essential for Godus to salvage any degree of success.
Choices have been made. Some turned out well and others poorly.
At this point I believe it is essential to realize that some features in Godus just don't work. While others need shoring up. Once a broad picture is painted of what is needed and out of bounds.
It'll be essential to determine the weak spots of the current product and deal with them post-haste. Cutting out where necessary and mending where possible.
With eyes on the previous point and with the "Combat Update" in the works.
I'd also like to see what other elements are considered a high priority and why.
Much like many other backers and supporters I've always felt that the core gameplay of Godus is lacking - moving on to newer features has often felt shallow, building onto a poor foundation is asking for a collapse.
So what is going to NEED to be rebuild before anything else could reasonably work out.
(My own suggestions here are fix the AI and lay down a basis of "resources" to work the rest off of - which is no surprise to anyone that knows me.)
So after listing what is and isn't plausible - put them in a rough order of importance.
Crowdfunded and Early Access projects rely in large part on their community feedback.
If Phillips is true in his claims that he wants to salvage things its going to be necessary to keep talking and with that in mind its going to be key to lay down how much they are willing and able to take on community feedback.
With that in mind it is also going to be essential that the previous two points are laid out as to avoid feedback that is essentially either redundant or out of bounds.
To this day we've been asking for proper roadmaps and milestones and they never REALLY took off.
Iterative design was always the reason its not possible - yet I can't help but notice that that iterative design is also what kept Godus fluttering around like a butterfly moving from here to there rather aimlessly.
With the clock running it is ESSENTIAL to nail down some milestones.
And the current focus is the Combat Update. Yet as Phillips states in the Eurogamer article...
Even if they release that today, and even if its perfect. People have made up their mind about Godus.
To me, a big problem here isn't just about reputation.
To me a big part is that the core features in Godus currently are either lacking our outright broken.
It will be essential to resolve those. And if too much is altered from the game that would mean that either the current combat update would need *another* makeover to fix the inconsistencies or the options would be limited.
My recommendation here is to either keep the Combat Update 'bare bones', or to suspend development for the moment.
Instead shift attention to the core features.
What are the foundation pillars that Godus *NEEDS* to reach any of the features that are considered essential to the design.
One of the things mentioned is "God of Gods" - it did not go unnoticed to me that the article states that this feature is not legally required (confirming my thoughts on the nebulous legal hold that a kickstarter pledge represents...)
But to stay on the positive side - it'll be important to see what CAN still be delivered.
And to deliver those things its essential that some core features be restored.
As I said above, my two concerns are AI and a resource base.
A lot of the follower movement in Godus leaves things to be desired. And whether it is the actual moving around of the followers or a more engaging element like combat.
Its going to be key to ensure that the AI works well.
If the game slogs down to a crawl at 2000+ followers on a decent computer then thats gonna leave a lot of problems. And as someones 'empire' grows that pathfinding issue is gonna be more and more problematic.
I still believe that giving the player some more control by allowing the placement of roads is a good alternative solution that does not take up loads of processing power.
But there are many ways to skin this cat.
Both the "cards" and later "stickers" for research have always left much to be desired and the gem focus reeks of mobile design that has left a bad taste in the mouths of many a PC gamer.
On top of that the apparent creation out of nothing still seems odd to me.
One one hand Godus tries to lay down a civilization with needs yet on the other it creates out of nothing and followers don't starve or die?
It'll be essential to lay down some ground rules to work off of and rework where necessary.
Afterall, an army won't march on an empty stomache.
These are merely my own concerns. I'm sure that the remaining 22cans developers have their own thoughts on what is or isn't feasible or important.
And I'm similarly sure that other backers and supporters have their thoughts on these issues.
But it remains, a solid foundation is going to be essential moving forward and that may mean going back and mending some broken bones BEFORE building from the ashes.
I hope that some of my suggestions can be of assistance, and I hope to see the candor as displayed in the article maintained going forward.
It'll be nice to see some ground rules and boundaries of what we as backers and supporters can expect going forward.
And from there on I'll be interested to see what will be salvaged from this project.
I wish all of you the best and I'm looking forward to some updates with regards to the content we can be expecting.
PS. I think I'm not alone in saying that despite the improvements made to date. v1.3 still holds many features which are superior to the current iteration of Godus.
It'll be amazing to see the best of both worlds merge.
~Danjal
Crowdfunded and Early Access projects rely in large part on their community feedback.
If Phillips is true in his claims that he wants to salvage things its going to be necessary to keep talking and with that in mind its going to be key to lay down how much they are willing and able to take on community feedback.
With that in mind it is also going to be essential that the previous two points are laid out as to avoid feedback that is essentially either redundant or out of bounds.
This is where we see the lie behind the words...
Communication is something we have been screaming for, and instead we get locked away in subthreads.
Danjal your post which attempts to adress the problem doesnt deserve to be marginalized by tacking it too the anger I am spewing, merged and hidden away..
This is the sort of issue I brought up back when the Combat feature was being discussed over there. Tacking on a new feature, regardless of how good it may be, is not going to eliminate the fundamental flaws in the base game design that need to be addressed. Every feature added before fixing these flaws only makes the task of fixing them that much harder.
We still don't have a serious idea of what to expect. Telling us combat is coming late summer isn't a plan, it's a status report...