The AI needs a lot of work.

[plc.reboot]

Watching these morons walk half way across the map to swing a pick one time then walk all the way back to eat some thing then walk all the way back again to swing the pick a second time then walk back to go the sleep, is something that's only funny the first time.

We need the AI to consider travel time. It's not rational for someone to start a 2 hour walk to do a job when it's 1 hour until bedtime. It's not rational for someone to walk half way across the map to mine something, then they can't carry it back because someone else (who is on the other side of the map) reserved it. It is not rational for someone to harvest one plant, carry the 10 items back to storage, then walk back and harvest more plants. They should harvest/mine/whatever until all of the mining/harvesting is done, or until they at least have mined/harvested as much as they can carry.

We need to be able to set inventory levels in storage containers.
I want to be able to have a few first aid kits in every bedroom. There is no 'clean' way to do this right now.
I want to be able to have a mining outpost. The mining outpost needs to have food so the miners won't keep running back to the main camp to eat. I could add kitchens, etc, but why not be able to add a shelf that holds a set number of emergency rations? Part of the 'delivery' system would include maintaining the level of those supplies. The miners could mine until the mining is done, and then you change their beds back to home base and they return.

[LeftPaw]

The happiness system needs a lot of work. It's bonkers as it is.

[JeanDeaux]

Publicado originalmente por LeftPaw:

The happiness system needs a lot of work. It's bonkers as it is.

Are you reading their bio's to see what specific food and activities each survivor likes or are you just doing stuff and expect everyone to be happy? I'm guessing the latter.

[JeanDeaux]

Publicado originalmente por plc.reboot:

Watching these morons walk half way across the map to swing a pick one time then walk all the way back to eat some thing then walk all the way back again to swing the pick a second time then walk back to go the sleep, is something that's only funny the first time.

We need the AI to consider travel time. It's not rational for someone to start a 2 hour walk to do a job when it's 1 hour until bedtime. It's not rational for someone to walk half way across the map to mine something, then they can't carry it back because someone else (who is on the other side of the map) reserved it. It is not rational for someone to harvest one plant, carry the 10 items back to storage, then walk back and harvest more plants. They should harvest/mine/whatever until all of the mining/harvesting is done, or until they at least have mined/harvested as much as they can carry.

We need to be able to set inventory levels in storage containers.
I want to be able to have a few first aid kits in every bedroom. There is no 'clean' way to do this right now.
I want to be able to have a mining outpost. The mining outpost needs to have food so the miners won't keep running back to the main camp to eat. I could add kitchens, etc, but why not be able to add a shelf that holds a set number of emergency rations? Part of the 'delivery' system would include maintaining the level of those supplies. The miners could mine until the mining is done, and then you change their beds back to home base and they return.

Wait, you're the leader of this motley crew of survivors and you're upset that someone went on a half day's trek with no supplies and you're upset with the developer because the survivor attempted to do what you asked him to do? I think you're missing the point here, it's not the AI's job to manage time and resources... THAT'S YOUR JOB. Why they heck do we need you in the game if the AI is managing all of that?

Now I agree it would be VERY nice to be able to manage inventory levels, but realistically that would require a warehouse manager and staff to count, inventory, and keep sorted. As it is, it's just some guy or gal running back and forth as quickly as they can getting stuff from here and dumping it where you tell them to, doubt they're taking the time to actually count them. The quantity each survivor can carry does vary by weight and their skill levels, again a leadership management task to put the best people on specific tasks to best maximize efficiency or build up skills.

If your need to send your people to the other side of the map, then either you haven't figured out a different path to solve your current need or you setup your base in a bad position, again these are your choices to make.

I'm not trying to bash your point of view, just trying to point out that this is a survival managing game, the challenge here is to test your leadership skills not the programmers skill to make decisions for you. I'm thinking your expectations are not aligned with the description of this game.

[cloud_strife]

Idk if people have realised but waking up or being done in a task and having 60%-90% in base sleep/food and suddenly the AI decides to for no reason nope this char is going to bed.
Or going to eat. That is funny the first day of playing but it gets annoying real fast...

