Eco
when do we get trains?!
for real trains are a huge landmark in civilization and from what i hear it was planned years ago but noting happened. mass resource transportation would be nice early to mid game.
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Showing 1-15 of 35 comments
stlyau May 5 @ 4:31pm 
It'd most likely be an Industry level or higher recipe. As such, it wouldn't be early or mid-game.
I could see it being somewhere in the mid-tier range with push carts and some of those hand-pump carts of old. Since most rails are iron, and getting to it is relatively easy, a rail line wouldn't be that unheard of and actually would be nice to move large amounts of material around the map without needing roads.
SLG-Dennis  [developer] May 6 @ 1:28am 
Trains are not a planned feature, but something we'd eventually like to take a look at. There is not much of a realistic chance of that happening before the end of Early Access, though.
Moose May 6 @ 4:45pm 
I want trains too. I remember a few years ago there was a poll asking what we wanted to see next, and trains won. Seems like the devs forgot about it though...
SLG-Dennis  [developer] May 6 @ 7:13pm 
We did not, but people still misunderstand that the poll was not a vote on what we will do, but a survey on what people are interested in the most out of what we already planned to have somewhen in Eco's life as a game, with us being fully aware that some topics will drive a lot of interest but won't be realistic to be done in any mid-term timeframe, especially when several of these come into play, like boats. From the beginning we had intended to add parts of all the different design pillars we have due to the vision of the game. It wouldn't have worked any different way either, given we have a clear game goal in mind and people obviously voted for what is 'especially cool'.

That also included "Bug Fixes" being low on the list with relatively few votes compared to trains and boats. I'm very sure that is not the sentiment the majority of the actual players share, though. Also, obviously the features more about our meta-game of society simulation were naturally low voted, despite being very important for the game concept we want to build and promised on kickstarter.

We hence had decided to replace that page with our Eco Tree, as while the information we got from that was extremely useful for development, players did not understand our intention as we had it. (Which very likely is to be faulted majorly on how we communicated it as well, but once it gone wrong, there was no way to fix it anymore)
Last edited by SLG-Dennis; May 6 @ 7:14pm
hygirl May 7 @ 1:13am 
Originally posted by SLG-Dennis:
We did not, but people still misunderstand that the poll was not a vote on what we will do, but a survey on what people are interested in the most out of what we already planned to have somewhen in Eco's life as a game, with us being fully aware that some topics will drive a lot of interest but won't be realistic to be done in any mid-term timeframe, especially when several of these come into play, like boats. From the beginning we had intended to add parts of all the different design pillars we have due to the vision of the game. It wouldn't have worked any different way either, given we have a clear game goal in mind and people obviously voted for what is 'especially cool'.

That also included "Bug Fixes" being low on the list with relatively few votes compared to trains and boats. I'm very sure that is not the sentiment the majority of the actual players share, though. Also, obviously the features more about our meta-game of society simulation were naturally low voted, despite being very important for the game concept we want to build and promised on kickstarter.

