Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne Nov 17, 2012 @ 1:29pm
Help me figure out how to beat a good dead ringer spy.
I frequently find myself fighting these feisty foes and feeling frightfully furious for it.

So here are my questions;

1. Does the dead ringer stop bleeding damage?

2. Does the dead ringer extinguish players who were burning before they used their dead ringer?

3. If a player is on fire before they pull out their dead ringer will that set off the dead ringer, or will it not engage until the player has been hit again?

4. How long are dead ringer players invulnerable to damage?

5. For each of the classes, what are your favorite strategies for getting a domination on a saharan or a dead ringer spy?
Last edited by Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne; Nov 17, 2012 @ 1:32pm
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Gangrene Toe Loss Nov 17, 2012 @ 1:35pm 
-as far as I'm concerned, yes
-yes
-if they are currently burning and pull it out, it will activate it
-They aren't invulnerable, they just have a high damage resistance
-Pyro: it's the easiest and most practical way
Octavia Nov 17, 2012 @ 1:49pm 
I believe that Bleed damage is kept, and while it will extinguish Fire, and can be triggered by Afterburn, they can be re-ignited, unless they happen to pull out the Spycicle; if they do, you can still knock them around with explosions, hear the crisping of Flames hitting if you're a Pyro or simply predict their path.

The best strategy is to be aware; first of all, never assume a Spy is dead, unless you know they are not running the Dead Ringer. Dead Ringer Spies, despite being somewhat difficult to kill, can be rather easy to uproot; they cannot manually Cloak, they can be re-ignited by Flames, they can be bounced and I believe after eight seconds they will shimmer if damaged or if they touch an ally. The Dead Ringer lasts a relatively short amount of time, and if you can hog the ammo crates nearby, the Spy can be relatively easy to see uncloaking. Also note that after the eight seconds of no shimmer, they will lose the high damage resistance they get; this means that, even if Cloaked, they are essentially as vulnerable as a Spy using any other watch, especially since the Dead Ringer will retain sixty percent of the meter when uncloaking, even if they instantly uncloak after using it.

The key to beating him really is awareness; if you're aware that he is still alive, take the adequate precautions by watching your back, both by literally checking it and listening for the sound of him uncloaking. A good Pyro can shut him down completely, as the Flames can ignite him if sprayed for a little bit after the Spy dies, and the Airblast can also make a Spy follow a predictable path if he uses the Spycicle; simply Airblast him if you hear the distinct sound of it melting, and predict the path he takes. Chances are you'll be able to re-ignite him, and finish him off.

Various classes have their specific Spychecking methods, but short of being able to cause Bleed damage, marking them for death, soaking them in a liquid such as Jarate or Mad Milk, or finding them when they shimmer, you can't do much directly. Predicting where the Spy may go will help, as will denying him any ammo to refill his Cloak; all in all, you really just need to catch him with his Dead Ringer down, which will involve being aware of the fact that he has it, and never assuming he is dead unless you can be completely certain of it. A Spy who uses the Dead Ringer has to use solely trickery in order to deceive you, rather than stealth, and so the more aware you are, the easier it is to defeat him.
Last edited by Octavia; Nov 17, 2012 @ 1:52pm
Tolna Nov 17, 2012 @ 2:07pm 
Pyro: Airblast to corner and bodyblock him while chopping away. Or airblasting off cliff sides.

Solider: Trigger feign, scan area without giving chace to see where he went (by seeing health/ammo dissapear magically), and call out where he went and ignore or flank.

Demo: Same as solider except you may trap a corridor if you arn't busy.

Scout: chase him down, milk him so he's visible, or use the cleaver on him after he feigns, follow untill uncloak and blast.

Sniper: Jarate and bodyshot with rifle when uncloaked, DO NOT MELE HIM!

Spy: Revolver and call location and go on about your business.

Engineer: Just ignore him when he feigns, call location.

Medic: Syringe to cause feign the alert location and keep a close eye on his whereabouts. Let teammates pick him up while you focus on healing. DO NOT MELE THE SPY!

Heavy: Same as medic, give chase if nobody els is helping, and always, DO NOT MELE HIM!
Gangrene Toe Loss Nov 17, 2012 @ 2:21pm 
Wait, why shouldn't you melee a DR'd spy? It's doing damage all the same, and there's no visible downside to it.
Octavia Nov 17, 2012 @ 2:32pm 
A skilled Spy can attempt to backstab you in a Melee fight, and depending on the hit detection it can lead to a backstab you clearly did not deserve; although I wouldn't say that engaging a Spy in Melee combat is a bad thing, it is a risk that must be evaluated. Rather than being overzealous, like a Demoknight, you must play a little more cautiously in a Melee fight; considering that method, which may give his Dead Ringer time to recharge, Melee combat with a Spy can be a high risk situation that you must quickly terminate in order to be successful. In that respect, I simply find it better to engage him with your Primary or Secondary, unless you happen to be a Sniper using Jarate and the Bushwacka; a single hit will kill him if he cannot trigger his Dead Ringer, and so it can quickly terminate a fight.

I think the main aspect as to why a Dead Ringer Spy should not be engaged in Melee combat is time; generally speaking, I find that attempting to Melee fight a Dead Ringer Spy will lead to him obtaining his Dead Ringer by avoiding me, and then feigning. I'm much more confident with using a ranged method, as it leaves me less vulnerable to a backstab while allowing me to engage him with a weapon that deals more damage, barring good hit detection and skilled Melee hits.
Gangrene Toe Loss Nov 17, 2012 @ 2:42pm 
Well, I'm referring to the time after he activates it. From then until his cloak is depleted, you've got an effective way to dish out some damage.

