Achievements needs improvement, badly

[Alexis Jedian]

With end of early access, "Developer's Rage" achievement was removed from the game, which is good. I checked the list and I think remaining achievements still require improvement (or should be removed completely). Here's my thoughts:

That all you got? (finish the first level in SE without damage)
Jumping is overrated (finish the first level in SE without jumping)
Too serious for weapons (finish a level in SE using only a knife)
Guns are seriously useless (finish two levels in SE with knife)
Who need kills, anyways? (finish the first level of SE with less than 8 kills)
I start to think, whoever made those never passed the first level at all. All of them require complete the first level of The Second Encounter with some stupid restrictions. They not show any creativity, just require replay the same level over and over again. They should be removed.

Impossible (survive a certain amount of time with 1 HP)
Whoever made this, should be shot at place, really. Poor name, poor description and it can be done on the first level, AGAIN. Should be removed.

There used to be alligator pit here (find a “secret” place)
Another good example of Alligator Pit's laziness. They didn't ever bother to make anything. They just used the beta version leftovers and put their name on it. Should be removed.

Mine Trap (kill 100 monsters with mines)
Friendly Mine Trap (kill 50 players with mines)
The Minelayer is a joke weapon. It's only appear once in the entire game (The Land of Damned, not counting The Bright Island) and have lack of ammo. This leads to unnecessary grinding of the last level, The Grand Cathedral.
Same for multiplayer. It's spawning only in one map (CTF-Eclipse) and, as you know, SS:R multiplayer isn't in best shape right now. The only way you can get this achievement is playing with friend.
Both should be removed or AT LEAST halved in required amount of kills.

Serious Killer (kill 500 players)
Same for this one. Admit that, there's not that many people, who play DM in this game.

Stop jumping! (kill 5000(!) frogs with the chainsaw)
Another day, another grind. The only place where you can find so many frogs is The Pit, obviously (because FE doesn't have the chainsaw). Amount of kills should be around 1000-2000, no more.

I'm really hope the current development team will do something about achievements. Those I mentioned is a good example of lack of imagination and creativity from Alligator Pit. If the game desperately needs achievements, at least put some effort to make them interesting. Those are not interesting or funny. They're boring and grindy.

[erc493]

if they really removing all these achievments then SSCR have to few achievments, they need to replace the achievments like kill 250 enemies with shotgun or kill 500 enemies with a minigun like the SS Fusion achiemvents or more survival achviements not only the christmas map

[Mr. Beartato]

In my honest opinion these achievements are not problematic at all, grinding them takes like 2 seconds. There's far worse ones out there. I think the base SS games have far worse, more grindy ones.

By your standards I think most modern game would have to remove several achievements.

That being said, I don't really care either way - they're not particularly bad. I thought the level 1 ones were more creative than most...

[クズハモン]

I agree, the achievements are very lazy and uninspired.

[Alexis Jedian]

Originally posted by Mr. Beartato:

There's far worse ones out there. I think the base SS games have far worse, more grindy ones.

Yeah, that's true. First one has 35 achievements and almost 20 of them all about DM mode. Kill 500 players, win 1000 battles etc. Almost all of them grindy as heck and you can't just get them all by playing with friend, because some of them require at least 4 players. And I'm not talking about random people. FE:HD multiplayer wasn't good back then and as good as dead right now, in my opinion.

SE:HD isn't better. It's has 70 achievements and around 50 of them about multiplayer. Yes, it's have game modes other than DM, but guess what, nobody play it, especially this days.
I'm not saying SS:HD is bad or something, CroTeam present it as something mindblowing and we all must spend life playing it.

BFE and Fusion in better position, I guess. Almost all achievements about single player and easy to get (unlike "kill 5000 frogs"). Fusion just put them all together, which is alright by me.

Originally posted by Mr. Beartato:

I thought the level 1 ones were more creative than most...

The problem is they all restricted to one particular level.
I'm OK to complete the level without jumping or killing anyone, but not by playing same level over and over again.
Finish the level with less than 8 kills? There's The Sacred Yard's "geek portal", which allow you to accomplish that. It's good combination, since you can't figure it out without reading walkthroughs.
...Actually, all of those "level 1 achievements" can be done in The Sacred Yards as well, I think. Still, if they want to make something creative, don't stricted it to one level. Let me choose where I want to done that.

