"Muh Historical Accuracy!!!"

[The Hungry Werewolf]

Yeah, mates, gods totally existed. There were feasts and magical rave parties on Olympus every day. Rain? No, that was just Zeus pissing. You don't know the REAL history. As a certified Greek™ history enjoyer, I can tell you gods really existed and Apollo literally made you by putting wrong genitals on a woman and went "Whoops, guess that's a man now lmao".

[AJYXQ]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von The Hungry Werewolf:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

There's literally nothing, from a cultural context or in any texts, that indicates he's fat or a drunkard. Drunkard literally means you're habitually drunk. You're just pushing nonsense.

No, no. If you drink a lot and eat a lot, it gives you a belly. It's natural. That's it. He was fat and that's completely ok. You can be proud of his lightning belches. And oh look at that, drinking alcohol a lot, especially after battle. That's a drunkard behavior if I ever saw one.

You literally cannot disprove it. History speaks for itself. It's only seen as "bad" in today's weak society of snowflakes.

You do realise that professional cyclists need to consume as much as 5000 - 10000 calories to remain as skinny as they are? Or professional eaters can consume 10,000 calories twice a week and still remain thin? Not really the point, but without any kind of source just a he said/she said argument (not a debate) you'll get nowhere, and that is the point.

[XartaX]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von AJYXQ:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von The Hungry Werewolf:

No, no. If you drink a lot and eat a lot, it gives you a belly. It's natural. That's it. He was fat and that's completely ok. You can be proud of his lightning belches. And oh look at that, drinking alcohol a lot, especially after battle. That's a drunkard behavior if I ever saw one.

You literally cannot disprove it. History speaks for itself. It's only seen as "bad" in today's weak society of snowflakes.

You do realise that professional cyclists need to consume as much as 5000 - 10000 calories to remain as skinny as they are? Or professional eaters can consume 10,000 calories twice a week and still remain thin? Not really the point, but without any kind of source just a he said/she said argument (not a debate) you'll get nowhere, and that is the point.

Pretty much. And now we put it into the context that Thor is created to essentially be the perfect warrior in the context of Norse culture, and you're left looking completely ridiculous if you claim he was fat (or a drunkard for that matter). He's always portrayed as extremely capable in every (physical) way. And all kinds of cultural contexts we got clearly tells us that warriors were expected to be strong and powerful and not exactly of the fat persuasion. You don't get to be fat when you're constantly out fighting and doing hard physical labor (such as rowing from the prior example I showed of Thor scaring a Jotun almost to death due to his physical prowess).

[XartaX]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Alpharius:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Old Surehand:

Stop bastardizing Greek or Norse or any other European mythology, culture, history.

Nevermind the fact that the Greeks borrowed heavily from African/Middle Eastern cultures huh? As far as Norse mythology goes, most of what you know about it, is probably made up hollywood crap anyway. Because in one of the Eddas says that Thor's father was Memnon, the Nubian/Ethiopian king who fought in the Trojan war. So should we make Thor a black dude now? :)

Fun thing is, Eddas aren't an authoritative source on Norse Mythology. It's not a bible. It's a glimpse into the writings of a contemporary poet.

Obviously hollywoodization is dumb, but so is treating every single aspect of the Edda as "Canon" (besides being literally uncomputable due to contradictions of human error and different authors).

You can learn just as much about norse mythology from studying things like Norse culture and archeology and so on. Although the Eddas are certainly useful.

Edit: Regarding Memnon in the Prose Edda specifically, it's not the actual Norse mythology, but rather an euhemerized account. Or in less flowery words, basically an attempt to interpret mythology as a real historical event in the mortal world. Essentially it's a "what if" scenario of "what if the norse gods originated from the Trojans". Probably done to appease Christianity through refashioning the Norse gods as mortals rather than gods, so as to avoid criticism that his works were dangerous to the Christian orthodoxy at the time.

[Ka-mai19]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

Pretty much. And now we put it into the context that Thor is created to essentially be the perfect warrior in the context of Norse culture, and you're left looking completely ridiculous if you claim he was fat (or a drunkard for that matter). He's always portrayed as extremely capable in every (physical) way. And all kinds of cultural contexts we got clearly tells us that warriors were expected to be strong and powerful and not exactly of the fat persuasion. You don't get to be fat when you're constantly out fighting and doing hard physical labor (such as rowing from the prior example I showed of Thor scaring a Jotun almost to death due to his physical prowess).

