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Erretter Apr 28 @ 11:47pm
Do you vote for "others"?
The greenlight question clearly says: "Would YOU buy this?"

Still I often see in the comments: "I voted yes. I don´t like it, but I guess others will."
I think this breaks the system... and you should really ONLY vote for YES if YOU personally would buy it.
Another thing is "I don´t like the game, but I like the devs so I vote YES."
Same thing here... If you´ll never buy the game you should not vote "YES".

This is a lie. You lie, when you hit the YES-button under the above mentioned circumstances.
Please stop doing so.
Showing 1-15 of 63 comments
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Gorlom[Swe] Apr 29 @ 2:11am 
While I agree with you you have done a ♥♥♥♥poor job at explaining "why" Erretter :(.
(Also I doubt any of them will be reasding this)

First of all people need to understand that the system is comparative in it's nature. Games don't get greenlit once they reach X votes. It's the top Y interesting games (not specifically those with most votes though) according to Valve that gets greenlit. That means if one game gets greenlit based on a false premise, such as getting a lot of "support" from people that don't want to play the game, a game people would acctually buy will not be getting Greenlit. And people will have screwed that developer and the people that wanted to buy that game.

The reason is that not answering the question as it is asked is sabotageing for everyone involved. The players don't get the games they want to play, The developers will not get to sell the games people want to play because soemeone elses game that aren't as interesting got pity votes and Valve will get an inferior product in the store that won't make them as much money.
Despite the phrasings about supporting devs and helping games onto Steam Valve wants the games that will sell the most. Don't kid yourself (talking to you random greenlight user) about helping people who's game you don't want to buy, you're screwing them and others over when you do that.
Erretter Apr 29 @ 2:13am 
Originally posted by GorlomSwe:
***
Thanks for the addition.
Sera Apr 29 @ 6:37am 
Just look at the number of idiots who post spam on Greenlight. Do you sincerely think anybody give a crap about what you think of the way they vote on games? It's already too late. Many of the crappy games we got greenlit are proof of that. There is a reason many people say "Many of those games are junks" at each batches of greenlit games.

While opinions may differ and they do, you can't honestly lie to yourself and really think these games were all given honest yes votes... Greenlight ultimately gives the choice to the users and this wasn't quite a great idea. In a perfect world where users would be intelligent enough to use the system as intended, maybe. In the current world where stupidity is abundant, err not quite.
Erretter Apr 29 @ 6:55am 
Originally posted by Sera:
Just look at the number of idiots who post spam on Greenlight. Do you sincerely think anybody give a crap about what you think of the way they vote on games? It's already too late. Many of the crappy games we got greenlit are proof of that. There is a reason many people say "Many of those games are junks" at each batches of greenlit games.

While opinions may differ and they do, you can't honestly lie to yourself and really think these games were all given honest yes votes... Greenlight ultimately gives the choice to the users and this wasn't quite a great idea. In a perfect world where users would be intelligent enough to use the system as intended, maybe. In the current world where stupidity is abundant, err not quite.
Yes, I also think there are many troll-voters.

Voting "Yes" for rubbish just to troll or to proof that the voting system sucks...
C0untzer0 Apr 29 @ 7:14am 
This is why I've always said that Greenlight should be locked. If we could weed out the idiots who are bringing the system into disrepute we could save the reputation of Greenlight. As it is we have to deal with the sort of people who appear here just to spam the fora with "yeye looks good" Eliminate them from the voting pool and if possible the gene pool.
Last edited by C0untzer0; Jun 7 @ 4:07am
orb Apr 29 @ 9:36am 
Originally posted by Erretter:
If you´ll never buy the game you should not vote "YES".

This is a lie.
Is it a lie, too, if you change your mind when you can no longer change the vote? E.g. I was interested in "Day One" when it was in Greenlight, but I changed my mind after its release, and even the current 90% off price somehow doesn't want to convince me. I probably won't ever buy it (but who knows).

Also, should I change my vote to "NO" if I still can when I bought the game outside of Steam while waiting for it, because it will surely be a lie that I will buy it on Steam? I can eventually enter a Steam key for it, if it's offered, but I probably won't buy it on Steam once again.

There are also a few cases where I bought games I voted "NO" / wasn't interested in them at the time I voted. Am I a lier, just because I won't buy a game which I voted "YES" and because I bought a game I voted "NO"? (I just imagined a feature in the store where I want to buy a game but the page tells me I can't because I voted that I wouldn't buy it. :P)

If I'm obliged to buy it on Steam when I voted "YES", then I'd rather vote "NO" for all the games, if not "ask me later" (until it's in the store), because I may change my mind or buy these games from another source. I think I'm not obliged because the question is "would you buy", and not "will you buy" no matter what. After all, I don't vote for others, but egoistically only for myself, and I'm entitled to change my mind before I'll buy it, too.


Other than my above notes / exceptions, I overly agree with you all about the pity / rubbish votes.
Erretter Apr 29 @ 10:14am 
Originally posted by orb:
~
I also agree here.

Day One and meanwhile at least 80% of Greenlight games are not even games.
This is the biggest paradox of the whole greenlight thing.

