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archmageomega Jul 22, 2015 @ 12:05pm
Suggestions for new lands
In the latest HyperRogue blog, zeno mentioned sending suggestions for new lands. Well, I've been sitting around doodling in the gameboard mode, so here are a few ideas. (For lands. I don't have any ideas for what orbs or monsters would go in them.)

Feel free to post your ideas here as well.

Flower Garden

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486269301

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486269560

Not really much to say. It's a flower garden. There might be interesting stuff to find down some of the paths.

Boulders and Fissures

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486269929

I was thinking that you could push the boulders into the fissures to create unstable bridges.

Wasteland

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486269811

A mostly empty (at least obstacle-wise) area, except for these abandoned towns. Whatever monsters live in the wasteland would probably come out in force when you disturb the town. (You can probably guess I'm thinking of zombies here.)

Islands and Bridges

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486267871

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486268050

I was trying to work out a way of making an infinite series of islands and bridges. I think I like the first style better, but I'm not sure it'd be easy enough to generate infinitely. The second might be, but it doesn't seem as interesting. (I did see a way to use the symmetry mode to make something like this, but it involved using one color as a big island and a second for bridges, leaving the other two mostly empty.)

The Town of Citysville

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486270373

Well, it looks neat, but I have no idea if you could generate it.

Random Interesting Patterns

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486268503

A bunch of straight lines intersecting at right angles looks pretty interesting. They need three colors to distinguish everything, but you only need a few of the third color. I have no idea how to turn this into a playable land though.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486267388

Another collection of straight lines. This time, they just touch in a fairly regular pattern. The three colors are perfectly balanced here. (Again though, no idea what to do with it.)

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486266563

More straight (in a sense) lines. This time, they all just avoid touching. This one actually reminds me a bit of a cathedral for some reason.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=486267101

Finally, some packed circles. The orientation of the green triangles is random since they won't fit together regularly.

(I may have hit a pictures-per-post limit, or at least that's my guess as to why that last picture won't show up. It still works fine if you click on it though.)
Last edited by archmageomega; Jul 22, 2015 @ 12:08pm
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Showing 136-150 of 693 comments
Fulgur14 Aug 25, 2015 @ 3:37pm 
Monster idea; Berserker

Moves two cells in a turn like Eagle (but land-bound), but attacks anything including that can be stunned/killed including other Berserkers.
zeno  [developer] Sep 8, 2015 @ 4:41am 
I like the pattern by zelda0x181e (post #130), and I have an idea for mechanics for it, so I have implemented it. It appears that the pattern shown by Fulgur14 (post #114) has the same symmetry*. I have also created another interesting pattern with this symmetry, which consists of three colors of strips, and occasional lone hexagons which border three strips and don't belong to any of them.

See shots at http://www.roguetemple.com/z/hyper/patterns/

* This means that I can get each of them by coloring each number in the shots above consistently (just as Emerald/Vineyard/Power are all obtained by coloring the Emerald Pattern values).

EDIT: no new lands yet, but you can play with this pattern in the newest patch.
Last edited by zeno; Sep 8, 2015 @ 6:19am
tricosahedron Sep 10, 2015 @ 8:19am 
I like how that 10-cell pattern tiles the plane into strips of width 3 (hex lines), or width 2 (Fire Wall lines), except for those lone hexagons.

A single strip can be reinterpreted as a strip in a euclidean hexagonal tiling (simply assume the heptagons are hexagons), and the set of strips that are orthogonal to a given strip could be mapped to a complete euclidean hexagonal tiling.

I wonder if it's possible to do something with that idea(?).


...on another note:
How about adding bats as enemies? They could alternate chasing you (standard AI), and doing random moves. Their facial expression, an icon above their had, or highlighting could tell you whether they will move randomly, or not. If random movement is too random, they may move in a more deterministic way, e.g. towards you on a non-shortest path.

