Star Ruler 2

Star Ruler 2

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Tervel Apr 22, 2016 @ 2:55pm
Ancients? How do they work?
Anyone figured out how the Ancients trate is supposed to be well usefull...? You are forced to take sublight engines... so mother of slow expansion. You are towing around you replicators that slowly turn a system into resources for another. So very very very slow start... where is the pay off? Where do the ancient life trait shains? Yes you got insane amounts of ore but that is not really helpfull seeing how ringworlds,artificial planets and ore assistet titans come into the late game. Am I missing something obvious.
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Showing 1-15 of 42 comments
Astasia Apr 22, 2016 @ 3:24pm 
The cheaper hull you build with ore can be grabbed fairly early game. I'm not sure that's worth much though. I'm also a bit confused about where they shine, but I haven't been able to play much. I think their strong point is their buildings with empire wide bonuses. Even though they basically cost a planet each, it probably adds up eventually.

With terraforming enabled they also have the same sort of advantage as Mono, they can just terraform a lot of planets to t1 resources and drop an extractor on it, and profit. Not nearly as much as mono, since they have to pay 70k upkeep, and only get 50% of the pressure, but it's a lot better than other races.

They also have a similar "free defense satelite" system to Nylli, except you can design them and make some really large and monstrous defenses later on, that you get for free, no upkeep.

My issue with them is a lot of stuff simply doesn't benefit them. Like the game I played a little bit of I had an economic material asteroid in my starting system, usually a rather nice benefit for any other empire. Does them absolutely zero good. Nameing planets I think is also probably useless, I imagine they get the +1 labor and nothing else.
Tervel Apr 22, 2016 @ 3:33pm 
I just finished a game because it was not going anywhere. Like it took me several in game hours to get an empire of 5 systems, while the AI was expanding like crazy and the game devolved into me not being able to really conqure them back. And they not being able to touch me with the amount of fortifications built around all my planets.
And me conquring them took forever even for 1 system. Get fleet. Get replicator. Start turning system into my systems. Repeat every hour... Like for having to handicap yourself so much there needs to be something to offset it. Because if I was lets say against a human player its gg.

Originally posted by Astasia:

My issue with them is a lot of stuff simply doesn't benefit them. Like the game I played a little bit of I had an economic material asteroid in my starting system, usually a rather nice benefit for any other empire. Does them absolutely zero good. Nameing planets I think is also probably useless, I imagine they get the +1 labor and nothing else.
<- the whole presure and bonuses missing are kind of a downer as well

Now the only good thing I have seen is the unlimited ore production and the ability to roll in money. Basicly what I did was make every lv1+ planet into core. All of them make money withouth any supply chain. That got me up to +2mil over 2 tier 2s and 3 tier 1s. Then start spaming replicators over every planet(+200k from every replicator over planet and no upkeep).

I have no idea if that is the strategy intended mother of turteling -> replicators everywhere -> roling in money -> wait lategame -> start producing flagships costing 1bilion ->???? -> profit!
Last edited by Tervel; Apr 22, 2016 @ 3:37pm
Astasia Apr 22, 2016 @ 5:00pm 
I think slow expanding turtles are fine, that's the strategy I tend to use anyway. They actually seem like the perfect empire to play as in invasion mode. I'm giving that a try now.
IllyiaSvara Apr 22, 2016 @ 5:41pm 
Your replicators can move by themself they don't need towing.

What I recommened is getting a few pure engine scouts out to scout everything near you. Grab the best resource planets you can with one of your replicators, this gives your economy a nice boost. Plop cores on each of these. If you find a nice production planet plop down some foundaries and refineries as well.
The other replicator use to turn all water and food into ore/basic resource planet as need determines.

When you have spare build a few size 100 miners to boost and supplement your ore income. This is important since making more replicators cost minerals. Being able to on your main production planet to have your ore cost offset by miners is tremendous boost.

When you can grab your third replicator use it to either boost your existing planets or keep expanding. The earliest so far I've managed to grab one is 25 minutes. I believe a third can be got earlier though.

You actually have an incredibly strong economy, you can easily throw out a size 300-500 carrier by 10-15 minutes if you get an average galaxy generation start near you.

They are however a very fiddly race, but seem to be very very strong.

Their ability to produce smaller defense stations for free around their planets allows you to focus more one expansion than defense needs comapred to other races.

Radioactive Apr 22, 2016 @ 11:25pm 
To me, they seem strong. Looks like they could rush fleets and expand quite easily at the same time.

But they also require too much micro as far as I'm concerned. Figures I'd like it I could set replicators to automatically run around and "auto core" and construct a core in the upper left corner on neutral / owned system's tier 1+ and unique worlds, and "auto ore" / "auto materials" the rest.

Correcting some of what was automatically built later according to your strategy or stopping the automation when your needs are met seems less annoying and costly than doing it all manually.
Astasia Apr 23, 2016 @ 2:02am 
Ya the micro seems to be a concern. You have to babysit and keep track of all your replicators and what they are doing. You have to pay attention to when each building is finished and find that planet/replicator and move it to the next planet. If you queue several buildings at once and click through the building complete messages without realizing one of them is "done," it becomes very easy to lose track of them and have them sitting around doing nothing for several cycles.
Last edited by Astasia; Apr 23, 2016 @ 4:14am
Astasia Apr 23, 2016 @ 5:32am 
Actually it seems like they can't terraform planets at all. Made sure the option was checked, they just don't seem to have the ability. So really the only thing you can do with all those food and water planets is turn them into ore/material. I guess that really makes their special weight balancing empire wide ship buildings their main thing.