Uh why do you think the strongest man in the world looks like this: https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-prod/images/thornew-1555065931.jpg?resize=2048:*

Which isn't exactly skinny?

[XartaX]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Ka-mai19:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

Pretty much. And now we put it into the context that Thor is created to essentially be the perfect warrior in the context of Norse culture, and you're left looking completely ridiculous if you claim he was fat (or a drunkard for that matter). He's always portrayed as extremely capable in every (physical) way. And all kinds of cultural contexts we got clearly tells us that warriors were expected to be strong and powerful and not exactly of the fat persuasion. You don't get to be fat when you're constantly out fighting and doing hard physical labor (such as rowing from the prior example I showed of Thor scaring a Jotun almost to death due to his physical prowess).

Uh why do you think the strongest man in the world looks like this: https://hips.hearstapps.com/hmg-prod/images/thornew-1555065931.jpg?resize=2048:*

Which isn't exactly skinny?

First of all, he's not fat. Secondly, even if you do point towards some of the ones you could call fat (like Eddie Hall), they're strongmen, not warriors.

[Ka-mai19]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

First of all, he's not fat. Secondly, even if you do point towards some of the ones you could call fat (like Eddie Hall), they're strongmen, not warriors.

But definitely not skinny, lol, which is the point. You can have strong warriors that look like Hafthor Bjornsson and not like Chris Hemsworth. Hell, I'd argue that Hafthor is a more realistic depiction of what an actual warrior would look like considering he exercises to be the strongest man in the world while an actor like Chris Hemsworth exercises mainly to look attractive.

A fun, relevant gif: https://www.reddit.com/r/bizarrelife/comments/10zm527/whos_next_to_jump_please_grab_these_axes/

[XartaX]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Ka-mai19:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

First of all, he's not fat. Secondly, even if you do point towards some of the ones you could call fat (like Eddie Hall), they're strongmen, not warriors.

But definitely not skinny, lol, which is the point. You can have strong warriors that look like Hafthor Bjornsson and not like Chris Hemsworth. Hell, I'd argue that Hafthor is a more realistic depiction of what an actual warrior would look like considering he exercises to be the strongest man in the world while an actor like Chris Hemsworth exercises mainly to look attractive.

A fun, relevant gif: https://www.reddit.com/r/bizarrelife/comments/10zm527/whos_next_to_jump_please_grab_these_axes/

I never said he was skinny, I said he wasn't fat.

Gif guy is probably pretty accurate to an idealized Norse warrior (physique wise).

[Ka-mai19]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

I never said he was skinny, I said he wasn't fat.

Gif guy is probably pretty accurate to an idealized Norse warrior.

Well, he's definitely more on the side of "fat persuasion" than not, I'd argue.

As for whether he was a drunkard or not, he definitely drank. A lot. One of the most well known stories about Thor involve him almost drinking the entire ocean after joining a drinking competition. He didn't know he'd have to drink the ocean (it was a trick), so he quite simply was confident enough in his drinking ability to win a contest of that nature. Him actually getting drunk I'm not sure of, however.

[XartaX]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Ka-mai19:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

I never said he was skinny, I said he wasn't fat.

Gif guy is probably pretty accurate to an idealized Norse warrior.

Well, he's definitely more on the side of "fat persuasion" than not, I'd argue.

As for whether he was a drunkard or not, he definitely drank. A lot. One of the most well known stories about Thor involve him almost drinking the entire ocean after joining a drinking competition. He didn't know he'd have to drink the ocean (it was a trick), so he quite simply was confident enough in his drinking ability to win a contest of that nature. Him actually getting drunk I'm not sure of, however.

No, fat is contrary to muscle. Someone who is big is not fat (necessarily).

I'm aware of those stories, and far more. Like I mentioned earlier, this is in the context of feasting and it's importance to Norse culture (in the story, he was invited to dine with a jotun). The entire point is essentially to showcase how badass Thor is. You're also misremembering, because he did not drink anywhere close to an entire ocean. This was one of those stories where Thor was defeated (by trickery). After being defeated, the Jotun was amazed afterwards that Thor had managed to actually lower the water levels somewhat. It's essentially an origin story of why we have tides.