For when he isn't, yeah, it's normally high risk-low reward.
Last edited by Gangrene Toe Loss; Nov 17, 2012 @ 2:42pm
Octavia Nov 17, 2012 @ 2:50pm 
Personally, even after he activates it, I find that he usually has enough time to stall you in order to recoup his Dead Ringer, at least in a Melee based engagement. That's simply personal experience, and I find that the Primary or Secondary weapons of a class perform much better; although if you're talking about after he activates it and his eight seconds of high damage resistance are expired, then yes, dealing Melee damage is quite effective. Although this assumes he picks up ammo along the way, and is careless enough to be discovered; considering the skill of the Spies I've seen, that's not too far of a stretch.

Although I usually see that opportunity present itself with Cloak and Dagger or Stock Watch Spies, rather than with the Dead Ringer; I'm sure it's a viable method after he uses his Dead Ringer, but I find engaging him in other fashions to be less of a risk. In any case, a Spy which you've discovered shimmering is ripe to any form of attack, although I personally prefer weapons with a high amount of shots or with a large splash to find him, as they cover the most ground in the least amount of time. In any case, Melee can be a viable option if performed under the appropriate circumstances, but I usually find other weapons to be both more effective, in terms of damage, and allow a more secure engagement of the Spy for myself.
GarnetSnatcher Nov 17, 2012 @ 2:58pm 
Originally posted by NØ LØV∑ D∑∑P W∏B:
I frequently find myself fighting these feisty foes and feeling frightfully furious for it.

So here are my questions;

1. Does the dead ringer stop bleeding damage? Yes

2. Does the dead ringer extinguish players who were burning before they used their dead ringer? Yes

3. If a player is on fire before they pull out their dead ringer will that set off the dead ringer, or will it not engage until the player has been hit again? Don't understand the question

4. How long are dead ringer players invulnerable to damage? until it runs out

5. For each of the classes, what are your favorite strategies for getting a domination on a saharan or a dead ringer spy? Nothing
Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne Nov 17, 2012 @ 3:15pm 
Originally posted by GarnetSnatcher:
Originally posted by NØ LØV∑ D∑∑P W∏B:
I frequently find myself fighting these feisty foes and feeling frightfully furious for it.

So here are my questions;

1. Does the dead ringer stop bleeding damage? Yes

2. Does the dead ringer extinguish players who were burning before they used their dead ringer? Yes

3. If a player is on fire before they pull out their dead ringer will that set off the dead ringer, or will it not engage until the player has been hit again? Don't understand the question

4. How long are dead ringer players invulnerable to damage? until it runs out

5. For each of the classes, what are your favorite strategies for getting a domination on a saharan or a dead ringer spy? Nothing


3. If the spy is already on fire before he hits the alt fire button to pull out the dead ringer, will the dead ringer be activated by this preceding fire?

4. not true. 6.5 seconds after cloaking.

5. nice answer.
Last edited by Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne; Nov 17, 2012 @ 3:22pm
Octavia Nov 17, 2012 @ 3:19pm 
Yes, the Dead Ringer can be activated by Afterburn damage; the next 'tick' of Afterburn will trigger the Dead Ringer while extinguishing the Spy. Do note that a Spy under the effects of Mad Milk or Jarate will not be relieved of these effects if his Dead Ringer is triggered, and I believe the same goes for being Marked for Death by the Fan O' War as well as Bleed damage.

The best counter really is a competent Pyro; otherwise, the best you can do is soak him in liquid, or be aware of the fact that he's still alive, which means you can check the common ammo locations for him. You can also check the environs; I've seen Spies uncloak in front of me without checking their back, and killed them before they could harm my allies. That is the kind of awareness you need, and knowing more common Spy tactics will assist you in being able to actively hunt them down.
Last edited by Octavia; Nov 17, 2012 @ 3:21pm
Tolna Nov 17, 2012 @ 3:38pm 
Originally posted by The Crit-Magnet Brony:
Wait, why shouldn't you melee a DR'd spy? It's doing damage all the same, and there's no visible downside to it.

A good spy can and WILL, Stairstab, Matador Stab, Shoulderstab, and even face stab you.

Sure you could mele him, but consider that if he gets a single hit in (again only applies to those real good spies) you get instakilled.

Good spies abuse that hitbox to no end and will use it for defence if you manage to get close.
Punchy Nov 17, 2012 @ 4:18pm 
IMO i would track him down, airblast him to corner and kill as a pyro
appleseed Nov 17, 2012 @ 5:18pm 
Spot-on alliteration and blasting some Death Grips at them works the best, in my opinion.
Mr. Fahrenheit Nov 17, 2012 @ 6:02pm 
One not-so noticeable technique for detecting a dead-ringer spy is the ammo he drops. Whatever weapon he leaves behind after his death, you will NOT gain ammo from it. By the way, you're a pretty literate person ;3
SilvertaildFox Nov 17, 2012 @ 6:51pm 
If you encounter an obvious DR spy (either walking straight past you or wanting you to trigger his DR) shoot in the general direction he was walking, chances are he still is.
Melee can be a good choice since most weapons have a distinct hit sound (like the frying pan).
Bleeding is removed when activated, but can be reapplied, though its hard to spot
Sometimes he is cloaking while his DR activates, the cloaking mechanic can count him not completely invisible thus showing his positon via the smoke effect
A general tip especially for engineers, as long as there is a lvl3 dispenser, he'll never be dead, lvl 3 dispensers fills cloak faster than its drained (regular & DR), so you might want to check ontop of the dispenser (thats where i usualy hang out)
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Date Posted: Nov 17, 2012 @ 1:29pm
Posts: 15