Serious Sam VR: The Last Hope

Serious Sam VR: The Last Hope

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chrix Sep 28, 2016 @ 9:44am
Linux and OSVR?
In recent times croteam has had a very good reputation about cross platform support. Serious Sam VR looks like it's the first step back here. I understand it's not your fault, but the fault of a proprietary VR SDK. So my question: What are your thoughts about open VR SDKs like OSVR? OSVR does have some issues with Linux support, but it's alread in a good enough state to create a port. Are you going to stick with only supporting one proprietary VR SDK or are you going to expand to open ones?

I have read your concern that the OpenGL renderer may not be fast enough, but I personally do not think this should be a reason to not make a port at all. There are always faster CPUs and GPUs coming out.
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Showing 1-15 of 17 comments
madwolf Sep 28, 2016 @ 9:53am 
If SDK supports Vulcan, isn't that preferable to regular OpenGL on Linux?
AlenL Sep 28, 2016 @ 12:25pm 
We do not stick to one proprietary SDK. We support both SteamVR and Oculus. We would support others if we saw a viable use for them. On Linux, the main problem at the moment is GPU API speed. Unless there's support for Vulkan in the VR SDK, it wouldn't make sense to use VR there.
chrix Sep 28, 2016 @ 1:34pm 
Oh, in my mind I mixed together that exclusivity deal and recently some developers pulling Oculus SDK support because of whatever Palmer did this time. My mistake, two proprietary SDKs it is then. :)

For Vulkan support, give a thumbs up and keep an eye on https://github.com/sensics/OSVR-RenderManager/issues/153 It's probably not going to happen before the next major Vulkan version with built in VR features, but who knows.

For OpenGL the problem is that if no developers release games, then graphics driver developers have no real world test cases to optimize.

But then it's nothing I haven't heard before. Back in the day of Oculus' offical Linux "support" I asked the developers of Euro Truck Simulator 2 about Linux and OpenGL support: https://steamcommunity.com/app/227300/discussions/0/648814844007204502/?tscn=1431890543#c620713633858485299

The OSVR SDK does support Direct3D and this so called "Direct Mode" on Windows, so that would be a first step, if you want.

2+ years with VR HMDs in my possession and there is still not a single VR game to actually buy...
Last edited by chrix; Sep 28, 2016 @ 1:36pm
AlenL Sep 28, 2016 @ 2:18pm 
Graphics driver developers can't do much about opengl functionality. Not as it is now. It was possible to do some great perf optimizations, but only with a heavy use of vendor-specific extensions. It wasn't OpenGL anymore. It became apparent that OpenGL needs a thorough overhaul. Thus Vulkan was born. Doesn't make sense to keep beating the dead horse with OpenGL. What's needed is Vulkan VR support, and it will happen. It just takes some time. Looks like we will even prefer Vulkan for VR on Windows - once all the edges are smoothed.
chrix Sep 28, 2016 @ 3:18pm 
Are you saying that OpenGL is inherently too slow, even with all the "AZDO" functionality in OpenGL 4.5?
AlenL Sep 29, 2016 @ 1:53am 
Well, yes, you are right, it's not only vendor-only. Multi-vendor can also be faster (as they tried to prove in the AZDO talks). But that's so complicated... It is possible to make it work fast, but it's putting turbo engines on a bus. OpenGL is just so heavy with all the cruft accumulated over time that was supposed to make it easier to use, which just makes it super hard to use in order to be fast. Vulkan is hard enough to use, even though it's redesigned from scratch. OpenGL just makes it all exponentially more complicated.
Just check the perf on Doom. They had a great programming team, why didn't they make OpenGL version faster? And then their Vulkan version wipes the floor with OpenGL version. It just doesn't make sense to invest too much into OpenGL development anymore. Even our initial "DX11-over-Vulkan-wrapper" implementation in Talos was much faster than OpenGL one on Linux. Investing all the development time into making an even more optimized Vulkan version makes much more sense. JM2C.
Iperpido Oct 16, 2016 @ 6:19pm 
Actually Valve showed off a Linux VR demo just few days ago... http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Steam-Dev-VR-Linux-Demo

So probably SteamVR is going to be supported by Linux too.

Phoronix also said the demo (dota 2) used Vulkan.

https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Kubuntu-Valve-VR-Demo

So... It's probably just a matter of time, Valve is already working on it.
AlenL Oct 16, 2016 @ 9:39pm 
Yes, seen that demo. We will be supporting SteamVR on Linux via Vulkan as soon as it becomes available.
chrix Oct 17, 2016 @ 6:48am 
That is good to hear. Let's hope whatever Valve does will still work with steamvr-osvr on Linux.
Originally posted by AlenL:
Yes, seen that demo. We will be supporting SteamVR on Linux via Vulkan as soon as it becomes available.

This is fantastic!
Gnien.kremfaen™ Oct 17, 2016 @ 10:47am 
Originally posted by AlenL:
Yes, seen that demo. We will be supporting SteamVR on Linux via Vulkan as soon as it becomes available.
You guys are heroes.
Wuffyhumps Oct 17, 2016 @ 11:29am 
Off topic but since there is no store page for it yet, for those of us waiting for VR to become properly standardized or other issues and who are still waiting on Serious Sam 4, any ETA for it? :D
Iperpido Oct 17, 2016 @ 12:09pm 
Originally posted by AlenL:
Yes, seen that demo. We will be supporting SteamVR on Linux via Vulkan as soon as it becomes available.
I had no doubt about it ^^
There's a pretty fair chance I will buy VR just for this. This is the first title I'm excited about.

(Assuming my RX 480 and i7 Skylake run it ok)
Last edited by 🅻🅸🅽🆄🆇🅶🅾🅳; Oct 18, 2016 @ 1:58am
Iperpido Oct 18, 2016 @ 4:42pm 
Originally posted by Kraft Dinner:
There's a pretty fair chance I will buy VR just for this. This is the first title I'm excited about.

(Assuming my RX 480 and i7 Skylake run it ok)
The i7 is far better than you actually need, the RX 480 should be just enough
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Date Posted: Sep 28, 2016 @ 9:44am
Posts: 17