80% of the presented.... "ware" is unfinished pre-alpha...stuff.
The question "Would you buy this GAME?"
Cannot be answered since, hell there is no game to see.

It´s like "Here look at this lousy sketch of a car scrabbled, on a napkin!"
Would you buy this car when we´ve build it???

You and many others saw that "sketch" of Day One. You "trusted" the dev, you and many others were dissapointed that the final thing was nothing near that what the sketch promised.

No SANE person would say "YES" to the car on a napkin, but at the same time MANY people say "YES" when looking at some screenshots of an pre-Alpha.
I don´t understand this...

In my personal opinion it should not be allowed to post unfinished games here on greenlight, but that´s just me, I guess. And another topic at all... but... on the other side... voting "YES" on seomething that doesn´t even exist in the moment of voting is lying nevertheless....
Sera Apr 29 @ 10:24am 
Well, the question is exactly that. "Would you" and not "Will you". The question begs for one's judgement rather than an obligation. Nonetheless, you need to be honest. What the question asks you is... "From what you see here, assuming you like what you see, WOULD you buy this game or not?".

Currently, I have 2500 voted games. I only voted yes on like 100 of them if even this much. Would I buy the games based on what I saw of them so far? Yes... Unless something changes that makes me not want to anymore. It's not a lie since it's not really an obligation. I still think my way works since I vote honestly for myself. Voting for others is just stupid.

The thing I hate is that considering all the idiots who post on Greenlight Discussions, there is just no way I can believe that everyone vote as honestly as I do. I am thankful that NO votes do not do anything but YES votes on crap games has bad consequences. Trolls and/or stupid people bring crappy games to Steam and I do not think it is Greenlight's true objective.
Gorlom[Swe] Apr 29 @ 11:09am 
Originally posted by orb:
Originally posted by Erretter:
If you´ll never buy the game you should not vote "YES".

This is a lie.
Is it a lie, too, if you change your mind when you can no longer change the vote? E.g. I was interested in "Day One" when it was in Greenlight, but I changed my mind after its release, and even the current 90% off price somehow doesn't want to convince me. I probably won't ever buy it (but who knows).
No, it is only wrong (imo) if you at the time of pressing the button have no intention of buying it.
If you had the intention of buying it when pressing the button then all is ok. Imo it is even ok if you change your mind sometime before it gets released but are too lazy to change your vote, just as long as you really intended to buy the thing when you initially pressed "yes". (although if you aren't too lazy then please do change the vote ^^)

Also, should I change my vote to "NO" if I still can when I bought the game outside of Steam while waiting for it, because it will surely be a lie that I will buy it on Steam? I can eventually enter a Steam key for it, if it's offered, but I probably won't buy it on Steam once again.
No, there is imo no reason for that. Especially if you want to have a steam key for it. As long as you intended to buy it on Steam when you pressed the button.

There are also a few cases where I bought games I voted "NO" / wasn't interested in them at the time I voted. Am I a lier, just because I won't buy a game which I voted "YES" and because I bought a game I voted "NO"? (I just imagined a feature in the store where I want to buy a game but the page tells me I can't because I voted that I wouldn't buy it. :P)
Hilarious thought, but the "no" votes has no impact on the games chances to get greenlit so feel free to vote no and buy the game later on anyway. That just makes the dev happy that he/she/them got an unexpected sale ^^

If I'm obliged to buy it on Steam when I voted "YES", then I'd rather vote "NO" for all the games, if not "ask me later" (until it's in the store), because I may change my mind or buy these games from another source. I think I'm not obliged because the question is "would you buy", and not "will you buy" no matter what. After all, I don't vote for others, but egoistically only for myself, and I'm entitled to change my mind before I'll buy it, too.
You are not obligated at all, you have not signed any contract to such effect. But it is preferable that you only vote yes on games you are going to buy, or at the very least really interested in buying.


Other than my above notes / exceptions, I overly agree with you all about the pity / rubbish votes.
Last edited by Gorlom[Swe]; Apr 29 @ 11:11am
Erretter Apr 29 @ 1:42pm 
Talkin' 'bout troll voters.
http://store.steampowered.com/app/295810/?snr=1_4_4__105_1
Look what has it made through greenlight and is beeing released soon. Oh and check the game´s forums.
Sera Apr 29 @ 2:06pm 
Are you kidding...? No, of course you aren't. What the hell is this ♥♥♥♥...?
K'night.exe Apr 29 @ 2:40pm 
ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZ
Thordred May 1 @ 5:00pm 
Doesn't matter how you vote, all games will end up on Steam eventually.
Skoardy May 1 @ 5:37pm 
So you've stopped voting then?
Thordred May 1 @ 5:55pm 
Originally posted by Skoardy:
So you've stopped voting then?
Yes, some time ago. Games are getting greenlit at increasing rates: 225 titles in April alone. At the same time more and more shovelware bypasses Greenlight altogether and is put on the store directly. The floodgates are opening, Valves goal is to make Greenlight superfluous so what's the point?
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Date Posted: Apr 28 @ 11:47pm
Posts: 63