I think they'd fit greatly into a clockwork level, invasion castle (unlocked with 10 Hyperstones?), or a cave-type land.
I picture bats moving exclusively randomly, but always attacking you if you're within range. Possibly they have the eagle's property where they can move two cells at once, but they can only end their turns on a heptagon.
Fulgur14 Sep 10, 2015 @ 9:00am 
I think Zeno wouldn't implement a randomly-moving bat. One of the design philosophies of HyperRogue is that the world is generated randomly, but once an object is generated, it behaves in a completely deterministic way.
tricosahedron Sep 10, 2015 @ 9:39am 
The standard AI already involves slightly random movement, since there isn't always a unique shortest path (this has a large impact in the Palace level) - the game is by no means completely deterministic.

I agree that bats shouldn't move too randomly (they may move like master strategists by chance). A slight amount of randomness might be ok, I think, but I wouldn't mind a more deterministic implementation, either.
Fulgur14 Sep 10, 2015 @ 9:43am 
Originally posted by tricosahedron:
The standard AI already involves slightly random movement, since there isn't always a unique shortest path (this has a large impact in the Palace level) - the game is by no means completely deterministic.

I agree that bats shouldn't move too randomly (they may move like master strategists by chance). A slight amount of randomness might be ok, I think, but I wouldn't mind a more deterministic implementation, either.

Well, that got me thinking about a movement-detecting monster: makes two moves on each turn, like the Eagle, but if you don't move, it won't detect you and won't move either.
How about a monster that only moves if it's in the half of the screen your player isn't facing? The idea being that it can only move when you can't see it.
Just had a horocyclic land/enemy idea. It'd be a tentacle pit - think Star Wars - featuring a type of tentacle that's infinitely long, with its base at the infinitely-far-away center of the horocycle. The tip of the tentacle is at the edge of the horocycle, and every turn it moves counterclockwise a cell around the edge of the horocycle, dragging as many tentacle segments as required along with it - but this will always be a finite number, and typically not even a very large one.
Fulgur14 Sep 19, 2015 @ 3:46pm 
The Leaf:

The Leaf is a land that is one gigantic leaf. The enemy are the Hypermoths, which have four life stages:

Egg clusters - egg clusters are stationary. They can be killed, but they don't threaten you. Egg clusters are on a timer and when the timer reaches zero, they hatch: this will destroy the cell they are on, changing it into chasm, and spawn a Caterpillar on each accessible adjacent cell.

Caterpillars - Caterpillars can only move on the leaf, they never leave the land. They always move to an adjacent leaf cell, eating the cell they were on and changing it into chasm.
Caterpillars can kill you, but they don't actively pursue you. Instead, they always move to cell with the greatest amount of leaf neighbours.
Every eaten cell will make them grow a bit. After they reach their maximum size, they transform into Cocoons.

Cocoon - Cocoon can be collected, giving you the treasure of this land -- Silk. They are on timer and will change into Hypermoths when the time's up.

Hypermoths - Hypermoths pursue you and they are able to fly. When a Hypermoth gets to a leaf cell that has only leaf neighbours (and no eggs/pupas on any adjacent cells), it will lay Egg cluster on that cell and die.

The Mithril Mine:
Place similar to Dead Caves, but with higher percentage of walls, so it's hard to move through. Miners appear here, and there are also Tunnelers, worms with drll-like head that can bore holes through most walls. Some walls are Mithril Walls; they transform into Mithril treasure when destroyed; this is the only way to get the treasures here.

The Frontier
This is a bleak, desolate place. Usually, only regions close to a Great Wall are accessible.

There are three types of cells: solid ground, crumbling ground that disappears after something steps on it, and chasm. The chance for these three depends on distance to the nearest Great Wall, so the ground grows more and more unstable the further you go. Of course, chance for Treasures also increases with the distance.