Pressure is still a bit odd with them. It works, but only for asteroids I guess? Some planets have special properties, like Volatile Minerals adding +1 defense pressure to the planet's resource, if you turn that planet into an ore planet and export it that bonus pressure goes with the ore, but doesn't seem to do anything.
Ydyp Apr 23, 2016 @ 6:50am 
I found that their strongest point is a slow but steady expansion. They can use every planet no matter what it is, even barren ones. They don't realy need to look for water/food to level their planets either as well. Also they don't realy use the pressure system like the other races, they can't overpressure a planet, which costed me in the past a lot of economy due to the penalties comming with that.

Next to that their shipcores also count as posersupply and they generate quite a bit of power next to control. This opens up more internal slots for other stuff to put in then powergeneration/crew quarters.

Also if you realy dislike the sublight and no FTL you can still modify the race and take the penalty on something else then the travel mechanic and keep the ancient trait. But even with all the above I do still think that the ancient trait is a bit costly at 4 points.
Astasia Apr 23, 2016 @ 7:51am 
They don't need to take an FTL, they already sort of have one. They can drastically reduce the mass of their ships, meaning crazy fast acceleration. It's psuedo-FTL with no FTL cost.

Edit: Scratch that, it's not "sort of" or "psuedo." Ancients have the best galaxy movement of any empire, their ships move faster than any FTL system allows. With over 100 au/s acceleration they are where you want them to be before any other system has started churning up.
Last edited by Astasia; Apr 23, 2016 @ 12:31pm
Astasia Apr 23, 2016 @ 10:54am 
Artificial planets are garbage for them. They are stuck at level 0, huge negative income, and their artifical resource buildings don't do anything.
Jurjen Apr 23, 2016 @ 2:15pm 
Thanks for sharing your findings, Astasia! I was wondering about the artificial planetoids and the terraforming bit.
Etgfrog Apr 23, 2016 @ 2:42pm 
Its mainly the ore hulls that benefit them greatly. Ringworlds wont do much I suspect because they dont have native resources and cant be leveled. Shipyards are your friend since any planet with iron or aluminum can be set to work on it. They can rush very large ships almost scary quick. I've found having all food / water planets being turned into strip mines then one dedicated foundry/dock planet tends to be very powerful.
MysticVoid7x9 Apr 23, 2016 @ 3:50pm 
I think ring worlds would be good as a dedicated foundry/dock planet for building what ever from. Just think of how many docks one could build on the thing.
Last edited by MysticVoid7x9; Apr 23, 2016 @ 3:54pm
Astasia Apr 23, 2016 @ 4:42pm 
I don't find their ore generation mechanic to be useful for anything other than powering their forges. It's only one per second, and by the time you are getting into building ships with superstructure hulls they cost like 5k early on then quickly jump into the 10-20k range. A single 1-2k ore mining ship generates ore so much faster than dozens of ore planets. I've been using a 5k ore miner that harvests at 90 ore per second, and that's on the low side because I gave it 10k ore storage so it can eat any asteroid in one trip.

Turn the planets needed to run your forges into ore worlds, and all the others into base material planets to focus on their true strengths. You can make massive heavily armored ships with tiny little thrusters that still move at over 20 u/s^2, or light unarmored ships with 200 u/s^2 that fling themselves across the galaxy like super FTL.
digitcruncher Apr 23, 2016 @ 6:04pm 
I have finished an entire game (albeit on easy difficulty, because I am not good at this game.)

It is pretty difficult for me to give good advice, but I have found a couple of things:

Your early game strength is for colonising T2 and T3 planets as fast as possible. My entire sector didn't have any T2 or T3 resources, so I found myself at the bottom of the ladder quite quickly, even on easy difficulty.

I don't know how the economy works for this race. If anyone can tell me what makes money in this race, that would be great.

The First are a very odd race in that it seems that the *actual resource* is not as important as the *tier* (T2/3 are colonised first, T1 are also generally left as cores, T0 are all turned to Base Materials or Ore) and the *size* of the planet (Good planets can hold two refineries, making 110% efficiency, tiny planets run at 50% efficiency). Ice worlds can also very effectively be turned into ore planets, as strip miners tend to be very expensive to build on other planets (in the order of 300K to 500K)

But what turned the game around for me was claiming the T2 Abandoned City resource in the central star system. Because *size* matters more than *resource* I was able to put 21 refineries on that massive planet (with room for 5 more), meaning that (given 21 Base Materials planets) my planet was running at 680% efficiency. For an ancient city, that means 54.4 Influence and 13.6 research. After grabbing another planet and turning it into a factory planet (16 foundries give 300 labour) and I had all I needed to win a diplomacy victory.

A ringworld, by the way, allows you to build 70-ish foundries (but you can also make it give significantly less mass to your ships, which is an idea I never thought of) which would give about 1300 labour a second, if you have 70 (!) ore planets.
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