Originally posted by Mr. Beartato:

By your standards I think most modern game would have to remove several achievements.

First of all, I'm not comparing SS:R with modern games when I wrote that. I know, that some of them have stupid achievements, and honestly, I'm not surprised at all.
And second, I re-read my SE:HD section and realise that I almost described modern live-service games, lol.

[Darkblue]

Good submission. I agree with some of your points, especially regarding grindy achievements and pointless ones. But there are some achievements that to me are just like, eh, not much of a problem to complete. In other words, easy to complete, but are rather pointless.

That all you got? (finish the first level in SE without damage)

This one is alright, I think. It's rather easy, and when I completed it on first try I was surprised myself by how brief it was. Enemies are predictable in this game, and their spawn points are fixed. But I can see why it's not desirable to a lot of people who don't wanna save & load and rinse and repeat.

Jumping is overrated (finish the first level in SE without jumping)
Too serious for weapons (finish a level in SE using only a knife)
Guns are seriously useless (finish two levels in SE with knife)
Who need kills, anyways? (finish the first level of SE with less than 8 kills)

Yep, these are all ridiculous. Finish with less than 8 kills? How is that supposed to work? I've been playing this game for like, since 2002 as a kid and it's never been a stealth game where you can make it through a level by just 8 kills. Salute to those who achieved these feats but man, these achievements should be removed.

Impossible (survive a certain amount of time with 1 HP)
Whoever made this, should be shot at place, really. Poor name, poor description and it can be done on the first level, AGAIN. Should be removed.

This one is easy to complete, but yes, it's pointless in my opinion. I mean what's the point of decreasing HP to 1 point and then hide just to get the achievement?

Mine Trap (kill 100 monsters with mines)
Friendly Mine Trap (kill 50 players with mines)

Agree, either removed or reduced in counts. It took me lots of grinding to complete, it took the fun out of the game.

Serious Killer (kill 500 players)
Same for this one. Admit that, there's not that many people, who play DM in this game.

You can use split screen to kill other "players" but the point remains: it's unecessarily grindy.

In short, I agree that the grindy achievements should be removed, or reduced in count. The pointless achievements though, like Jumping Is Overrated, should just be removed straight up (those who have gained those achievements can keep them, of course).

"Discovery" achievements are great in my opinion. I'm OK with the "discover the Alligator Pit" thing, doesn't take long to complete. Pointless, but seems ok, and I really don't care about Alligator Pit to appreciate the "surprise" of this achievement. I feel like "discover the Croteam heads" is much more worthy as an achievement, since they are Easter eggs.

Also, if they really want "cool" achievements, why not just make discovering secrets in a level as achievements (for example, "Discover All Secrets in the City of the Gods"). I'm surprised that these aren't achievements actually. In truth, there's not a lot of achievement available for this game. It's a straight forward game, an old school FPS, can't really go too crazy with the achievements like they did with this whole "no jumping" thing or "knife-only" thing and what-not.

Edit: By the way, which version is better for Serious Sam Classic? I realize that there are a few versions on Steam, all over the place. Something tells me that this is the worst version... When I picked this version I had no idea it wasn't by Croteam. No wonder the game has new problems that I don't remember having previously (like problems jumping out of water, or missing jaguar statues in the South America episodes, etc).

[Darkblue]

Also the "Roadrunner" achievement should seriously be reworked. Ain't nobody got 6 active players to play with. Not everyone can add or gather strangers just to get this achievement.

[Soul]

Originally posted by Monkey:

Also the "Roadrunner" achievement should seriously be reworked. Ain't nobody got 6 active players to play with. Not everyone can add or gather strangers just to get this achievement.

Why would you not be able to gather more people?
There are quite a few groups on steam and discord, etc...
Most of the times if you ask there, people will usually lend a hand.
I got that one with strangers, and we all just got together to get that achievement done.

With this I'm not saying some of the achievements are not bland or boring.
I completely agree with the level 1 achievements, making them obtainable on other maps would be cool.

[Darkblue]

Well, I'm not comfortable with adding strangers. 6 people are a lot to add and to arrange a specific time for one particular achievement. Admittedly it's partly my own fault as it's meant to be a multiplayer achievement.

