Niche - a genetics survival game

Niche - a genetics survival game

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MerAndFrog Jan 21, 2017 @ 2:34am
Lack of diversity in biomes
One of the things that appealed to me most about this game was it's evolution aspect, the need to adapt to surroundings to survive. However, currently the game is rather lacking in that. The only food source that will actually let you survive is berry bushes, which can be found everywhere. There is very little difference between different biomes, so with breeding animals that have runner legs and a good amount of damage, you can survive anywhere.

This became even more obvious with the water update, I expected that with that there would also be a water biome added, where these genes were neccesary or at least more ideal to survive with, but not only is there not, the genes are actually not feasible to breed at all. I would really like to see a water biome, like a collection of tiny islands with lost of water and fish around, and very few berry bushes, where specialisation in water genes is actually required. Same goes for cracker jaw and nimble hands, a forest with more trees and less bushes, where those genes will actually give an advantage. This goes as well for future genes that will be added, there is not much fun in it if they aren't needed ever, or actually feasible at all.

I think this would also make it a lot more fun to start a new world, because although they currently might be randomly generated, I've never had to adjust my playstyle or what genes I was focusing on at all. I assume that the climate changes will be added in again at a later point as well, but I would really like to see a need for specialisation based on not just the temperture, but available food sources, and even outside threaths as well. Thoughts?
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Showing 1-15 of 17 comments
Eikthyrnir Jan 21, 2017 @ 3:15pm 
Hopefully continents will be added that will fix this. Continents would mean more biomes and biome diversity. Temperature and new creatures would also change this alot. Different creatures in different biomes would make strategy there much more different.

Vulture in the savannah could steal meat piles, making meat piles mmore of a priority.

Cheatahs fast but slow predator, would make speed ideal in creatures (or a way to scare off).

ect ( i know all of these are for savannah)
Budly Jan 21, 2017 @ 6:06pm 
I've also been waiting for this and continents. Especially contents. I remember with the original demo on their website, the most fun I had was sending away outcasts and having them explore. Sometimes they got to settle down and breed, sometimes they never found a partner, and because of temperatures I made sure to keep creatures that wouldn't thrive well in an enviornement outside of it.

I don't mind how it is now because a lot of things are still being balanced and introduced, but I do hope that near the end we get the option for huge worlds where the biomes aren't a few turns away from each other, your creatures are forced to adapt to that area because there's simply no where else to go within one generation. Which is especially needed now that the option to create nests are being tested, now the only thing that would keep a player on a swamp tile is a need for food, while it's more realistic that they're kept there because of both the need for food and the time it would take to leave that area.
Jojo Jan 22, 2017 @ 2:40am 
I would love to see a lot more different biomes to. So I don't mind how it is now but you are right you don't need to adapt at all. The main thing I usually breed for is claws and nimble fingers and there it ends in specialization. I don't even focus that much on the body types though I usually prefer the big body.
In addition to that I was really disappointed by the water biome because as you said Leydaa it isn't feasible to have water creatures and I get really annoyed when the gills and the water body show up on my creatures which shouldn't be that way! (Right now it isn't that bad because I have a little lake and gills would be somewhat useful there but I never go into the sea except on the shore to gather clams). I already said that a lot more food in the water biome would help a lot because as you said you can basicly find berry bushes anywhere so most people would live in grasslands but I would like to see more food or better specializations so that you could really mainly survive in a desert or savannah (right now you can't). Also as Stud said the adaption would be needed if you couldn't leave as quickly as you can now so continents would be AWESOME.
I hope that with the jungle biome, camouflage and jungle specific predators we will possibly get some more genes that are required for that biome to survive in it. So that we will see a little bit more need to adapt. I don't feel the whole natural selection at the moment as well except when a creature has blind eyes or no-paw but with camcouflage or temperature effects that are worse than they are now it would affect creatures way more (and the player too).
But at the moment with the game in early access I keep very well in mind that we can't expect everything right now and I look optimistic towards the future. (Thinking about continents makes me really excited and I would love to see a snow biome where it would be really hard to survive in :D )
laurceny Jan 22, 2017 @ 11:31am 
This may be a terrible comparison, but as for the whole continent/biome thing, I was thinking something similar to Minecraft?
Last edited by laurceny; Jan 22, 2017 @ 11:31am
Budly Jan 22, 2017 @ 11:37am 
Originally posted by RavenSoaring:
This may be a terrible comparison, but as for the whole continent/biome thing, I was thinking something similar to Minecraft?

