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MaxRabbit Feb 9, 2013 @ 10:16am
Obviously Illegal Games
I recently saw 'Pockie Pirates' in Greenlight and, no matter how I look at it, it's obviously completely illegal. The game claims to be a "licensed web game" but there's a number of obvious reasons why it is not:

1) If it were officially licensed, it would be called One Piece and not 'Pockie Pirates'.
2) Check the greenlight listing and check their website. Nowhere does it say "ONE PIECE © 1997 by Eiichiro Oda/SHUEISHA Inc" to identify the creator or the owner of the series.
3) There is no mention _anywhere_ of trademarks (TM) or copyrights (c)
4) Even the art in the trailer screams 'this was never approved by anyone that owns any rights to One Piece.'

I'm sure there are plenty of people out there that think 'it's clearly legit - if it weren't, it would have been taken down by now and Valve would _never_ put something in their shop that was illegal' but that's simply not true.

What saddens me is that most of my PC game purchases are through Steam these days - it's fast, convenient and easy - but I don't want to be supporting a platform that promotes piracy.

I wish I could do more about the situation, but Valve have shown no interest in taking down the game or policing copyright.

As my wife pointed out (in jest), if Valve are going to promote piracy, then clearly they're happy if all their users pirate their content as well.

-Max
Showing 1-15 of 28 comments
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wilco64256 Feb 9, 2013 @ 10:18am 
1. There's already a thread about this on that game's discussion page here:

http://steamcommunity.com/workshop/filedetails/discussion/117478607/828925849458345141/

2. If you still think it's illegal then report it to Valve and move on. They're capable of looking into it.
MaxRabbit Feb 9, 2013 @ 11:01am 
This post was prompted by me reporting it some time ago and getting no response and there being no obvious effort being made by Valve to prevent or police this type of violation.

The point of this thread isn't to discuss the legality of the game - I'll leave that to the other thread. The point of this thread is to emphasise that Valve are promoting illegal goods and doing nothing about it.

If I see even a single response from Valve saying 'we need to be contacted by the copyright owners' or 'we have no intention of promoting piracy' or even just 'we're looking into it' then I'll be happy, but I have seen _nothing_. Not a single thing.

From my point of view, this gives the impression that Valve simply doesn't care about the situation. They may well be frantically working behind the scenes to resolve the issue, but unless they actually say something about it, they just come across as being indifferent.

What I don't want to see is Greenlight becoming a haven for piracy.

Most people can't tell a legit game from one that infinges copyright and to be honest, you shouldn't _have_ to be able to tell - legit shops sell legit goods. Games like this just mean that the _good_ games that pass through Greenlight lose out because their potential customers have spent their money on another, illegal game.

More than anything, I don't want Steam to become a 3rd rate platform selling illegal goods. I simply wouldn't want to shop here any more if that's the case. I want Valve to understand that, and understand how allowing illegal games in Greenlight affects their image as a legitimate online retailer.

-Max
Skoardy Feb 9, 2013 @ 11:10am 
Originally posted by MaxRabbit:
This post was prompted by me reporting it some time ago and getting no response and there being no obvious effort being made by Valve to prevent or police this type of violation.
Are you sure that Valve haven't simply looked into it/reviewed the situation and are satisfied that everything is above board?

I mean, I've reported plenty of projects that were fake, trolls, spam or didn't belong to the people who posted them and they've been removed. Valve even send out automated emails to tell you how many of those projects they've removed.

Since people have been reporting this since the beginning of the year, it's probably safe to say Valve have heard about it. The fact it's still here suggests they've reviewed it. They're a lot more quick off the mark with regular Greenlight than they are with the Concepts section and even there they don't tend to leave things up there for a month or so.
Tamerlane Feb 9, 2013 @ 12:59pm 
The game in question is licensed to use the One Piece franchise, but without the name "One Piece". It is perfectly legal and has been operating in the west for several years now (i downvoted the game anyway)
MaxRabbit Feb 9, 2013 @ 1:57pm 
Skoardy: They may well have reviewed it and concluded that it was fine, but without telling anyone, it would appear as though they haven't been doing anything. As far as I'm concerned, any of my attempts to flag this game have been completely ignored.

Tamerlame: No offense, but that's complete nonsense. Plenty of shops, both online and offline, sell bootleg goods. They've been around for years, but that doesn't make them any more legitimate. I approve of you downvoting the game though =D
Skoardy Feb 9, 2013 @ 2:06pm 
Originally posted by MaxRabbit:
Skoardy: They may well have reviewed it and concluded that it was fine, but without telling anyone, it would appear as though they haven't been doing anything. As far as I'm concerned, any of my attempts to flag this game have been completely ignored.
Well, I suppose they could contact you and explain how everything is fine. And then tell the next person who reports it. And then tell the next person who reports it. And... etc.

