Fluffy Sackson Nov 12, 2012 @ 2:47pm
BUFF THE TOMISLAV
The tomislav was pretty OP back when it was 40%, SO MAKE IT 25% AND ADD ANOTHER DRAWBACK, SUCH AS A DAMAGE PENATLY. BECAUSE OF YOU ♥♥♥♥ING WHINERS, THE TOMISLAV IS PURE GARBAGE NOW, AND LOOK, EVEN YOU'RE COMPLAINING ABOUT IT. BUFF THE TOMISLAV. WE ALREADY HAVE ENOUGH WEAPONS IN THE GAME THAT ARE PLAIN GARBAGE AND STRAIGHT DOWNGRADES BECAUSE OF YOU STUPID WHINERS WHO JUST SUCK AT THE GAME. STOP ♥♥♥♥ING WHINING. THE ONLY WEAPON IN THE GAME THAT NEEDED A NERF WAS THE PHLOG (and maybe the powerjack). Thanks alot, losers
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Diet Dr. Beta Nov 12, 2012 @ 2:49pm 
Would you like some cheese with that whine? Sauce on them hater tots? Get over it and use something else.
Fluffy Sackson Nov 12, 2012 @ 2:52pm 
No ♥♥♥♥ing way. I'm not gonna just sit back and let those dumb whiners whine saying "OMG DIS GUN KILLED ME ONCE NERF NERF NERF!!!!!!!!11111111111" And I was a full time tomislav user and it's a straight downgrade now it's litterally 0.1 seconds faster than the stock. Hell, even the maker of the tomislav, colossal- is ♥♥♥♥ed off, and even worse THEY'RE NERFING IT AGAIN. TO JUST HAVE SILENT SPINUP AND SLOWER SPEED. Who the ♥♥♥♥ ambushes as heavy anyways?!
Octavia Nov 12, 2012 @ 3:02pm 
There are many weapons that arguably need a nerf or buff, while the Tomislav did originally need a nerf, I agree that it was overdone; there is nearly no difference between it and the Minigun, minus the damage. It should be buffed to the point where the Spin-Up time is noticeable, while attaching another downside; or it could have another mechanic added to it, but in any case it is currently underpowered. There is virtually no reason to use it over the Minigun, and although using the Heavy to ambush can be a somewhat effective strategy, depending on the map design, I agree it is not enough of an advantage; I personally believe it should be the opposite of the Brass Beast, in the sense that it would rapidly set up, but have a very harsh damage penalty to offset this.

It would turn into a weapon that could be used to ambush other classes on low Health, but in exchange it would be easy to flee from and be less effective in prolonged fights; I find that to be a suitable weapon, assuming they can properly balance it so that the Spin-Up is not nearly as instant, and the damage is not so pitiful it cannot kill anybody.
Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne Nov 12, 2012 @ 3:58pm 
I completely agree with this. It is too nerfed. It's getting to the point where it's almost a re-skin.

I disagree with octavia though; the Heavy is too slow for effective sneaking with a weak weapon. I find that the brass beast is the only weapon the heavy needs to sneak with, this is due to the slow spin up time and the high damage rate. If you want the tomislav to be something of an opposite of the brass beast then it needs to be the one that encourages you to charge in and fire in every direction. I don't even care about the silent spinup. Additionally weakening the tomislav is counterproductive as he is almost always targeted by offensive classes. He's a perfect target for demomen, soldiers, scouts, and spies. The quickdraw of the tomislav was wonderful, and I, personally prefer a slower firing rate to a straight damage penalty.

I think a good solution for this problem would be to figure out a way to balance it so that the damage per second is identical to the other miniguns from the moment the mouse button is depressed to the moment 150 (or some other number) points of damage has been dealt.

Also I am wont to distance myself from the thread creator's tone of voice, but then again, I agree with his point, and this is the internet. Let the voice of the insane be heard!
Last edited by Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne; Nov 12, 2012 @ 4:08pm
Octavia Nov 12, 2012 @ 4:01pm 
Originally posted by NØ LØV∑ D∑∑P W∏B:
I completely agree with this. It is too nerfed. It's getting to the point where it's almost a re-skin.

I disagree with octavia though.

