The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

The Elder Scrolls V: Skyrim

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As a modder, your not helping us by paying.
To all people who think this is a good idea:

You should stop thinking your actually helping us by supporting this crap.

By making mods paid, your destroying the cooperation that leads to EVERY great mod being created.

Do you really think people will want to help out a fellow modder if he is getting money for your work?

Do you really think any large team of people will be able to band together for a pittance of money?

Not to mentioned the blantant plagiarism between modders thats happening right now, people using assets and stuff that dont belong to them. If a mod is free, people are willing to share their assets with another free mod, if money comes into the scene, everyone just "closes" up their stuff in fear of being stolen from

Heck, even with "free" assets there is already alot of "fights" that happen due to someone using someone else's stuff without their permission.

Putting money on the table just makes those things go up to 11.

By giving out money to these people who call themselves "Modders" (seriously, there are some who are charging for a pathetic mesh) your helping destroying the mod enviroment that allowed all the massive mods (and TCs) to happen.

Take a look at The Sims 2 and The Sims 3, the SAME THING happened there.

Sims 2 has tons of mods and some very impressive ones, The Sims 3 (due to monetization) was reduced to clothes mods & house mods.

Not only it scared away alot of people from even trying to mod The Sims 3 but it also created this "market" where only small teams (of 1 to 3 people) worked on a mod. I guess you can see how much 3 lone people can acomplish...

I also had more personal examples in the Baldur's Gate modding community, where *some* folks wanted to charge for their mods and in turn died out because no one was willing to help people who wanted to profit from your help.

No modder will want to work on something that:

A) Can be easily stolen and profited upon

B) Doesnt have a community that can help him out

C) Cant even get proper credit for the stuff they did

So please, dont support the people who are destroying our community, your not helping youself, your making people abandon the community (and thus less modders around) and your just stimulating the douches who just want a PATHETIC profit on it, the very same people which will take the easier way out to get money.

Donations are the way to go (altho i dont even accept them for the NPC Project in BG1, for example).

Donations also bypass the need for any quality control and any obligation the modder has to have with the players.

You guys cannot seriously expect any modder to provide the same kind of support and on-time schedule than a proper company

Giving out money and expecting "good mods to come out in dozens" is just utopia, it would require alot of people working on them and as i mentioned before, nobody will want large teams due to the pathetic excuse of a payment ANY skyrim modder is getting right now.

So again i plead that you dont support this and specially rethink about it if you initially thought this would be to our benefit.

EDIT:

And even after all of that, the modders who get paid here on steam arent paid in "real" money, but Steam Wallet "money".

Imagine if the company you work with didint paid you in real money but "tickets" with a value that allowed you to buy their own products or convert said ticket into real money but losing part of its value in the process.

A real life example would be Money Scrips:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Company_scrip

A practice that ended (at least in most places) in the last century

Thats exactly what happens here, but with "at the very least" the possibility of turning that "Steam money script" into real money, albeit at a loss.

So yeah, if you say this is a profession, i say this is almost slave labour.

----




EDIT: i had to put this in my OP:

Btw, i just find it funny that out of all current mods for sale, only 3 arent "Clothes & Houses" mods.

Yep... surely doesnt sounds like The Sims 3 all over again... surely it doesnt...

Also, i have to give this guy the scam prize:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=429526712&searchtext=

"NOTE: At this moment, it contains only 2 pieces (Dress and Shoes). A lot of additional pieces are being in the works and they will become available soon."

Seriously... hes selling a half made COSTUME MOD?! I mean... woah...
Last edited by General Plastro; Apr 25, 2015 @ 1:03pm
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Showing 1-15 of 209 comments
Blaze_The_Raptor Apr 24, 2015 @ 8:05am 
O Captain! my Captain! +1
General Plastro Apr 24, 2015 @ 8:06am 
As someone on Loverslab said:

"All the folks who are selling their stuff on steam are just like cheap %$#% who shame all of us by accepting a pathetic amount of money in exchange of destroying the very same enviroment that helped them out in the first place"
Last edited by General Plastro; Apr 24, 2015 @ 9:17am
SnakeEyes Apr 24, 2015 @ 8:09am 
+1 post OP


i made a separate post earlier (below), but think it goes perfectly with what you have said here.


