Steam Greenlight

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Pnume Dec 2, 2012 @ 5:52am
Suggestion for Greenlights
A few suggestions on Greenlight:

1 – Valve should do some filtering before submitting any games. Too much rubbish get through the $ 100 fee filter :
The games that are submitted should not be Alpha. They should be finished games or advanced Beta representative of the finished product.
The game should be above a certain level of quality. They should look like a professionally made product. I know this is subjective but for a lot of game that have already been submitted this is objectively not the case. Some game looks like some porn games made with flash in 10 min. I even saw a student project (don't remember the name of the game).

It shouldn't be that hard for valve to do a little bit of clean up. This is important because the reviewers (us) will get tired very quickly by such a quantity of submissions and loose interest in greenlight. Plus some genuinely good games with a real potential will pass under the radar not because of a poor marketing campaign but just because they have been drowned in a mountain of rubbish.

2 - My feeling is that the 2 options: Yes and Not Interest are not sufficient to express our opinions on the game submitted and in the end it doesn't give a realistic view of the game potential. For example the choices could represent the following views:

I will definitively buy it
The information given is interesting and I'm waiting to know more. If reviews are good I would probably buy it
Seems like a good game but the concept doesn't appeal to me
I'm not interested at all.
This is rubbish.

3 – We are doing Valve's work. The least they could do would be to give us some feedback on how the games are doing. At least after we have voted we should be able to see the answers given so far.

4 – Valve should seriously work on the ergonomic of Greenlight. This is just horrible to navigate through it and terribly slow. The very least would be to have minimalist list of the submitted games that we could order using different criteria ( date of submissions, ranking, ect...)
Last edited by Pnume; Dec 2, 2012 @ 6:01am
Showing 1-15 of 17 comments
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AusSkiller Dec 2, 2012 @ 6:22am 
1. Since the $100 fee was implemented the games have mostly been of a reasonable quality, there's been one or two exceptions but on the whole nothing that would objectively be completely unreasonable to be released on Steam. Unfortunately there was a period of time where it was free to submit, so there's still a heap of junk to go through if you haven't already voted on everything. IMO it's unreasonable to only allow completed or nearly completed games on greenlight, as developers will be wanting to release as soon as the game is complete and it would suck for them to have to wait a month or more to get through greenlight before they can start selling the game, it's better that voters should have to wait, though obviously it would be foolish to submit to greenlight too early and can't show quality because people will down vote it very quickly.
Unfortunately it would be unfair for Valve to go through and clean up some of the crap games, it can't be done objectively and so no matter how crap we might think a game is there's bound to be a few people who still like it.

2. The only option that matter to Valve are would you buy it or not, and the negative options like "This is rubbish" will lead to groups of trolls mass rubbishing games for the lols (jerks >:( ). However as many others have suggested a vote later option would be nice so we could come back to a game that looked interesting but didn't provide enough information or is too early in development to vote for.

3. Yes we are doing Valves work, the reason to do it is that we get the games we want not just the ones Valve think we want. Displaying the stats like that just leads to everyone voting for the popular games and ignoring the rest, I saw a term for it being thrown around in the other threads about this a lot but can't for the life of me remember what it was.

4. It's supposed to be slow to force you to at least look at each games properly before voting, if you could just vote off a custom list then the voting would get skewed and defeat the purpose of greenlight.
Naota Dec 2, 2012 @ 6:22am 

Unfortunately, I also feel the need to add that many of the games that have already been "greenlit", and some that have been released, are STILL in an alpha state. The concept of low budget, independent games might sound noble, but in practice, it usually results in forgettable and amateurish titles.
Last edited by Naota; Dec 2, 2012 @ 6:23am
C0untzer0 Dec 2, 2012 @ 6:30am 
1. sorting them out is kinda the point of Greenlight
2. really, a shop only needs to know one thing
3. yes we are, why not try doing it properly?
4. If you're going to do valve's work, don't expect it to be easy or convenient. It's "Work" you see?
Pnume Dec 2, 2012 @ 6:43am 
If the only question is will I be bying it the answer will be No for all games that are not already on the market for the simple reason that I won't buy a game that haven't been properly tested and whose price is an unknown. That doesn't mean that a game shouldn't be given a shot cause otherwise it might never be tested at all.
C0untzer0 Dec 2, 2012 @ 6:49am 
Pssst. you're not the only one with a vote...
Pnume Dec 2, 2012 @ 7:49am 
It would be interesting to know how each of this games that have been greenlit and released fares. Even more interesting would be to know the % of the people who have up voted the game that have really bought it in the end.