[Alexis Jedian]

That all you got? (finish the first level in SE without damage)

I don't have anything against this achievement (It just has a similar "level one" description, so it was on the list). The only problem is that you forced to play the one specific level. Yes, the first level is obviously the easiest one, but why they can't simply make it something like "finish any level without taking damage". Anyway, it's just my opinion about this one.

Originally posted by Monkey:

You can use split screen to kill other "players" but the point remains: it's unecessarily grindy.

I got the "Roadrunner" by playing with my friend and we both used split-screen.
Still, you can get 500 kills by just playing with "yourself", but in order to get the "Roadrunner" (by running like an idiot), you need somebody else to "play".
Perfect logic.

Originally posted by Monkey:

Edit: By the way, which version is better for Serious Sam Classic? I realize that there are a few versions on Steam, all over the place. Something tells me that this is the worst version... When I picked this version I had no idea it wasn't by Croteam. No wonder the game has new problems that I don't remember having previously (like problems jumping out of water, or missing jaguar statues in the South America episodes, etc).

Serious Sam Classic have three games - TFE, TSE and SS:R.
The first two are similar to CD-version of the games with minimal differences (like dead multiplayer, since they worked via GameSpy). SS:R is the "fan-project", originally made to promote The Bright Island improve the classic games by adding Steam support, Workshop, widescreen support, etc.
And yes, the classic games doesn't have such problems, which the SS:R had during it's entire existence since Early Access.
Which version is better is up to you. If you want full widescreen, more-or-less active multiplayer (and lots of bugs), SS:R is ok. If you want just to have fun, the classic duo is more than enough.

[Darkblue]

I got the "Roadrunner" by playing with my friend and we both used split-screen.
Still, you can get 500 kills by just playing with "yourself", but in order to get the "Roadrunner" (by running like an idiot), you need somebody else to "play".
Perfect logic.

Yeah exactly, right? I couldn't get the Roadrunner on split screen though because the split screen is only limited to 4 "players" if I remember correctly, but the Roadrunner needs 6. Although I'm not sure what's the point of having 6 instead of, say, 5 players. In most achievements, the numbers actually make some sense as some kind of a milestone (eg kill 5 enemies in a row). But run around with a specific number of people with you while you play? Doesn't make any sense.

Still, to emphasize on my previous point, I don't get why they don't make secrets as the achievements. It's a no brainer. Instead, they make you run around with a knife or have 1 HP for a number of seconds. Makes no sense.

[tim.doherty]

Apart from some partly grindy achievements, these achievements are a challenge and FUN. If you can't work out how to do them yourself, then look up a guide. I thought some might be impossible, then you see where to go, or what triggers to avoid. Knowing what to do doesn't mean you have the skill to pull it off. I enjoyed almost all these achievements you dont' like.

Either use guides, or get better.

This is coming from someone still missing the 100K kills achievement and I am Ugh Zan. So i have some big things in front of me.

But 8 kills and no jumping were fun challenges.

[Darkblue]

Yeah there's a pretty good guide in the guide section but aye man, each to their own I guess. More power to you. I'm here just trying not to let the achievements get into my head and spoil the fun of the game. But for now the achievements don't seem to be working.

[Michanicks]

I agree, achievements are very stupid and uninspiring.

If there is TWO achievements about racking uo weapon kill you can find only once as secret weapon, why that game doesn't have achievements with ordinary weapons as well?

If there is few secret discovery achievements, why there is literally 0 achievement for discovering original secrets?

Why there is like 6 or 7 achievements about beating one particular level (which isn't even very first or very last one!) in game that has 30 levels?

Kill 5000 marchhoppers with chansaw? Why not killing 200 major biomechnoids with a knife or killing 1000 kamikaze with a grenade launcher or killing 9000 beheaded rocketeers with serious bomb, it would be stupid and illogical as well. Why 5000? Why marshhoppers? Why chainsaw? What the point?

Kill 100001 enemies? Do devs even know how many enemies in their games? Even beating both encounters 4 times in the row is not enough to obtain that acheivement!

Co-op and multyplayer achievements are utter crap for any achievement hunter, no exception, and half of the achievements in that half dead game are requiring other players to play with.

I'm so glad i care much less about achievements now, because otherwise i would rip my hairs out in frustration. Yet i am still dissapointed over that mess.