Would you mean in terms of the changes I would apply? In all honesty, I'd be fine with any change that would diversify it significantly from the Minigun; as long as it were to be properly balanced, it could have any statistical change for all I care. It merely needs to stand out compared to the other Miniguns, since as you've said, it is nearly identical to the Stock Minigun; every other Minigun affects the Heavy in a major way, and so I feel that the Tomislav should as well.
ExtraCheesyPie Nov 12, 2012 @ 4:05pm 
The less people who use it the better,
TYPING IN CAPS WILL HELP
Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne Nov 12, 2012 @ 4:08pm 
Sorry, I just edited my previous comment

Originally posted by Octavia:
Originally posted by NØ LØV∑ D∑∑P W∏B:
I completely agree with this. It is too nerfed. It's getting to the point where it's almost a re-skin.

I disagree with octavia though.

Would you mean in terms of the changes I would apply? In all honesty, I'd be fine with any change that would diversify it significantly from the Minigun; as long as it were to be properly balanced, it could have any statistical change for all I care. It merely needs to stand out compared to the other Miniguns, since as you've said, it is nearly identical to the Stock Minigun; every other Minigun affects the Heavy in a major way, and so I feel that the Tomislav should as well.

I disagree with octavia though; the Heavy is too slow for effective sneaking with a weak weapon. I find that the brass beast is the only weapon the heavy needs to sneak with, this is due to the slow spin up time and the high damage rate. If you want the tomislav to be something of an opposite of the brass beast then it needs to be the one that encourages you to charge in and fire in every direction. I don't even care about the silent spinup. Additionally weakening the tomislav is counterproductive as he is almost always targeted by offensive classes. He's a perfect target for demomen, soldiers, scouts, and spies. The quickdraw of the tomislav was wonderful, and I, personally prefer a slower firing rate to a straight damage penalty.

I think a good solution for this problem would be to figure out a way to balance it so that the damage per second is identical to the other miniguns from the moment the mouse button is depressed to the moment 150 (or some other number) points of damage has been dealt.
Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne Nov 12, 2012 @ 4:10pm 
Am I crazy for saying this? I think sneaking is the best option with the brass beast because once you start firing you're not going anywhere until you, or your enemies are dead. You're pretty much a turret, locked in place with a powerful gun. So the problem posed by using it is that you have to find the most advantageous spot before you open fire. Which is funny because I usually use Family Business with the brass beast (its part of the tomislav's set) as a weapon to use while trying to find a sweet spot for killing 5 guys burgers and fries.
Last edited by Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne; Nov 12, 2012 @ 4:12pm
GarnetSnatcher Nov 12, 2012 @ 4:13pm 
CAPS HELP MUUUUUCH BETTER
Hank Peggy Bobby Luanne Nov 12, 2012 @ 4:16pm 
Additionally... At the end of this video you can see a comparison of tomislav and the minigun. They take care of a pyro in about the same amount of time. Personally I can't tell the difference except one of them STARTS firing slightly faster, and the other fires bullets more frequently... http://youtu.be/4ZXa5wkcWoI

The video is of course from this page... http://wiki.teamfortress.com/wiki/Tomislav
Octavia Nov 12, 2012 @ 4:18pm 
The Brass Beast, to my knowledge, is more used in a position where you know enemies will walk into, or in a position where you know they cannot easily escape; however, I do agree that the Tomislav should be more of an initial fight weapon, promoting quick engagements at the cost of a penalty in long-term fights. I find that makes perfect sense, and it does promote a unique method of play; quickly engage enemies in a situation where you can quickly dispatch of them, and the long-term fight penalty by making other Miniguns more effective in a long fight is an acceptable disadvantage.
Dat Badass Penguin Nov 12, 2012 @ 6:28pm 
yeah the tomislav needs a faster spin up time again to at least 25% cause the 10% increase is barely anything, thx for bringing dis up and i hope valve acknowledges dis
Mucinex Nov 12, 2012 @ 6:29pm 
This thread.
Best Slug North America Nov 12, 2012 @ 6:36pm 
Originally posted by FARRT:
This thread.

Is epic.
PackmanJohnny Nov 12, 2012 @ 7:22pm 
Originally posted by Chicken Launcher:
Originally posted by FARRT:
This thread.

Is an epic fail.


fixed your grammar X3

on topic tho, YES TYPING IN CAPS ALWAYS GETS VALVES ATTENTION AND MAKES YOU LOOK INTELLIGENT AT THE SAME TIME WHOA LOOK AT ME IM PRO NOW CUZ I USE CAPS.

OP is raging hard. im not sure what the original tomi stats were, but ♥♥♥♥♥ing about it just makes you look like the idiots who cry NERF NERF NERF111111TEH GUISE KEELED ME WIF DAT GUHN111 NERF I SAY NERF TEH GUHN1111

just sayin
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Date Posted: Nov 12, 2012 @ 2:47pm
Posts: 18