This will destroy different mods working together
Do you honestly think modders looking to get paid are going to pay for and download the 50+ other most popular mods to ensure their mod works together with them? One of the most important aspects of Skyrim modding is ensuring your mod works with others. Now modders will develop their mod to work with vanilla Skyrim and that's it.

The end users will be lucky to get a compilation of mods that work together seamlessly...
Vampaerr 6 Apr 24, 2015 @ 8:17am 
This is another way for Valve to make money from us, just like with micro transactions. The always get a cut and in this particular case 75%
As a modder myself I completely disagree with paid mods.
If you want to support a modder, just donate and say thanks, that is all.. no need for Valve to be involved in the modding community at all. :angryeets:
SnakeEyes Apr 24, 2015 @ 8:19am 
Originally posted by Vampaerr:
If you want to support a modder, just donate and say thanks, that is all.. no need for Valve to be involved in the modding community at all. :angryeets:

this x 1,000

爛屎 Apr 24, 2015 @ 8:25am 
bless this post, +1
Morpheus Apr 24, 2015 @ 9:12am 
true words!
General Plastro Apr 24, 2015 @ 9:13am 
Originally posted by SnakeEyes:
+1 post OP


i made a separate post earlier (below), but think it goes perfectly with what you have said here.


This will destroy different mods working together
Do you honestly think modders looking to get paid are going to pay for and download the 50+ other most popular mods to ensure their mod works together with them? One of the most important aspects of Skyrim modding is ensuring your mod works with others. Now modders will develop their mod to work with vanilla Skyrim and that's it.

The end users will be lucky to get a compilation of mods that work together seamlessly...

And thus history repeats itself.

We will only see small scale mods, because those will be the ones that most likely will be compatible with each other (and thus will cause less issues for the modder).

I can picture a pretty bad future for FO4/TES6 modding if this becomes the norm.

I guess alot of people will just abandon modding and things will turn out EXACTLY like on The Sims 3.
Last edited by General Plastro; Apr 24, 2015 @ 9:16am
General Plastro Apr 24, 2015 @ 9:18am 
Again i quote a fellow member from Loverslab

"Somebody wrote here that these cash shops are made viable by folks who represent about 10 to 15 percent of the user base, but they fork out more then 75% of the total money spent in the cash shop.

Let's do some math: I looked at isoku's W&C, it has a 17 to 1 downloader/endorser ratio, let's say one out of 20 endorsers is willing to fork out money for it, now that it became a pay mod (I'm not sure if 1 out of 20 is an optimistic/pessimistic estimate, but let's do some math).

He released his mod like two and a half year ago, that means 66000 endorsement/20 = 3300 paying customer, ~900 days since release, that's 3.66 customer/day = $18.3/day, minus the 75-percent cut of Valve/Beth -> net income: $4.58/day, about $138/month.

Now, if you really need that $138 and spend more than 2 hours every day in front of the computer, fixing bugs and crap, then you are doing something wrong.

Also, I do believe that the actual number of people who are willing to open their purse and buy a mod for $5 instead of some 'proper game' that is on sale are much lower.

A mod is not a consumable product, you cannot sell it again and again to the same folks (unless, of course, if you unsubscribe for any reason, you are forced to buy it again when you want to re-sub). So, in nutshell, I doubt that he will make more than $30 a month from SW sales."

Its funny in a way that Beth/Valve thinks they can turn us into their "pseudo slaves" with this whole policy.

