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Memory of a Broken Dimension
DrakeWarrior Nov 2, 2014 @ 2:07pm
Do not delete RELICS console interface!
Am i right, do you realy want to delete it from interraction betwen player and Broken Dimenion? This will be weird, cause i hope that this "game" will not be casual, but little chalenging to even just running this broken (i repeat, broken!) system.
I have an idea how to not scare casual players from playing it, but also not ruin awesome idea with interraction trought DOS-like console. Maybe you will make 2 difficulties:
First, Hardcore one, will let players dive into this world by themself, as it was originaly on demo.
Second, Casual, maybe will run some systems/programms automaticaly or will show players, what to do. For example, it will tip players, what command they need to use, to check, what files lie in program directory - "dir". After it, players will try to run .exe files, and great example - in demo there was allready advices of order, in which these files shall be launched.
Another way, but little harder for casual user, can be making walktrought-file of key/hard moments of the game. There can be 1)tips, for those, who want to beat the game by himself, but do not know, what to do, and 2) detailed walktrought (maybe, not realy needed) for those, who do not like puzzles.
I hope you don't delete this awesome aspect from MoaBD and will find the way to satisfy the casual player, because it is one of the things, why i allready love this game.
P.S. Sorry for errors, english is not my primary language.
Last edited by DrakeWarrior; Nov 2, 2014 @ 2:11pm
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Showing 1-13 of 13 comments
Chris Cross Nov 20, 2014 @ 7:13am 
easier would be to leave it on single difficulty, but to add a little excerpt from DOS for dummies into the manual, etc. ;)
Burrito Justice Dec 11, 2014 @ 4:28pm 
Honestly, just leave the DOS prompt as it is in the game.
If you don't know how to work a DOS prompt, you're too young
And besides, you have the internet; just look up what you need to do by following a walkthrough or something.
If people who are confused can't even be bothered to look for a solution then they're just a lost cause and shouldn't be playing puzzle games, honestly...
DrakeWarrior Dec 12, 2014 @ 4:08am 
Originally posted by Burrito Justice:
Honestly, just leave the DOS prompt as it is in the game.
If you don't know how to work a DOS prompt, you're too young
And besides, you have the internet; just look up what you need to do by following a walkthrough or something.
If people who are confused can't even be bothered to look for a solution then they're just a lost cause and shouldn't be playing puzzle games, honestly...
Totaly agree, would be nice to leave it as it is in the demo. I am not against hardcore DOS interface, but completely welcome it.
The problem is, that i have seen one of author's messages somewhere (was too long ago, i cant remember where exactly (project news, maybe?...) and prove my words). There he told about deleting RELICS console as system controll tool, leaving it only for secondary/optional stuff such as easter eggs. The reason was that most of the players (casual ones) will abandon the game without even getting to "dive" option.
But as author is afraid of loss players, i am afraid of game "casualisation". So, i have created this topic, where i'm trying to suggest some compromise solutions.
P.S. Sorry if my retelling author's words is incorrect. As i said, i didnt found that message for proove and/or quote.
Last edited by DrakeWarrior; Dec 12, 2014 @ 4:08am
Shaamaan Mar 11, 2015 @ 3:52pm 
My only gripe with the console is that it's "pure DOS" commands.

The whole thing could be a lot more friendly towards players who do not know their DOS by having a few more commands available.

