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cow99 Sep 6, 2017 @ 5:06pm
templars are a bit weak
compared to the other heroes they arent that great imo. thoughts? seems like they only get strong after colonel rank, whereas skirmisher and reaper get far more kills overall in the course of a game.
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Fringehunter7719 Sep 6, 2017 @ 5:08pm 
There was a similar thread the other day:

http://steamcommunity.com/app/268500/discussions/0/1474221865203927308/#c1474221865203933831

You might find the dissenting view expained in that.
Medusahead Sep 6, 2017 @ 5:19pm 
The thing which is a major turn off for the class for me is that they rely so heavily on melee. But if you overuse melee you can end up revealing countless pods from the fog of war. On top of that, they can't mod their gauntlets or pistol and don't get any special weapons. When you progress towards the end of the game, they can't compete with the aim and crit of the other classes. That's not to say they are useless, but they have some serious limitations.
JiMMy Sep 6, 2017 @ 5:28pm 
templar is GODLIKE, i really enjoy them. 100 hit chance and then go in the last enemies face and parry. you need to adjust to their style.
Kori Sep 6, 2017 @ 5:29pm 
The true issue templars have is that there are no good talents in their trees, until you hit Colonell where you want to have all three of them. Wish they would spread those across the lower ranks.
This and the lack of damage in late game. Otherwise, its solid garantueed damage. Still think they are way better than skirmishers, then again, I would pick any class over a skirmisher...
Scrof Sep 6, 2017 @ 5:47pm 
Are they though? I love my templars, they're very powerful especially early on. Guaranteed hits with momentum on top and a ton of utility later on are just too good to pass.
Medusahead Sep 6, 2017 @ 5:54pm 
Originally posted by Kori:
The true issue templars have is that there are no good talents in their trees, until you hit Colonell where you want to have all three of them. Wish they would spread those across the lower ranks.
This and the lack of damage in late game. Otherwise, its solid garantueed damage. Still think they are way better than skirmishers, then again, I would pick any class over a skirmisher...

You know a skirmisher can 100% stun 2-3 units in a single turn with 100% chance? Give him a hair trigger and some dragon rounds and his dps is insane. You can even stun a sectopod, essentially making them useless.
Last edited by Medusahead; Sep 6, 2017 @ 5:55pm
Drakilian Sep 6, 2017 @ 6:11pm 
I will admit that they are very slightly lackluster without bladestorm, but with it they are invincible DPS machines.

Also, with reaper you never have to worry about triggering extra pods, ever. Literally 80% of the (stupid) difficulty in the game goes away on fielding one of those bad boys.
Kaerius Sep 6, 2017 @ 6:15pm 
People's perception on how good/bad the Templars are is indeed largely dependent on wether they get bladestorm, reaper, both or neither. My first couple of templars got neither. (They got stuff like fortress, sustain, faceoff, and quickdraw).
cow99 Sep 6, 2017 @ 6:26pm 
even if you get reaper and bladestorm they arent the killiing machines you think they are. they simply dont do enough damage later in the game. compared to top tier ranger they suck in damage/turn.
Last edited by cow99; Sep 6, 2017 @ 6:26pm
Drakilian Sep 6, 2017 @ 6:46pm 
Except that's super untrue because of Ionic Storm being a pod-wiper and the Ghost of a Bladestorm templar providing both focus-free bladestorm reacts and a fully-charged ionic storm. They are, IMO, one of the strongest units in the game, comparable only to Reapers, a Sharpshooter with the Hunter's ridiculously OP rifle, a double-tree ranger with the assassin's AP sword and shotgun, and... yeah that's about it.

Their one-shot invincibility (which can be increased substantially when you get deflect and reflect) becomes a meme, allowing them to solo pods without even using any of their abilities as long as you have bladestorm. They START with a better version of oneof the ranger's best skills -
implacable - and they get a better version of one of the ranger's other best skills, untouchable. What more could you possibly ask? I started a legendary playthrough with a templar and it made the whole thing into a joke, and the best part is that he was a ♥♥♥♥♥♥ templar! He didn't have bladestorm (the most important skill), Fortress (slightly less important) or even Reaper! (I don't really like reaper but i'll accept it), but he still kicked ass!