The Dungeon
This is a land similar to the Palace with its structure. It has gates and trapdoors like Palace, but its pressure plate system differs.
All gates in the Dungeon are closed by default. They open when something steps on a plate, but close again when it moves away.
The Dungeon contains Boxes that can be pushed around. You can open a gate permanently by pushing a Box on top of the plate. (This would require change in how movable objects like Thumpers work so they could co-exist with another type of floor/wall.)
Monsters would include Skeletons (which would be easier to kill here as you could open a gate and then crush them by moving off the plate), Dungeon Guards (more HP than Palace Guards), Key Guards (automatically open adjacent Gates so they can always pass through and they can be never crushed) and rare Minotaurs who are capable of destroying the Boxes, but they can also hack their way through a closed Gate to get to you.
Fulgur14 Sep 20, 2015 @ 7:50am 
Boneyard
Land with randomly scattered giant bones. The bones are straight and 4 cells long (7-6-6-7 part of Great Wall).

Another idea: Underwater land (looks like featureless ocean) with sparse small islands. The islands contain Orbs of Fish, necessary to explore the rest of the land. The player must constantly look for more Orbs of Fish to avoid drowning.
I like a lot of Fulgur's ideas! :) The Dungeon and the Frontier are my favorites, although the Leaf could surely create some interesting patterns. The Boneyard could be pretty interesting with more development.

The Land Of Giants
This land has the distinction of having its own distinct geometry, and it has its own distinct great wall type to match (the regular type of great wall would look weird on it). This land is based on the "heptagonal game board mode" pattern. Hexagons aren't real in this land; they're merely the vertices on a heptagonal grid. Heptagons are neighbors here; you step directly between them. The player can't see nearly as far here as they can elsewhere, and the hyperbolic effects are felt much more acutely. Enemies here include mice and giants; only the feet of giants are visible, and they take up entire heptagons. Treasures here are magic beans. There might be sublands that explore this geometry in other ways.

The Coral Reef
Aquatic land accessible only from the ocean. This land is full of horocyclic reefs, as with the islands in the Carribean, but the reefs themselves are half water - they have a regular web pattern of water and reef based on this version of Zelda's pattern (with the red cells as reef and the green cells as water): http://www.roguetemple.com/z/hyper/patterns/zelda-114.png The reef contains sharks, as well as amphibious octopi. Deep in the reef you can find valuable hypershells, as well as friendly mermaids (mostly aquatic, but also capable of occupying any cell adjacent to water) who will guide you inwards.

The Celestial Realm
A vast, foreboding, largely empty plain; a counterpart to Hell. There are only two features here: Stars, which are impenetrable horocycles of fire that pulse in and out several cells, and Angels, vast circular beings of fixed radius that move by moving their center. (Ironically, the larger an Angel is, the less dangerous it is, because the more likely it is to get caught on something.) The treasure here is Stardust, and it's only found near Stars - specifically, in the area that they often but not always occupy. Ghosts might spawn here, too.
Fulgur14 Sep 20, 2015 @ 2:11pm 
wonderfullizardofoz's Coral Reef would actually have some unexpected interactions. Due to the way horocycles work, every individual piece of land or water inside it would be finite.
tricosahedron Sep 20, 2015 @ 2:19pm 
Originally posted by Fulgur14:
Monsters would include Skeletons (which would be easier to kill here as you could open a gate and then crush them by moving off the plate)
It's not that simple; you'd have to stun the skeleton first, or it will leave the closed gate unharmed. Unless the pressure plates are very close to the gates (distance 1 or 2), you'd have to:
- place a box on the pressure plate
- stun a skeleton, and push it into the open gate
- step on the pressure plate / push the box away
- leave the cell with the pressure plate

If the Skeleton is still stunned at that point, it will be crushed.
Fulgur14 Sep 20, 2015 @ 2:21pm 
Originally posted by tricosahedron:
Originally posted by Fulgur14:
Monsters would include Skeletons (which would be easier to kill here as you could open a gate and then crush them by moving off the plate)
It's not that simple; you'd have to stun the skeleton first, or it will leave the closed gate unharmed. Unless the pressure plates are very close to the gates (distance 1 or 2), you'd have to:
- place a box on the pressure plate
- stun a skeleton, and push it into the open gate
- step on the pressure plate / push the box away
- leave the cell with the pressure plate

If the Skeleton is still stunned at that point, it will be crushed.

No, I meant you could stand on the pressure plate yourself to open the gate, and then move away to close it.
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