Have LS act like DIR. Have the file listing also show which files are "executables". HELP, while unsettling, could provice at least a small hint as to what one should do. Little stuff like that...
DrakeWarrior Mar 12, 2015 @ 7:56am 
Originally posted by Shaamaan:
My only gripe with the console is that it's "pure DOS" commands.
Well, this is design :) Whole system is almost fully broken, and we have to restore/repair it, starting with this simple interface.
Originally posted by Shaamaan:
The whole thing could be a lot more friendly towards players who do not know their DOS by having a few more commands available.
Of cource, further (while progressing trought the story and restoring some systems) it "maybe" can be more user-friendly, but i repeat - at start we have inoperatable OS with only few subsystems (like DOS-like RELICS interface) working.
Plus, for those "who do not know DOS" i suggested some ways to ease/bypass hard moments, while not ruining interest for "geeks" and others. It can be manual/walktrought, difficulty levels (amount of ingame instructions and hints, command presets aka "pick_existing instead of type_your_own", and so on). Your suggessions also can work in this way, would be nice to see some "difficulty smoothing" elements.
Last edited by DrakeWarrior; Mar 12, 2015 @ 7:58am
edve98 May 24, 2015 @ 11:16am 
Why isn't it bash, but DOS terminal? D;
tindalos13 May 29, 2015 @ 3:55am 
I cannot tell you how THRILLED I am to have finally been realigned with this interface. I can't quite remember when or how I was confronted with it originally. I lost quite a lot of data, both software and wetware, due to a medical diagnosis. Thus losing I suppose it was just a press demo or some such. But somewhere in the back, remnants of this ... Place. Would flicker. I'd start to try and ask around and then... Well, as I said sometimes I'm less lucid than I once was. Or should it be I was more often lucid than I am now? Anyway, I don't mean to read this cryptic. Just looking forward to those missing angles. But other than expanding, very little should be muddled with. IMO.

What was he trying to tell us? I couldn't... Well, we'll see.

What does "pushing buttons" cause? A dog I knew once always responded (taunted?), "Maybe something good? Maybe something bad? But we'll never know because you're not going to touch it!"
Yay-Icecream Jun 13, 2015 @ 8:57am 
Although I used a little bit of DOS on a home PC when I was a kid I was utterly stonewalled when it came to the opening TXT adventure of the Relics demo. Without knowing any of the basic DOS commands you're genuinely unable to advance the game. I literally spent a good 20 minutes hunting and pecking for any recognized commands while watching the text glitch it's way up the screen before giving up. It was neat to watch the surreal warping of the DOS prompts as I fumbled, but ultimately the only way I was able to advance was to leave the program and watch a youtube playthrough then memorize the txt commands they typed in. Just knowing that DIR would list a library of Relic files and applications would have saved me that. I don't really have a problem of having to exit a game to solve a puzzle that requires outside knowledge (say... you can't advance until you input the 1st capitol of Illinois- so you look up "Kaskaskia") but I'm always left feeling defeated when solving a puzzle involves giving up and watching a playthrough or reading a guide. So much of gaming is built on assumed player knowledge and I'm sure a lot of people were able to breeze through this, but I was really hopelessly stuck. I didn't WANT to leave the game world to solve the puzzle, but i really had to.
DrakeWarrior Jun 13, 2015 @ 11:08pm 
Originally posted by Yay-Icecream:
Just knowing that DIR would list a library of Relic files and applications would have saved me that.
Originally posted by Yay-Icecream:
I don't really have a problem of having to exit a game to solve a puzzle that requires outside knowledge, but I'm always left feeling defeated when solving a puzzle involves giving up and watching a playthrough or reading a guide. I didn't WANT to leave the game world to solve the puzzle, but i really had to.
Thats what i suggested to solve either with
A. Well-made "user manual for RELICS system owners, thank you for purchasing our OS" (or something like that that does not push you out of the "game world", even if it is outside executable file itself).
B. Some ingame tips how to use this interface. There are allready help of in which order to use those ".exe"'s if you are using wrong one. Maybe would be cool to see more.
Combining those both properly, IMHO, will make those puzzles being not able to stuck you at dead-end. Like - core commands explained in "RELICS owner's manual", and some additional knowledge you have to get yourself by using those commands. But if you get in trouble, interface will gently ask you something like "VOIDSCAN READY?" (that is allready ingame, though it is easy to solve by picking variants).
Just this game was designed at first to represent old broken machine / OS / programm, that you find and try to repair / understand. Old-scool DOS interface can make players go outside the game only if they do not know commands they need (like "DIR" you mentioned). Give that knowledge through ingame "HELP" command or outside, via atmospheric manual, and you will not feel yourself stonewalled =)
IMHO, ofc. But thats what i want and wait from game.
Last edited by DrakeWarrior; Jun 13, 2015 @ 11:24pm
XRA  [developer] Jun 24, 2015 @ 11:05pm 
Those are great ideas & you're right that I was thinking about relying less on the command-line (I forget where I said that also)

Currently there is a desktop in addition to the command line, a bit like old MacOS crossed with Win 3.1, it is briefly shown in the greenlight teaser. What I've ended up realizing is that the desktop doesn't really fit with how it is styled, it started to get too familiar... needs to be more stark and weird like the console was in the original prototype.