We hence had decided to replace that page with our Eco Tree, as while the information we got from that was extremely useful for development, players did not understand our intention as we had it. (Which very likely is to be faulted majorly on how we communicated it as well, but once it gone wrong, there was no way to fix it anymore)
you know what im literally 100% satisfied with this response, its just not in the books for right now but it isnt completely off the table for the future. i still love the game as it is and it doesent bum me out because it doesent have trains yet and thats ok. im just glad to know the dev team hasn't forgotten about it
SLG-Dennis  [developer] May 8 @ 11:41pm 
No, we didn't. It would be pretty hard to, as all the features that were on the poll page were things we picked ourselves for what we would ultimately like to see in Eco at some point during or after Early Access. And if we can, we'd love to have it all.
Trains are fine, though I'd go for cable cars.
hygirl May 9 @ 9:54pm 
Originally posted by HeikoFennec:
Trains are fine, though I'd go for cable cars.
yeah i could go for this too itd help with mining copper in the mountains or crossing continents building road slopes up a mountain take a bit of effort and itd be nice to have a sort of ore tram bucket interchangeable for a people tram as well thatd be cool
hygirl May 9 @ 9:58pm 
Originally posted by HeikoFennec:
Trains are fine, though I'd go for cable cars.
wait you mean like California San Francisco cable cars that are on rails... nah i think trains are still the way to go cable cars just complicates the whole rail train system and would only be useful for servers with lots of people ive only ever played alone
they can't finish unnecessary boats (cause there is no real need for them) and you ask even more unnecessary trains
people want them just for the sake of extra skin of stockpile
in reallity if you want them be gameplay-viable you need to rebalance at first movement speeds (imagine halving speed on foot and on any wheels in wilds and even weight transport can carry - no one want THAT...it is unnecessary...but boats and trains are nice addition just to have around (babies cry not having unnecessary toys)) and at second you need to introduce some need for them (at this point you do not need even a car to sutisfy metalurgy needs, you do not need even a lot of people to finish a game on even highest collab servers (like 4-5 constant players is already enough to finish and they do not care about the rest of players around untill those start to mess around their sandbox) (imagine to have a need to wait untill your stomach can accept more food per hour of real time and you lose calories even for breathing and walking and have exhaustion after spending all calories so you cant eat and cant walk untill next hour (ingame day)...but then you will feel a need in fellow players that have their needs to be satisfied...and you will call it unnecessary and unfun overcomplixification of already grindy gameplay...and people come not to build society here but to relax and unstress themselfs (not to work after real work))

that is why those boats and trains are mostly - dreams to never come true in current gameplay paradigma
sad but true
hygirl May 10 @ 2:35pm 
Originally posted by ScythianUA:
they can't finish unnecessary boats (cause there is no real need for them) and you ask even more unnecessary trains
people want them just for the sake of extra skin of stockpile
in reallity if you want them be gameplay-viable you need to rebalance at first movement speeds (imagine halving speed on foot and on any wheels in wilds and even weight transport can carry - no one want THAT...it is unnecessary...but boats and trains are nice addition just to have around (babies cry not having unnecessary toys)) and at second you need to introduce some need for them (at this point you do not need even a car to sutisfy metalurgy needs, you do not need even a lot of people to finish a game on even highest collab servers (like 4-5 constant players is already enough to finish and they do not care about the rest of players around untill those start to mess around their sandbox) (imagine to have a need to wait untill your stomach can accept more food per hour of real time and you lose calories even for breathing and walking and have exhaustion after spending all calories so you cant eat and cant walk untill next hour (ingame day)...but then you will feel a need in fellow players that have their needs to be satisfied...and you will call it unnecessary and unfun overcomplixification of already grindy gameplay...and people come not to build society here but to relax and unstress themselfs (not to work after real work))

that is why those boats and trains are mostly - dreams to never come true in current gameplay paradigma
sad but true
uuh... what? how did you go from trains are just reskined stockpiles to talking about gameplay grind and rebalancing the hunger system? none of what you said made sense because your reasoning was packed full of hypotheticals in parenthesis about babies toys and walking speed. we have cars because it is part of civilization and there was no need to rebalance the walking speed or the hunger system because when you are driving you are, and i cant stress this enough, NOT USING LEGS TO MOVE. nor would the train be slow whether the ground is sand or stone because you would need to craft tracks for the train to be on anyways. As a result having a train would just be a car that you dont have to steer and would be a constant speed. it would fit perfectly within the game at about the stage just before the steam truck. its a no brainer and quite frankly im not too concerned about boats because bridges are easy to build and oceans arent that big in the game anyways. " (at this point you do not need even a car to sutisfy metalurgy needs," yeah sure you dont /need/ it but it sure helps in the long run for steel production and mass production of other equipment. if you feel you dont need cars vehicles or carts in a game based around the growth of civilization literally go play minecraft then install a mod that only lets you carry world blocks in you hand like stone or grass youll get bored quick i promise. thats why these carts cars and trains are needed is so that you dont have to make 20 trips from one location to another to build the next tier building or a good oil pump location or an ore mine. This is why trains, cars, (and sometimes boats) are wanted because it fits within the games atmosphere of civilization growth, and makes it less grindy. and not just because its another toy thats unnecessary.
Originally posted by stlyau:
It'd most likely be an Industry level or higher recipe. As such, it wouldn't be early or mid-game.