In short, most modders wont even get to make money and the ones who are reasonably famous will make a pitiful amount and even help degrade their position as a modder.
Last edited by General Plastro; Apr 24, 2015 @ 9:20am
Rise Apr 24, 2015 @ 9:23am 
+1
KarvaRausku Apr 24, 2015 @ 10:11am 
It's like paying for another CoD and expecting the new one to have something interesting and new... oh wait...
DDigitall Apr 24, 2015 @ 10:26am 
Totally agree with OP , Steam is the one who will make money out of it . The modders will earn a small amount . ( if they trully wanted support the modders , they would make a donation button ) sry for bad english!
Lars Apr 24, 2015 @ 10:39am 
Originally posted by General Plastro:
To all people who think this is a good idea:

You should stop thinking your actually helping us by supporting this crap.

By making mods paid, your destroying the cooperation that leads to EVERY great mod being created.

Do you really think people will want to help out a fellow modder if he is getting money for your work?

Do you really think any large team of people will be able to band together for a pittance of money?

Not to mentioned the blantant plagiarism between modders thats happening right now, people using assets and stuff that dont belong to them. If a mod is free, people are willing to share their assets with another free mod, if money comes into the scene, everyone just "closes" up their stuff in fear of being stolen from

Heck, even with "free" assets there is already alot of "fights" that happen due to someone using someone else's stuff without their permission.

Putting money on the table just makes those things go up to 11.

By giving out money to these people who call themselves "Modders" (seriously, there are some who are charging for a pathetic mesh) your helping destroying the mod enviroment that allowed all the massive mods (and TCs) to happen.

Take a look at The Sims 2 and The Sims 3, the SAME THING happened there.

Sims 2 has tons of mods and some very impressive ones, The Sims 3 (due to monetization) was reduced to clothes mods & house mods.

Not only it scared away alot of people from even trying to mod The Sims 3 but it also created this "market" where only small teams (of 1 to 3 people) worked on a mod. I guess you can see how much 3 lone people can acomplish...

I also had more personal examples in the Baldur's Gate modding community, where *some* folks wanted to charge for their mods and in turn died out because no one was willing to help people who wanted to profit from your help.

No modder will want to work on something that:

A) Can be easily stolen and profitend upon

B) Doesnt have a community that can help him out

C) Cant even get proper credit for the stuff they did

So please, dont support the people who are destroying our community, your not helping youself, your making people abandon the community (and thus less modders around) and your just estimulating the douches who just want a PATHETIC profit on it, the very same people which will take the easier way out to get money.

Donations are the way to go (altho i dont even accept them for the NPC Project in BG1, for example).

Donations also bypass the need for any quality control and any obligation the modder has to have with the players.

You guys cannot seriously expect any modder to provide the same kind of support and on-time schedule than a proper company

Giving out money and expecting "good mods to come out in dozens" is just utopia, it would require alot of people working on them and as i mentioned before, nobody will want large teams due to the pathetic excuse of a payment ANY skyrim modder is getting right now.

So again i plead that you dont support this and specially rethink about it if you initially thought this would be to our benefit.
General Plastro, you speak the truth. This isnt going to end well, if it does. Ive been a huge fan of the elderscrolls modding community. Im not sure if i want to support modders that want to profit from this.
General Plastro Apr 24, 2015 @ 12:44pm 
Originally posted by Lars:
General Plastro, you speak the truth. This isnt going to end well, if it does. Ive been a huge fan of the elderscrolls modding community. Im not sure if i want to support modders that want to profit from this.

Please dont, out of the current mods behind a paywall the only one thats worth a damn was "made" by someone who doenst give a crap about giving credit to the people who helped him out.

Valve gave him "carte blanche" about using other people's cotent and he took it without a second thought, the #$%@

That *certain* person wont even credit his fellow Nexus member who actually did some of the clothes present in that mod.

And yes, i belive we all know who i am refering to.
Last edited by General Plastro; Apr 24, 2015 @ 12:45pm
NEO Apr 24, 2015 @ 1:25pm 
+1
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Date Posted: Apr 24, 2015 @ 8:03am
Posts: 209