I like having windows though and multiple programs running. So I still need to come up with a good compromise to keep some of that. The next step with the interface stuff is to go for a hybrid of both, the command line, plus certain programs that jump into their own low resolution or ascii style interfaces. (complete with the creepy flickering that CRT's would do when trying trying to find compatible resolutions to switch into)

As far as people not knowing DOS, or wondering where bash related stuff is at, the plan is to make all the final commands different if possible, so no 'DIR' or 'LS'.
Reasoning for that is so everyone gets the experience of figuring out the commands (even if its as simple as DIR becoming VIEW or whatever). That means I'll also have to have some sort of hint/help system like mentioned in this thread.


One other thing, that is kinda tough but related, is what if people want to play this on their TV with a controller, in SteamOS or big picture mode...
I think that makes another good reasom to come up with a solution for an "easy mode" of selecting relevant commands without relying on hunting around a virtual keyboard.


Originally posted by DrakeWarrior:
Originally posted by Yay-Icecream:
Just knowing that DIR would list a library of Relic files and applications would have saved me that.
Originally posted by Yay-Icecream:
I don't really have a problem of having to exit a game to solve a puzzle that requires outside knowledge, but I'm always left feeling defeated when solving a puzzle involves giving up and watching a playthrough or reading a guide. I didn't WANT to leave the game world to solve the puzzle, but i really had to.
Thats what i suggested to solve either with
A. Well-made "user manual for RELICS system owners, thank you for purchasing our OS" (or something like that that does not push you out of the "game world", even if it is outside executable file itself).
B. Some ingame tips how to use this interface. There are allready help of in which order to use those ".exe"'s if you are using wrong one. Maybe would be cool to see more.
Combining those both properly, IMHO, will make those puzzles being not able to stuck you at dead-end. Like - core commands explained in "RELICS owner's manual", and some additional knowledge you have to get yourself by using those commands. But if you get in trouble, interface will gently ask you something like "VOIDSCAN READY?" (that is allready ingame, though it is easy to solve by picking variants).
Just this game was designed at first to represent old broken machine / OS / programm, that you find and try to repair / understand. Old-scool DOS interface can make players go outside the game only if they do not know commands they need (like "DIR" you mentioned). Give that knowledge through ingame "HELP" command or outside, via atmospheric manual, and you will not feel yourself stonewalled =)
IMHO, ofc. But thats what i want and wait from game.
Last edited by XRA; Jun 24, 2015 @ 11:07pm
edve98 Jun 25, 2015 @ 3:46am 
Ok, I just love everything you have said! It's quite odd that I'm wrinting this on SteamOS too :P. For an idea idea on an interface, you could try to search some of the older linux desktop enviroments. Some of them were quite terrible honetsly. So take something from them, mach it with early windows UI and you have something unique, no? Anyway, wish you good luck on developing this! Looks really promising :P (please don't forget big picture)
Construc_ Aug 27, 2015 @ 4:14am 
Originally posted by XRA:
Currently there is a desktop in addition to the command line, a bit like old MacOS crossed with Win 3.1, it is briefly shown in the greenlight teaser... needs to be more stark and weird like the console was in the original prototype.
The next step with the interface stuff is to go for a hybrid of both, the command line, plus certain programs that jump into their own low resolution or ascii style interfaces. (complete with the creepy flickering that CRT's would do when trying trying to find compatible resolutions to switch into)

As far as people not knowing DOS, or wondering where bash related stuff is at, the plan is to make all the final commands different if possible, so no 'DIR' or 'LS'.
Reasoning for that is so everyone gets the experience of figuring out the commands (even if its as simple as DIR becoming VIEW or whatever). That means I'll also have to have some sort of hint/help system like mentioned in this thread.

Originally posted by DrakeWarrior:

...

<3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3 <3
So much this.
Urocaz Nov 27, 2015 @ 5:18pm 
just add a help command. and allow to use the extension. I typed voidscan.exe and nothing happend
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