I can see the justification for that, but IRL trains came before cars, at least for any kind of widespread use. They are a steam-engine era technology and probably make more sense being part of the mechanics tree... just with really high costs for materials.
How about experimenting with mine tracks and small coal carts/ore carts? You could use the same mechanics as the normal carts and just restrict the directions of movement to only allow for on rail movement? like when you place them down and you go to position the ore cart everywhere else but on the tracks are red and are not place-able. when moving them they can use the same mechanics of the push pull from the normal carts as well, building track layouts would be possible via block placement and ramp placement. Obviously you could do manual push carts, steam powered carts, or even go so far as to make gasoline/bio-fuel powered carts. they could have little lanterns on them to light up the mine caves, and you could use the same lighting effects as the torches to allow them to work. along with giving them their own fuel storage. you can experiment with these to get an idea of how bigger and better train mechanics would work and give the community a little taste of it :)
Uedo May 16 @ 6:24am 
Originally posted by hygirl:
Originally posted by ScythianUA:
they can't finish unnecessary boats (cause there is no real need for them) and you ask even more unnecessary trains
people want them just for the sake of extra skin of stockpile
in reallity if you want them be gameplay-viable you need to rebalance at first movement speeds (imagine halving speed on foot and on any wheels in wilds and even weight transport can carry - no one want THAT...it is unnecessary...but boats and trains are nice addition just to have around (babies cry not having unnecessary toys)) and at second you need to introduce some need for them (at this point you do not need even a car to sutisfy metalurgy needs, you do not need even a lot of people to finish a game on even highest collab servers (like 4-5 constant players is already enough to finish and they do not care about the rest of players around untill those start to mess around their sandbox) (imagine to have a need to wait untill your stomach can accept more food per hour of real time and you lose calories even for breathing and walking and have exhaustion after spending all calories so you cant eat and cant walk untill next hour (ingame day)...but then you will feel a need in fellow players that have their needs to be satisfied...and you will call it unnecessary and unfun overcomplixification of already grindy gameplay...and people come not to build society here but to relax and unstress themselfs (not to work after real work))

that is why those boats and trains are mostly - dreams to never come true in current gameplay paradigma
sad but true
uuh... what? how did you go from trains are just reskined stockpiles to talking about gameplay grind and rebalancing the hunger system? none of what you said made sense because your reasoning was packed full of hypotheticals in parenthesis about babies toys and walking speed. we have cars because it is part of civilization and there was no need to rebalance the walking speed or the hunger system because when you are driving you are, and i cant stress this enough, NOT USING LEGS TO MOVE. nor would the train be slow whether the ground is sand or stone because you would need to craft tracks for the train to be on anyways. As a result having a train would just be a car that you dont have to steer and would be a constant speed. it would fit perfectly within the game at about the stage just before the steam truck. its a no brainer and quite frankly im not too concerned about boats because bridges are easy to build and oceans arent that big in the game anyways. " (at this point you do not need even a car to sutisfy metalurgy needs," yeah sure you dont /need/ it but it sure helps in the long run for steel production and mass production of other equipment. if you feel you dont need cars vehicles or carts in a game based around the growth of civilization literally go play minecraft then install a mod that only lets you carry world blocks in you hand like stone or grass youll get bored quick i promise. thats why these carts cars and trains are needed is so that you dont have to make 20 trips from one location to another to build the next tier building or a good oil pump location or an ore mine. This is why trains, cars, (and sometimes boats) are wanted because it fits within the games atmosphere of civilization growth, and makes it less grindy. and not just because its another toy thats unnecessary.

If the train were to be released prior or around the steam truck, it would make the steam truck, and the actual truck itself completely useless to many. The amount of resources you'd expect these trains to be able to move and the convenience of that, would have a massive effect on the availability of certain products, which would of course effect the economies, etc etc - Of course, the post you were replying to went into the next point - things would need rebalancing around it.
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