Its so annoying that every ingame day I must honestly click GET BACK THERE WORKING...
Micro managing level 100 of 100...

heck i even have to check if the cooking guy/girl can actually/will make food because of bugs with storage system and the stove cooking...

And i am on electricity and got over 20k battery storage tbh

+ over 400 more generating than using in power when this happens.

I also have like 2-3 freezers that has zero items in them.
So space with food should not be a problem

over 1k of grains and same with most green stuff
+ over 300 of meats...

added with the oils and animal fat both over 50

and nothing is broken in any place and cook is only on cook duty.
and the cooking guy isn even tired. this can happen from bed and eating
on something like 2 or 3rd cooking round.
And i have 4+ electric kitchens.
the character isn unhappy, overworked or sick or anything.
now try to 'defend' the AI + bugs anyone?

Oh and i only touched upon the AI+ controll of choosing work ability problems.
Like there is no ability to make a main route so they don't run through a bedroom.
ofc doctor going in to see a patient is 1 thing or fighter or something to kill an enemy/invader sure but if i place an instrument or something
sofa i can make owned by character A but any fun stuff or table
or something to sit and eat? Nope not happening/possible.

So if 2 survivors are having a quarrel problem there is no way to keep em
away/separated when eating if they both are hungry at same time... yay...

want more? Cause there are TONS of things i could say...

[Angryspoon]

Rimworld used to have all these issues too, long walks with one tap of mining and returning to base to eat/sleep. But once they addressed and fixed the issues with the AI and job allocation/distance priorities it certainly didn't detract from the experience, it enhanced it significantly. Why accept that something extremely frustrating should just be tolerated because its a survival game? Taking a meal with them on long journeys and not randomly switching jobs halfway through their work is not that much to ask. The randomly switching jobs for no discernible reason at certain intervals has me pulling my hair out too.

[TALONI]

Constructive criticism of the game AI & management system is good for this early access game. Please be respectful. Many of us posted criticism played like hundreds of hours (for me 777 hours), we want the game to improve because we see a lot of potential.

For example, survivors travel hours to far away worksite while suffer -9 to -27 hunger happiness to mine 10 stone/wood then suddenly remember the need for food is a stupid AI behaviour. (easily fix by write a condition in sub-routine @IF(hunger<50%, eat when travel time > 1 hour, otherwise don't eat).

Disposition of unwanted inventory. I been trying to throw away 5 slime struck on my shelve when switch over to grain fermentation method for antibiotic. No way to get rid of it unless I build a ground storage outside and let it rot away outside. (silly as there must be a better way to throw away unwanted items).

Hummingfly + Solar Flare event is too deadly when survivors start to evac. I have several campaigns that ended in defeat because only a few survivors left vs 150+ hummingfly. (hopefully new patch has some anti-air defence weapons not affected by solar flare).

Looking forward to new patch tomorrow. :)

[Martin]

The happiness system is just broken, you can have someone with 100+ points in happiness and they're still only at 20% fully relaxed, with the best chef food, flooring, bed, big rooms.. and they're still miserable because they have to do some work, it's like looking after millennials.

[LeftPaw]

I know when you send someone out miles away to observe something they need to have the ability to camp out or eat on the job. As it is they get to the plant take one look at it and then come back home to eat or/and sleep.
How many times do your people have to fill their faces? At a glance they have 15 meals a day. Put it this way, I watch them eating a lot more than I watch them working.

[JeanDeaux]

I'm sympathetic to these issues, but as I don't also have them I can't help but think there's a difference in game play. The one difference I can pick out distance, if something isn't nearby then it's not part of my strategy. I'll choose an expedition to collect ore/scrap metal vs travelling. I may travel a bit from the crash site to pick a better base camp and abandon the crash vehicle vs staying there or travelling to collect the scrap. I'll farm nearby vs travel to collect natural vegetation growth. I'll only attack wildlife for food that have come close to camp.