I don't expect that kind of transparency from Steam though.
Last edited by Pnume; Dec 2, 2012 @ 7:58am
Skoardy Dec 2, 2012 @ 12:07pm 
I'm surprised you actually think you deserve it.
Pnume Dec 2, 2012 @ 12:18pm 
I'm surprised you think you know what I think
Skoardy Dec 2, 2012 @ 12:24pm 
No, you're right, actually. Whatever is going on in your mind is just a complete mystery to me.
Vilecat Dec 2, 2012 @ 8:00pm 
I'd only like to have an extra option for when I believe a game is not in the right category. Seems like even a few of the recent submissions for games to be greenlit should be in the Concept section instead. Either because they're still in alpha stage or even pre-alpha, or because even though they claim they're ready to release, they could really use some constructive criticism and tips to polish their game. I feel bad for turning down someone's work when it has the potential to become a good game.

TL;DR Need an option/button for pointing or alerting when a title should be moved in a different section of Greenlight.
lukep Dec 2, 2012 @ 9:58pm 
1. I disagree that Valve should do "pre-screening" of the games. Apart from giving themselves extra work (which we are all too happy to do for them), it would expose them to very harsh criticism if one of their mods would decline a game that would later go on to do well. Choosing not to sell a game is one thing, saying that it is not good enough to be let out in public is another.

2. I think a yes/no rating system is the best system available. Giving too many options is unnecessarily complex, and if you want to leave feedback like your options, use the comment system.

3. Yes, we are doing Valve's work, happily. The least they can do is nothing, and we're (almost) all fine with that.

4. A unified "advanced search" function would be helpful once in a while, and could do what you are suggesting, if I'm reading it right.
Intravenous Software Dec 3, 2012 @ 9:38am 
I'd like to make a comment about your opinion that alpha games should not be allowed.

I'm a solo developer. I put my game Neon on Greenlight on Saturday and it's pre-alpha, but I'm quite strict with myself about what I call alpha. It's fully playable from start to finish but I haven't started alpha testing yet so it's pre-alpha to me.

My point is that a tiny developer such as myself doesn't have many ways to get feedback on their game. Greenlight is an amazing resource for that alone. Neon has been in production now for a year with over 2000 hours of work. Greenlight gives me the opportunity to find out if there is a real audience out there for the game or if my time would be better served doing other things.

Without the help of you guys voting on games like Neon, developers really struggle to know if they are wasting their time or not. The whole Greenlight concept will put many great indie games in your hands that otherwise would never see the light of day.

So try not to be too harsh on the devs. They really need your support and critism to know if they are on the right track or wasting their time.
Oakreef Dec 3, 2012 @ 9:54am 
Number 1 is kind of silly as it defeats the point of Greenlight. Valve is croudsourcing their preliminary screening.
C0untzer0 Dec 3, 2012 @ 9:55am 
Originally posted by Intravenous Software:
I'd like to make a comment about your opinion that alpha games should not be allowed.

I'm a solo developer. I put my game Neon on Greenlight on Saturday and it's pre-alpha, but I'm quite strict with myself about what I call alpha. It's fully playable from start to finish but I haven't started alpha testing yet so it's pre-alpha to me.

My point is that a tiny developer such as myself doesn't have many ways to get feedback on their game. Greenlight is an amazing resource for that alone. Neon has been in production now for a year with over 2000 hours of work. Greenlight gives me the opportunity to find out if there is a real audience out there for the game or if my time would be better served doing other things.

Without the help of you guys voting on games like Neon, developers really struggle to know if they are wasting their time or not. The whole Greenlight concept will put many great indie games in your hands that otherwise would never see the light of day.

So try not to be too harsh on the devs. They really need your support and critism to know if they are on the right track or wasting their time.
Well said.
Pnume Dec 4, 2012 @ 3:26am 
@ Intravenous Software

I'm not trying to be harsh at devellopers. I'm more like ♥♥♥♥♥ing at valve actually.
I understand that Greenlight is a great marketing tool for you but maybe it should be just that.

For several reasons I don't think the way Greenlight works is pertinent to decide what games should be on steam. At least not from a gamers perspective. Some sufficiently profitable niche games that appeal to a loyal but limited public that could have gone through before probably won't make it anymore. In the end variety might suffer.
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Date Posted: Dec 2, 2012 @ 5:52am
Posts: 17