need a calculator to figure out weapon damage lol

[twiggy]

so yeah, i cant actually figure out what affinity does more damage because the game doesnt tell you the total attack damage number, it just gives you the different numbers without adding them up for you.

10/10 game

[Koros Antavo]

İlk olarak Mako Kilo tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Monk tarafından gönderildi:

No its not, the only thing that can change it is if you happen to be holding one of them with both hands at the time, in which case the strength scaling damage boost is increased by 50%.

Why isnt it stronger if i use 6 hands then?

Ask Ranni, she's an expert. I bet she'll tell you hands are overrated, as she can kill you with a single word.

[Buntkreuz]

İlk olarak Jackflash tarafından gönderildi:

It's not an oversight, it's always been this way. Why they do it this way no idea. I also don't think you really have to do the math. If you look at what stats it scaled with and the letter of each stat, then look at your stats, you should know by that which one does the most damage.

But it does get a bit more confusing when weapons have 3 or more stats on it. But either way, two seconds to do two math equations isn't the end of the world either.

Tradition is no proper argument, its just a sign something might have been done wrong all the time.

Yes, it has ever been that way. In that sense the series traditionally maintained a bad design decision by making stats or stat changes hard to read.
Its the same with cryptic descriptions and unclear descriptions.
Like "a lot more damage".

I teach my students to EVER avoid terms like "a lot", "some", "easy", "sometimes" and so on.
They are unprecise, subjective, nonsensical.

All the Souls Games have tons of bad design decisions, objectively bad design decisions.
But ofcourse they keep them, because they are afraid to change too much.

Elden Ring features basically the exact same weapons as all other previous games. Some even kept their skin. Same goes for the NPCs, story elements, dungeons or other things.
Just because it has been that way, doesnt mean its good.


OP has a point and all the other people making that point previously for the other games were right as well.
The way damage numbers are shown is intransparent and clunky design from 15 years ago.
But Japanese Studios cant keep up with the modern technology or design, for some weird reason.
Maybe in ten years when we fight the same enemies and speak to the same NPCs in the 10th Souls game they finally manage to change it.

The games have actually improved in these regards.
Go back to Demons Souls on the PS3 to see what "hard to read" really means.
World Tendency LOL.
Its just that the improvements are small and slow.

[Koros Antavo]

İlk olarak Argentum tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Jackflash tarafından gönderildi:

It's not an oversight, it's always been this way. Why they do it this way no idea. I also don't think you really have to do the math. If you look at what stats it scaled with and the letter of each stat, then look at your stats, you should know by that which one does the most damage.

But it does get a bit more confusing when weapons have 3 or more stats on it. But either way, two seconds to do two math equations isn't the end of the world either.

Tradition is no proper argument, its just a sign something might have been done wrong all the time.

Yes, it has ever been that way. In that sense the series traditionally maintained a bad design decision by making stats or stat changes hard to read.
Its the same with cryptic descriptions and unclear descriptions.
Like "a lot more damage".

I teach my students to EVER avoid terms like "a lot", "some", "easy", "sometimes" and so on.
They are unprecise, subjective, nonsensical.

All the Souls Games have tons of bad design decisions, objectively bad design decisions.
But ofcourse they keep them, because they are afraid to change too much.

Elden Ring features basically the exact same weapons as all other previous games. Some even kept their skin. Same goes for the NPCs, story elements, dungeons or other things.
Just because it has been that way, doesnt mean its good.


OP has a point and all the other people making that point previously for the other games were right as well.
The way damage numbers are shown is intransparent and clunky design from 15 years ago.
But Japanese Studios cant keep up with the modern technology or design, for some weird reason.
Maybe in ten years when we fight the same enemies and speak to the same NPCs in the 10th Souls game they finally manage to change it.

You're wrong.

İlk olarak Koros Antavo tarafından gönderildi:

Ignoring how petty this is, it isn't an oversight because the game already does this for you. When you equip a weapon, its total damage is displayed for you in the Status menu, on the right side. In fact, total damage is displayed for every single weapon you have equipped at the moment, so you can easily compare them.

[Koros Antavo]

Also that status screen is quite useful. You should look at it from time to time.

It shows both total and current values of your hp and fp, as well as all defences and resistances, to all damage types and status effects.

[Buntkreuz]

İlk olarak Koros Antavo tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Argentum tarafından gönderildi:

Tradition is no proper argument, its just a sign something might have been done wrong all the time.

Yes, it has ever been that way. In that sense the series traditionally maintained a bad design decision by making stats or stat changes hard to read.
Its the same with cryptic descriptions and unclear descriptions.
Like "a lot more damage".

I teach my students to EVER avoid terms like "a lot", "some", "easy", "sometimes" and so on.
They are unprecise, subjective, nonsensical.

All the Souls Games have tons of bad design decisions, objectively bad design decisions.
But ofcourse they keep them, because they are afraid to change too much.

Elden Ring features basically the exact same weapons as all other previous games. Some even kept their skin. Same goes for the NPCs, story elements, dungeons or other things.
Just because it has been that way, doesnt mean its good.


OP has a point and all the other people making that point previously for the other games were right as well.
The way damage numbers are shown is intransparent and clunky design from 15 years ago.
But Japanese Studios cant keep up with the modern technology or design, for some weird reason.
Maybe in ten years when we fight the same enemies and speak to the same NPCs in the 10th Souls game they finally manage to change it.

You're wrong.

İlk olarak Koros Antavo tarafından gönderildi:

Ignoring how petty this is, it isn't an oversight because the game already does this for you. When you equip a weapon, its total damage is displayed for you in the Status menu, on the right side. In fact, total damage is displayed for every single weapon you have equipped at the moment, so you can easily compare them.

