steam with wayland is real?

[bobebubab]

Thanks

[BurritoBazooka]

Bump. I'm looking for info about this also. I'd like to know whether anyone has successfully been able to run Steam and games on Steam for Linux under Wayland (instead of X).
If Valve wants to make Steam compatible with Wayland, do they actually have to do that, or will it be a seamless, drop-in solution?

[towo01]

There is no support for propritary drivers in wayland, so steam would not make much fun.

[Sodium Chloride]

NVIDIA refuses to add KMS support to their drivers. This is an integral part of Wayland. It does not work without KMS support. Same for fglrx. The Opensource AMD drivers have KMS support though.

[blackout24]

And after that you'd need a desktop with WM/Compositor that fully supports Wayland. Best contender would be KDE but they'd have to move from Qt4 to Qt5 for the Qt Applications which is not that bad, but KWin would have to be adjusted aswell and according to the Kwin dev thats seems to be a rather large effort. So Qt5 is setting them back a bit.

[[LX]ツ CozyPlay]

i would like to get rid of X server.

@NoGood:
im not sure if this is right or if im saying something really wrong but please correct me if im wrong.
When i install nvidia's drivers manualy it asks me to install some KMS isn't that what your talking about?

[matt]

Originally posted by Linux MrTheSoulz:

i would like to get rid of X server.

@NoGood:
im not sure if this is right or if im saying something really wrong but please correct me if im wrong.
When i install nvidia's drivers manualy it asks me to install some KMS isn't that what your talking about?

Nope, it asks you about DKMS:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dynamic_Kernel_Module_Support
KMS is something different:
https://wiki.archlinux.org/index.php/Kernel_Mode_Setting

[[LX]ツ CozyPlay]

whats the reason why proprietary wont use it? would drivers have to be open source to use it or something?

[blackout24]

- Kernel mode-setting. KMS support within the NVIDIA binary driver is needed for proper Wayland support, a cleaner virtual terminal, better debugging / problem reporting, and other features. However, it doesn't appear to be on NVIDIA's road-map at this time. There may also be licensing conflicts with a binary graphics driver implementing KMS for the Linux kernel.

http://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=OTExMQ - What NVIDIA's Linux customers want - February 2011

My dream would be a fully ported KDE with KWin/Wayland and NVIDIA binary drivers with Optimus/KMS,Fermi Overclocking through nvidia-settings like in the old days with Option "Coolbits" "True" in xorg.conf. Right now the only way to overclock newer cards is with flashing a new BIOS to your graphics card.

Kind of miss my FullHD TTYs I get with nouveau through KMS. ^^

[Letalis Sonus]

Originally posted by Linux MrTheSoulz:

whats the reason why proprietary wont use it? would drivers have to be open source to use it or something?

The old UMS used by the proprietary drivers moves the whole hardware handling to the X driver, the associated kernel module is basically just there to make hardware access possible at all. The license of X does not have any restrictions for its driver modules, so they can mess around without caring about any legal issues.

KMS on the other hand moves large parts of the driver to the Kernel, so that there's only little left in the X drivers. On the one hand that means the drivers need a much more complex adaption layer for their kernel-independent proprietary blobs, on the other hand there might be some serious issues with needing some kernel interfaces that may not be legally available for non-GPL modules.

[[LX]ツ CozyPlay]

but if we remove the middle man betwen the driver and the kernel (X server) wouldnt that improve performace alot and would fix the wrong resulotion when booting ubuntu and the TTY wrong resulotion? im not a expert on how drivers work i just follow comum sense, if less stuff is in the middle the less devs have to work on and the less lag stuff speks to each other.

[blackout24]

With a NVIDIA driver that handles KMS you'd have access to your full monitor resolution on bootup. With the upcoming replacement for the Kernel Console called kmscon you'd even have anti-aliased fonts on a full hd terminal if your monitor supports 1920x1080.

How much or if wayland would improve the performance is not clear. I don't think it will be something dramatic if anything considering that gaming on Linux with Xorg and OpenGL is just a fast as on Windows with OpenGL. What wayland enabled compositors will be better at is the reduction of screen-tearing.

[BurritoBazooka]

Thanks for the info, guys :) Looks like Wayland will be the next step for the companies to fully support Linux in the future (since Canonical and others have been hinting of supporting Wayland officially).

[[LX]ツ CozyPlay]

not really, rumor has it canonical is going to build theyr own display server :/

[BurritoBazooka]

Originally posted by Linux MrTheSoulz:

not really, rumor has it canonical is going to build theyr own display server :/

Crap. So much fragmentation.

[blackout24]

Originally posted by Linux MrTheSoulz:

not really, rumor has it canonical is going to build theyr own display server :/

No they won't. 1. It was just a random comment by Jono Bacon who is community manager and has no dicision making power. 2. They don't have the manpower and talent.

They actually denied this comment themself.