*VictorFrankenstein* Dec 8, 2013 @ 11:35pm
A suggestion for new players
Hey there,

so you are new to this game. You are not really sure if you like it yet, because the game is weird and different. Sometimes it seems like a tower defense game, and at other times it reminds you of games like Diablo 2 and MMOs with their endless grind for loot and levels.

Here is my suggestion: Take your time and play by yourself. Begging in public games for someone to level you is not the way to play the game.

It's like cheating in many games. It allows for quick success, but you rob yourself of a lot of fun. The fun in this game is not the powerleveling, or even the loot. The fun is trying out different builds, finding different chokepoints and bottlenecks, the excitement of kiting an ogre away from your vulnerable defenses and most of all, trying all of the aspects of this amazing game.

If you get powerleveled, then you rob yourself of this excitement, you never have to find ways to make stuff work. By the time you have played through the main campaign by yourself, you will have found out whether you really like the game. You might have found a favourite class to build and play with. This is the reason I have started the game 5 times from absolute scratch. The beginning is actually the most exciting thing.

If you have friends to do this with you, great for you, I envy you.

Only by the time you start hitting the wall that is nightmare, then you can and actually should ask politely for help. (In the group DD Free runs by request, for example)
Last edited by *VictorFrankenstein*; Dec 8, 2013 @ 11:36pm
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Lone_Wolf Dec 9, 2013 @ 6:20am 
Good advice. I have yet to play with the community, but most of the players act like such elitists that it's likely that I never will.

It is fun trying and succeeding/failing by yourself - that way you don't have to answer to anyone else. The overwhelming hordes though do prompt players to ask for assistance, but a good build (or builds, thanks to character-swapping at the forge) could take players through large portions of the game easily.
*VictorFrankenstein* Dec 9, 2013 @ 6:53am 
And to tell you the truth, even though this is meant to be a co-op game, it is perfectly possible to achieve everything on your own.
It's tough and asking for punishment, since stuff takes a lot longer, but at the same time very rewarding.

One guy who attempts it posted his progress on the forums:
http://dungeondefenders2.com/forum/showthread.php?51931-Guide-Journal-Forever-alone-from-lvl-1-to-endgame
Tydo Dec 9, 2013 @ 9:14am 
Originally posted by *VictorFrankenstein*:
And to tell you the truth, even though this is meant to be a co-op game, it is perfectly possible to achieve everything on your own.
Oh my. Let the exceptions start to tick in, including the ones where you need absurd gear or botting/hacks to 'solo' it. I'll go first with a very obvious one:
Challenge: Zippy terror
*VictorFrankenstein* Dec 9, 2013 @ 10:17am 
Easy enough with two summoners with two lazer bots each. Tested. (Controller/Emulator, otherwise it really takes ages, and nobody has that kind of patience) Same goes for the first challenge.
Mindnumbing (kind of hacking), yes, impossible to solo, no.
sonny9996 Dec 9, 2013 @ 12:28pm 
well I am just looking for some one to play the game to help go through some of the eternal shard missions are far easier to do co op. I have done it solo on the ps3 version, I bought on steam to get the rest of maps because I enjoyed the game so much. looking for someone not out to ask to level that is easy to do just very time comsuming. I am looking for respectible people whiling to actual try to play the whole game not just get mana, xp, and loot. it all comes in time......
Tydo Dec 10, 2013 @ 3:16am 
Hats off if you managed to pull Zippy off on NMHC, the one that matters for achievement. Personally i have some difficulty believing that a single afk char can cover it well enough, but with 2 beefy afk's yes might be plausible - did it actively with a friend, no afk's, both jesters with the poor mans version of the BF drill.
"Turret"-afk's are pretty much breaking the solo part, but yeah i see your point.