[Ka-mai19]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

[
No, fat is contrary to muscle. Someone who is big is not fat (necessarily).

According to modern standards someone like Hafthor Bjornsson would be considered fat considering he isn't ripped and skinny like the average "strong guy" actor or model. He, and other strong men, are bigger and thicker than the "idealized" look that most people assume for a strong man. That's what I meant.

I'm aware of those stories, and far more. Like I mentioned earlier, this is in the context of feasting and it's importance to Norse culture (in the story, he was invited to dine with a jotun). The entire point is essentially to showcase how badass Thor is. You're also misremembering, because he did not drink anywhere close to an entire ocean. This was one of those stories where Thor was defeated (by trickery). After being defeated, the Jotun was amazed afterwards that Thor had managed to actually lower the water levels somewhat. It's essentially an origin story of why we have tides.

This just further proves my point, lol. Thor is such an intense drinker that he got close to draining the ocean by accident. AND created the tides.

[neuralnetwork]

Oh come on, splitting hairs here.
Werewolf was saying Thor is a "drunken fatso" which pretty clearly indicates an obese person. Nobody in their right mind can claim this divine warrior was such.

[XartaX]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Ka-mai19:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

[
No, fat is contrary to muscle. Someone who is big is not fat (necessarily).

According to modern standards someone like Hafthor Bjornsson would be considered fat considering he isn't ripped and skinny like the average "strong guy" actor or model. He, and other strong men, are bigger and thicker than the "idealized" look that most people assume for a strong man. That's what I meant.

I'm aware of those stories, and far more. Like I mentioned earlier, this is in the context of feasting and it's importance to Norse culture (in the story, he was invited to dine with a jotun). The entire point is essentially to showcase how badass Thor is. You're also misremembering, because he did not drink anywhere close to an entire ocean. This was one of those stories where Thor was defeated (by trickery). After being defeated, the Jotun was amazed afterwards that Thor had managed to actually lower the water levels somewhat. It's essentially an origin story of why we have tides.

This just further proves my point, lol. Thor is such an intense drinker that he got close to draining the ocean by accident. AND created the tides.

He is capable of drinking a lot, that does not make him a drunkard. Which was the subject to begin with. I don't care about your strawman.

Nobody worth talking to would consider a mighty and strong warrior fat, just because he is physically huge. Now tell me, do you?

[Ka-mai19]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

He is capable of drinking a lot, that does not make him a drunkard. Which was the subject to begin with. I don't care about your strawman.

Hence why I said "Him actually getting drunk I'm not sure of, however." Can you read? He drinks a lot, but I'm not sure about him getting drunk.

At the very least I don't think it's a great leap in logic to depict a mythological being as a drunkard when he's known to indulge in so much drinking that he was, at one point, capable of drinking so much that he shrank the seas and created the tides.

Nobody worth talking to would consider a mighty and strong warrior fat, just because he is physically huge. Now tell me, do you?

Does he look weak to you?

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/godofwar/images/e/e9/Capture_d%E2%80%99%C3%A9cran_2023-01-26_%C3%A0_20.45.43.png/revision/latest?cb=20230127102918

[XartaX]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von Ka-mai19:

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

He is capable of drinking a lot, that does not make him a drunkard. Which was the subject to begin with. I don't care about your strawman.

Hence why I said "Him actually getting drunk I'm not sure of, however." Can you read? He drinks a lot, but I'm not sure about him getting drunk.

At the very least I don't think it's a great leap in logic to depict a mythological being as a drunkard when he's known to indulge in so much drinking that he was, at one point, capable of drinking so much that he shrank the seas and created the tides.

Nobody worth talking to would consider a mighty and strong warrior fat, just because he is physically huge. Now tell me, do you?

Does he look weak to you?

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/godofwar/images/e/e9/Capture_d%E2%80%99%C3%A9cran_2023-01-26_%C3%A0_20.45.43.png/revision/latest?cb=20230127102918

As mentioned, i don't care about your strawman.

Your lack of answer is all the answer I, and anyone else, need.

[Ka-mai19]

Ursprünglich geschrieben von XartaX:

As mentioned, i don't care about your strawman.

Your lack of answer is all the answer I, and anyone else, need.

What strawman? How am I misrepresenting your views?