I was actually thinking about the same thing, but on a much smaller scale because right now it's pretty hard to keep track of creatures when they're in a close prosimity to each other and I'm not sure how many computers would be able to handle that big of an environment when a few people (admittedly playing on toasters) can only play the game on its lowest graphical setting as is.
Philo [StrayFawn]  [developer] Jan 22, 2017 @ 3:06pm 
True words are being spoken here!
Thanks a lot for this feedback, it helps me to see the problems more clearly.

The grass biome is the only that has been properly worked out so far :)
With the February update the jungle biome will be added and it feels quite different to play, having camouflage/stealth/scent disguise as its main mechanics because very very strong predators live there and you are not top of the food chain at all.
After that comes the mountain/snow biome.

I agree that the berry bushes are OP. Did a bit of work on the water biome today to make it more attractive to specialize in water genes. I'm also a bit dissapointed at how it turned out at the first attempt and rarely breed water creatures myself. Back to work I guess xD
And as you mentioned @leydaa we need to add islands that really demand adaptions in these directions.

The size of the islands is currently limited due to performance. We need to optimize some more before we can have bigger islands than the current top/right island, currenty it just starts lagging. But what I can say is that they will always be islands. But well continents are islands too, right xD? No but seriously I'm not sure how big they can be since there still needs to be an option to reach the ports to travel away. Bigger than now should not be a problem but maybe not triple the size.
Last edited by Philo [StrayFawn]; Jan 22, 2017 @ 3:10pm
Derro Jan 22, 2017 @ 5:07pm 
Originally posted by Sheevee:
Testing :D
https://twitter.com/NicheGame/status/823324094917644289


So excited, I can't wait for the next update
Eikthyrnir Jan 22, 2017 @ 10:44pm 
Snow hype! to soon?
Jojo Jan 24, 2017 @ 11:01am 
Oh yes can't wait for the snow and the water islands look really cute :3
Monkeysaur Jan 25, 2017 @ 4:56am 
Originally posted by Sheevee:
True words are being spoken here!
Thanks a lot for this feedback, it helps me to see the problems more clearly.

The grass biome is the only that has been properly worked out so far :)
With the February update the jungle biome will be added and it feels quite different to play, having camouflage/stealth/scent disguise as its main mechanics because very very strong predators live there and you are not top of the food chain at all.
After that comes the mountain/snow biome.

I agree that the berry bushes are OP. Did a bit of work on the water biome today to make it more attractive to specialize in water genes. I'm also a bit dissapointed at how it turned out at the first attempt and rarely breed water creatures myself. Back to work I guess xD
And as you mentioned @leydaa we need to add islands that really demand adaptions in these directions.

The size of the islands is currently limited due to performance. We need to optimize some more before we can have bigger islands than the current top/right island, currenty it just starts lagging. But what I can say is that they will always be islands. But well continents are islands too, right xD? No but seriously I'm not sure how big they can be since there still needs to be an option to reach the ports to travel away. Bigger than now should not be a problem but maybe not triple the size.

Great to hear all of this. I just picked up the game, have played a couple of minutes and I think it's really amazing and beautifully made!
Ocelittle Jan 25, 2017 @ 9:41am 
I don't think we need larger islands to fix the problem. Maybe we should just have specific island biomes. Island A is 90% savannah tiles, Island B is 90% swamp tiles, etc. If we change how we migrate between islands, I think this would be viable. What if we only had one migration area, and then when we choose to travel, we have the ability to choose what island to go to? Then people could directly travel to the killer island, or someone could jump straight to just the water biome. I'm not sure how viable that kind of travel would be, but I wanted to mention it.
Philo [StrayFawn]  [developer] Feb 1, 2017 @ 2:54am 
The snow hype has to wait for a bit ^^
First comes the jungle biome :)

OP berry bushes
-> They now become withered with less food and less regrowing when it doesn't rain for a while and go back to normal when it rains again. Will be added in the next update.

@Monkeysaur
Thank you <3

@Ocelittle
Yes, the specific biome islands will definetly be a thing!
The single port is an interesting idea, I'll think about that :)
Ivlet Feb 3, 2017 @ 6:47pm 
Ooh, what type of very very strong predators are in the jungle biome??


edit: When is the update coming out? February is my birth month and I would laugh if it would come out around the 27th.
Budly Feb 3, 2017 @ 7:00pm 
Originally posted by THE DOG and Friends (lil.bink):
Ooh, what type of very very strong predators are in the jungle biome??


edit: When is the update coming out? February is my birth month and I would laugh if it would come out around the 27th.
https://twitter.com/NicheGame/status/826870060417429504
https://twitter.com/NicheGame/status/826879924367671296
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Date Posted: Jan 21, 2017 @ 2:34am
Posts: 17