Do you see a slight flaw in your system?
Last edited by Skoardy; Feb 9, 2013 @ 2:11pm
TOP-Proto - Dominating Studios Feb 9, 2013 @ 2:14pm 
most likely if theirs any lawsuit or legal issues companies do not respond publicly as its good business sense.
jeslyck Feb 9, 2013 @ 2:15pm 
Valv has no obligations to inform you it's probably not as important to them as it is to you.
Tamerlane Feb 9, 2013 @ 3:14pm 
Originally posted by MaxRabbit:
Tamerlame: No offense, but that's complete nonsense. Plenty of shops, both online and offline, sell bootleg goods. They've been around for years, but that doesn't make them any more legitimate. I approve of you downvoting the game though =D
I know what bootlegs are, but Pockie Pirates is not. I'm just gonna go ahead and say that we can agree to disagree ;) the game will never get greenlit anyway because many people agree with you.
-Z- Feb 9, 2013 @ 3:23pm 
Originally posted by MaxRabbit:
The point of this thread isn't to discuss the legality of the game - I'll leave that to the other thread. The point of this thread is to emphasise that Valve are promoting illegal goods and doing nothing about it.
Then the "point of this thread" depends on accepting a yet unproven and debated premise as being true without providing anything concrete to convince the reader that the "point of this thread" has any basis in solid fact. You have not mentioned any other goods you believe Valve to be promoting that are illegal, and the only good you have mentioned has, perhaps, dubious legality but is not verified to actually be illegal.

Do you have any other bases for the premise of your thread?
Mister Four Feb 9, 2013 @ 3:49pm 
Hmm. My question is how many unreported games are out there on Greenlight with dubious legal status? If you can find at least 1%, say ten games on Greenlight with the same legal problem, then yeah I would say that Greenlight has a trend of dubiousness.

Any form of social deviance however, has to have a noticable trend. I don't see the trend of a simular legal problem. If one gets away in 1000?, it is not a blemish on the larger image. It is a statistical probablity.

Ugh though. Anime and anime tie ins have all sorts of crazy legal problems. Would be interesting to have a legal discussion on that, but sadly not here...

At least, Pockie Pirates is not a bold as Pockie Ninjas. That game got away with advertizing on GameTrailers. No lawsuit, no C&D. If you are going to bark up the "Pokie Tree", regratably you might need the big guns to handle that group.

Though if I learned anything with deviance, people tend to disapprove of things that suggests infringement on popular laws, protections, and ideas. Honestly, the way to go is to simply make other people aware of the game. Let the social mob sort it out.

Last edited by Mister Four; Feb 9, 2013 @ 4:47pm
Gorlom[Swe] Feb 9, 2013 @ 5:17pm 
Originally posted by Tamerlane:
The game in question is licensed to use the One Piece franchise, but without the name "One Piece". It is perfectly legal and has been operating in the west for several years now (i downvoted the game anyway)
It's chineese. China doesn't recognize other countries or international copyrights.
Apparently Eiichiro Oda has commented on it and said it does not have the rights to One Piece. (there is a discussion thread on the project that questions the legality. IT should have relevent links in it)

BTW: I consider the first point in OPs post "1) If it were officially licensed, it would be called One Piece and not 'Pockie Pirates'." To be a false assumption/premise.
(Also it's apparently named "little One Piece" or something in Chineese.)

Pokie Pirates was taken down once and then put back up. Maybe Valve did something about it but realized they couldn't keep them from resubmitting over and over and over using new accounts? Or something. =S
Last edited by Gorlom[Swe]; Feb 9, 2013 @ 5:20pm
MaxRabbit Feb 9, 2013 @ 5:45pm 
Skoardy: This is a shop. I am a customer. If I tell them they are selling illegal goods, they have customer service teams dedicated to responding to me either with 'others have reported this and we're looking into it' or 'we've looked into it and it's 100% legit'. Yes, I do expect them to contact me. No, I don't see a flaw in my system.

Zaxoth: I have no interest in hunting around for other illegal games in Greenlight. Skoardy has already mentioned that he's seen others and that they have been dealt with and removed. Of course I have no proof that they have absolutely no association with Shueisha other than the fact that they never mention the company anywhere on their site, don't have any copyright notices or in any way mention the creator of the series like any other legitimate site does.

If people _knowingly_ spend money on this sort of thing, they're more than welcome to do so. What annoys me is when people think it's legit and believe that the original creators get a cut of the money they're spending.

Unfortunately, western companies find it a lot easier to defend their IP in the west than eastern companies due to them being here and speaking the same language =D. It's even worse for the individual indie creators over there who can't speak English. They simply have no idea how to write a formal letter to a western shop to tell them that someone is ripping off their work. I just want to make sure that that never happens with Steam.
-Z- Feb 9, 2013 @ 5:53pm 
Originally posted by MaxRabbit:
Zaxoth: I have no interest in hunting around for other illegal games in Greenlight. Skoardy has already mentioned that he's seen others and that they have been dealt with and removed. Of course I have no proof that they have absolutely no association with Shueisha other than the fact that they never mention the company anywhere on their site, don't have any copyright notices or in any way mention the creator of the series like any other legitimate site does.

If people _knowingly_ spend money on this sort of thing, they're more than welcome to do so. What annoys me is when people think it's legit and believe that the original creators get a cut of the money they're spending.

Unfortunately, western companies find it a lot easier to defend their IP in the west than eastern companies due to them being here and speaking the same language =D. It's even worse for the individual indie creators over there who can't speak English. They simply have no idea how to write a formal letter to a western shop to tell them that someone is ripping off their work. I just want to make sure that that never happens with Steam.
The bolded would appear to debunk the "point of this thread" as you phrased it.
Gorlom[Swe] Feb 9, 2013 @ 6:31pm 
Tammerlane contact Shueisha, Bandai or.. funimation? and have them notify Valve that the Chinese company doesn't have the valid copyrights.

It's most likely going to be a lot quicker than anything else.
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Date Posted: Feb 9, 2013 @ 10:16am
Posts: 28