Consider it this way: The templar provides

1: Guaranteed damage. His melee attack will never, ever miss. Not even on bladestorm (overwatch) attacks. Guaranteed damage in a game dominated by layer upon layer of honestly off-putting RNG is automatically insanely good. It's why you bother to field Grendiers when they have the accuracy of a blindfolded child swinging away at a wall he thinks is a pinata. It's why anyone with even the slightest bit of sense takes combat protocol over the garbage that is healing protocol.

2: Guaranteed avoidance of damage. He can take any one hit after attackin. ANY one hit. Leave him out of cover, put everyone else in cover and when you're fighting a pod, focus down all the weak units on the pod. Leave the strongest one alive (unless it's a sectopod), because you don't have to worry about it. It's going attack your completely helpless, vulnerable, meaty, flanked templar. *Sarcasm*. The templar can completely nullify any one unit on the enemy team just by existing, and it can also one-shot a lot of enemies even at endgame legendary difficulty.

3: Big damage, big AOEs. Ionic storm is insane, Ghost can help you double down on your AOEs and the waves from the rend attack have their damage determined as a function of your focus (I think it was 2+ your current focus, or 2x your current focus, not sure though). On top of destroying cover, when comboed with Reaper you can, again, wipe out an entire pod as long as you use a grenade to soften it up a little. As well as that, the Reaper chain will give you Focus you can use on a final attack that will NOT have its damage reduced by Reaper (I.e Ionic Storm, Volt, Ghost, Invert, Amplify, etc.)

And there's more. I just can't believe you would say they're weak when you're comparing them to the abject garbage that is the Skirmisher, the wanna-be ranger with the low damage whose best possible skill is tactical rigging, so that he can get used to his role of throwing mimic beacons while the rest of the team is killing aliens.
Last edited by Drakilian; Sep 6, 2017 @ 6:47pm
Kori Sep 6, 2017 @ 6:49pm 
Originally posted by Medusahead:
Originally posted by Kori:
The true issue templars have is that there are no good talents in their trees, until you hit Colonell where you want to have all three of them. Wish they would spread those across the lower ranks.
This and the lack of damage in late game. Otherwise, its solid garantueed damage. Still think they are way better than skirmishers, then again, I would pick any class over a skirmisher...

You know a skirmisher can 100% stun 2-3 units in a single turn with 100% chance? Give him a hair trigger and some dragon rounds and his dps is insane. You can even stun a sectopod, essentially making them useless.

Hair triggers are random, your 100% chances do not appear in my game, and I assume its just half cover we are talking here. They are ranger wannabes with the lack of the fitting skillset in my opinion. Everything about that class feels weird and not well fitted together, as if the class itself doesnt know what it wants to be.
Harmania Sep 6, 2017 @ 7:00pm 
Originally posted by Kori:
Originally posted by Medusahead:

You know a skirmisher can 100% stun 2-3 units in a single turn with 100% chance? Give him a hair trigger and some dragon rounds and his dps is insane. You can even stun a sectopod, essentially making them useless.

Hair triggers are random, your 100% chances do not appear in my game, and I assume its just half cover we are talking here. They are ranger wannabes with the lack of the fitting skillset in my opinion. Everything about that class feels weird and not well fitted together, as if the class itself doesnt know what it wants to be.
I believe he's referring to the mid-tier Ripjack having a 100% stun chance.
SkyLance Sep 6, 2017 @ 7:07pm 
Templar is impacted more by difficulty setting than any other class.

On veteran and normal they are demi-gods, but above those difficulties they're strengths are curbed sharply due to several reasons, the big one being armour.

It's why everyone seems to be so devided over the Templar, with some insisting their the most OP class in the game, and others insisting they are average or weak. Certain skills like bladestorm also serve to devide opinions on whether they are good or bad.
Last edited by SkyLance; Sep 6, 2017 @ 7:09pm
thrax7545 Sep 6, 2017 @ 7:10pm 
All the new classes are awesome honestly, once you figure out how they want to be used.
Drakilian Sep 6, 2017 @ 8:25pm 
Originally posted by SkyLance:
Templar is impacted more by difficulty setting than any other class.

On veteran and normal they are demi-gods, but above those difficulties they're strengths are curbed sharply due to several reasons, the big one being armour.

It's why everyone seems to be so devided over the Templar, with some insisting their the most OP class in the game, and others insisting they are average or weak. Certain skills like bladestorm also serve to devide opinions on whether they are good or bad.

I'll just repeat that I'm playing on legendary here.
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XCOM 2 > General Discussions > Topic Details
Date Posted: Sep 6, 2017 @ 5:06pm
Posts: 80