Since you seem up to the challenge, i will propose some more:
* Greater turkey hunt.
* Sky of love.
* Etherian holiday extravaganza (xmas1).
* Silent night. (xmas2)
* Wizardry, specially NMHC.
* Winter Wonderland NM(hc) - the gear requirements are absurd to do it solo. Multiply the absurdity with having to have x builders + a dps at such stats.
For related reasons, besides that coal does not stack, i dont do the whole coal/diamond thing nor trade with anyone that does.
*VictorFrankenstein* Dec 10, 2013 @ 5:59am 
1) Greater turkey hunt is actually easier with only 1 or 2 people, since the number of turkeys to kill scales incredibly (wave 9 - 2p - 800 turkeys - 3p - 1700 turkeys). Not to mention boss turkey hp. (I have to admit, I haven't done that one yet, but it's far and away the worst mission)
For reference: http://dungeondefenders2.com/forum/showthread.php?95053


2) Sky of Love: Again, possible, but asking for punishment. Dps summoner with fairy to heal yourself flash heal makes this possible, but again, very tedious. At the same time: Solo= less couples required.

3) X-mas 1 - that's a very tough one, solo, I admit. At least the achievement and costumes require only insane and not NMHC. Since the challenge was made at a time where nightmare was just beginning, its possible to do it with myth gear.

4) Silent Night: http://dungeondefenders2.com/forum/showthread.php?90090 (Not by me!!!)

5) Wizardry is actually manageable with a summoner since minions count as a separate type of damage which kills the mages, unlike towers. Again, more people - more wizards - takes longer and is harder. http://ddplanner.com/?l=16053,wizardry-nightmare-hardcore-solo (again, not by me)

6) WinterWonderland. Is frequently soloed by me - still waiting on my first diamond, with 3 afks. But I agree, stupid gear and stats are required.

7) As for zippy: I actually used one summoner (afk-controller) with a monkey and a lazer bot, and a monk (active) with a monkey. It's not really possible with starting nightmare gear, but I never said it was.

Originally posted by *VictorFrankenstein*:
It's tough and asking for punishment, since stuff takes a lot longer, but at the same time very rewarding.

That's all I ever said. I never said it was going to be easy and only fun.
*VictorFrankenstein* Dec 10, 2013 @ 6:07am 
To stop this right here: The game is completely FUBAR (f***ed up beyond any repair) in terms of balancing and actual logical progression (both don't exist anymore, and haven't since the introduction of nightmare mode, nvm EV and summoner). If you get the right equipment, any kind of stuff is possible.

And getting the right equipment is time-consuming, but not necessarily hard if you solo. I started the game from scratch in local, and I have 600~700 in tower stats on two of my builders after about 8 hours of play. No cheating required. NMHC challenges like Ogre Crush and Raining Goblins can be completed with 300s in building stats. All it needs is the right build. This is actually the most exciting phase of the game for me. Going from just being able to complete Insane levels alone to being able to beat levels on Nightmare is absolutely gratifying.

To get back to my original point: Don't go into a public game after having played 4 hours and start begging for equipment. You dont need it and it will only screw with the fun you're having. It's not about getting into "endgame" content quickly and playing there. (See above)
Tydo Dec 13, 2013 @ 3:57am 
Thanks for taking the time to adress each point. Certainly food for thought that they are doable, but it is a huge cheat IMO that wizardry is soloable due to a bug (invuln mages being vulnerable to minions).

I agree with you to stop this, i think i managed to get my point across: some things are horribly hard and fall in the 'not before hell freezes over' category if you have to do it on ranked and earn your own gear - as opposed to on open with "modded" stuff. Which in my opinion is a more relevant observation to new players than it being theoretically possible.
Besides, my interest is to encourage people to not just discard the ranked/online part without having tried - it is a lot more stimulating to not play alone. Your claim of "all is soloable", without the proper disclaimers, got in the way of that.
*VictorFrankenstein* Dec 13, 2013 @ 5:08am 
Originally posted by Tydo:
Besides, my interest is to encourage people to not just discard the ranked/online part without having tried

The problem is, that people join ranked games without taking time to enjoy even the beginning phase of the game, which was the point I wanted to get across.

I don't have problems with people playing in ranked.
However, I don't like people who don't even know that the loot which isn't picked up gets sold between waves, joining nightmare levels and begging to be carried through stuff. That ruins their fun (as I tried to explain in the OP) and mine and others' as well.
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Date Posted: Dec 8, 2013 @ 11:35pm
Posts: 10