I'm playing Very Hard mode and my survivors are typically eating two meals a day, as they wake and again at the end of the day unless they've broken down and are on an eating binge. Happiness levels are being managed well, though there are still breakdowns; especially after combat or expeditions where they are out of their daily routine. I do give them tasks they prefer, food they like, private bedrooms, etc... all the things to get a positive attitude score; this has worked well for me and was a real problem when I didn't do that.

Anyway, I'm just trying to convey that these mechanisms appear to be working as intended in my gaming experience and that just perhaps you might be missing such an aspect in yours.

[Martin]

Or you're trolling everyone with your lies.

[johnisaroundhere]

Publicado originalmente por Martin:

Or you're trolling everyone with your lies.

+1

You cannot be playing the same game and NOT see an issue with survivors being very inefficient at times.

A simple fix could be something as easy as allowing survivors to carry an emergency ration with them.

[LeftPaw]

Publicado originalmente por JeanDeaux:

Publicado originalmente por LeftPaw:

The happiness system needs a lot of work. It's bonkers as it is.

Are you reading their bio's to see what specific food and activities each survivor likes or are you just doing stuff and expect everyone to be happy? I'm guessing the latter.

Yes, for the thousand time yes. I can keep the melt downs down to 50 a hour by reading their dossiers and baby siting them 24/7. But I don't call that a game. No matter what you do for them they will find a excuse to melt.
And I have seen proof the happiness system is broken. When you get something like +19 well fed and then -8 hungry which sends them into a melt. I have seen this sort of thing many times.
In most cases the numbers or the excuse do not add up, which leads me to believe that melt-downs a RNG thing.

[Martin]

Publicado originalmente por johnisaroundhere:

A simple fix could be something as easy as allowing survivors to carry an emergency ration with them.

This is something similar what what I'd like to see for first aid kits, everyone should carry with them 1 meal and 1 first aid kit if available at all times, then if injured on other side of map and the map is the entire play area, so therefore should be fully exploitable and usable, yet most will die before getting back to camp, forcing use of either the grave.. or reload. I've never heard of anyone going mountaineering, exploring, spelunking etc.. who didn't take some food and first aid with them.

[plc.reboot]

Since we got talking about happiness.... how come sleeping on the ground in a tin shack is happiness-neutral, but standing in a wooden house that doesn't happen to have carpeting is a BAD THING? What's up with that? I, personally, would be way happier to be in a wooden house than a tin shack with only three walls and a dirt floor.

[wiz12268]

Most is 'user' (player) error in a lot of this. But some is definitely AI issues.

While there is a 'priority' list I am sure most player have multiple 'top' or 'high' priorities. Thats the greyish area. WHICH 1 or 2 priority should they do first. Also at what percentage should they eat, sleep, wake up, chill out? Some have definite character listed traits. Many are random. I have watched them eat at 60% go to 100% and still eat (normal meal not meltdown binge) I have seen them sleep and not wake up even at 100% (with NO sleep just 'anything' scheduled). I have seen the relaxed bar stay at 0% for days with multiple hours of anything available and them still not entertain themselves despite having every single entertainment option available.

Managing moods and tensions is part of the game. I dont want to see that changed. Some players shouldnt like each other. Just learn to have them avoid each other. There are pop ups and a screen you can look at to see what the relationships are like. you can choose to ignore them (which isnt THAT horrible usually) or you can try and make it so people with massive dislike arent near each other.

For long distance stuff that should probably be micromanaged (until or if they implement a more concise scheduling system) I think a bare minimum would be to split the day up into morning afternoon night type thing. Where they get up eat, and then go on those longer trips. Or allow them to pack a meal. I am pretty sure when survivors go on balloon rides they take food. or at least seem to prepare somehow. Maps are huge with a lot of area but realistically 95% of it is wasted because of some of the travel limitations. Sure you can split the group, set up work camps but anything gather there can only be used in that area.

I am not sure if anyone has done that (split up their survivors and had two or more bigger camps) would be interesting to see how that affected spawn points of animal attacks.

But with a different game mode and ability to get more survivors I could see that being a nice addition. Obviously some sort of teleportation or transportation system would have to be added to get things across the map. But probably not on their radar or close to being something they might add at this point.