Wrong.
I recommend to read properly.
I said that the games traditionally make it hard to read or hide information, aka not making them transparent.
You have to go through several pages to see changes.
Some changes arent shown at all.
"Makes rolling more effective".
Cool, doesnt show in the stats page though. Like 80% of the other equipments or effects.
Most tools or consumables dont have any statistics at all. Some are harder to find.
To see changes in one view, you need to switch back and forth.
Why doesnt it show the summarized damage in the main bracket in the middle of the screen?
No one knows.

Generally RPGs work like this:
Direct information is summarized and generalized for an easy and fast overview, mostly directly where you change things.
Detailled information breaking down specific stats or damage numbers can be seen in a separate detailled view you can get by pressing a button.
Souls games do it the opposite way for no apparent reason.

At least Elden Ring improved in a way to show you some direct effects, like how much damage goes up if a "ring" increases a stat.
In previous iterations they didnt manage to give you that info and you had to make a guess.
Elden Ring does far far better in that regard than for example Demons Souls.
But thats a really low bar to set.

[Stechhelm]

İlk olarak Argentum tarafından gönderildi:

Why doesnt it show the summarized damage in the main bracket in the middle of the screen?

because this is not your ordinary MMO ♥♥♥♥.

[Koros Antavo]

İlk olarak Argentum tarafından gönderildi:

Wrong.

I get your larger point. It is true that Fromsoft are allergic to feedback, especially from the PC communtiy.

And yet, traditions are upheld because they keep working, even if their meaning gets lost. In human cultural evolution, tradition is a crucial mechanism of survival, and an inverse of an equally important drive of curiosity. These forces push and pull, to preserve what has worked till now, and to find what will work eventually, all in hopes of reaching a better future.

All the most necessary info you would like to know immediately you can find in the Status menu. Anything that may cause an effect on the stats displayed there, will have that effect properly reflected in the stats, even if it is temporary. You have found a new cool tear for your physick? Mix it, drink it, and observe the effects.

One might even claim that this sort of process of discovering what benefit your gear can bring you is directly in line with the core philosophy of the rest of the game.

[Toki]

İlk olarak Koros Antavo tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Argentum tarafından gönderildi:

Wrong.

I get your larger point. It is true that Fromsoft are allergic to feedback, especially from the PC communtiy.

And yet, traditions are upheld because they keep working, even if their meaning gets lost. In human cultural evolution, tradition is a crucial mechanism of survival, and an inverse of an equally important drive of curiosity. These forces push and pull, to preserve what has worked till now, and to find what will work eventually, all in hopes of reaching a better future.

All the most necessary info you would like to know immediately you can find in the Status menu. Anything that may cause an effect on the stats displayed there, will have that effect properly reflected in the stats, even if it is temporary. You have found a new cool tear for your physick? Mix it, drink it, and observe the effects.

One might even claim that this sort of process of discovering what benefit your gear can bring you is directly in line with the core philosophy of the rest of the game.

I think you're maybe reading a bit too deep into it.

[Koros Antavo]

İlk olarak Arc Five tarafından gönderildi:

I think you're maybe reading a bit too deep into it.

Oh, I absolutely am. I just find it funny that I can say such a thing and not even be wrong.

Fromsoft titles work in mysterious ways. One of their core principles is obfuscation of information. With lore, stats, quests, enemy design, location design etc. Considering their immense success, i'd say they've been pretty good at it so far.

A cardinal sin of going too far with obfuscation has been the agility stat in ds2, which affected way too many things without properly communicating that info to the player. Even I, who doesn't hate the stat itself, would like to at least see it be explained more clearly.

There is nothing on such a scale in Elden Ring. There are obscure stats, like cast speed being tied to dexterity, but these things are obscure because their effect is miniscule, and a player won't lose anything of value if they don't invest time into finding out how everything works exactly.

[socially ept outcel]

İlk olarak richardson tarafından gönderildi:

Technically, even adding the two or three numbers doesn't tell the whole story because the different damage types are resisted separately.

Yeah this is the really confusing part. Also correct me if I'm wrong but isn't defense like a subtractive amount per damage type rather than a percentage? So there is an increased reduction over multiple damage types? I think at least that's how Dark Souls works?

Also this thread reminds me of the old days when the Drake Sword was a trap for those of us who didn't understand the damage numbers... I mean it was good for the start but my dumb ass kept using it way too long before understanding scaling lol perhaps such a weapon would benefit the OP tho since there is no maths to solve

[Koros Antavo]

Defence subtracts damage directly, resistance subtracts a percentage of what's left, as I understand it. Which technically means with enough defence points you can be invincible. But knowing Fromsoft, they probably have some kind of mechanism to let chip damage through.

[Kain]

I might be wrong, but doesn't it show the base damage + bonus related to affinity damage and magic or other stuff and then you just have to sum?

[Koros Antavo]

İlk olarak Kain tarafından gönderildi:

I might be wrong, but doesn't it show the base damage + bonus related to affinity damage and magic or other stuff and then you just have to sum?

It does. You don't even have to sum it up if you look at the Status menu.

[Kain]

İlk olarak Koros Antavo tarafından gönderildi:

İlk olarak Kain tarafından gönderildi:

I might be wrong, but doesn't it show the base damage + bonus related to affinity damage and magic or other stuff and then you just have to sum?

It does. You don't even have to sum it up if you look at the Status menu.

Then I'm assuming the OP wants something more complex than this right?