Joulevard Jan 27, 2013 @ 10:17pm
Overpowered Weps + Ideas to fix them.
Just post some of the weapons you believe are overpowered, and some ideas on how the devs can fix them and/or make them more useful and balanced.
Showing 1-15 of 39 comments
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His Dudeness Jan 27, 2013 @ 10:41pm 
Red Tape, just remove it lol. Well at very least make it a little less of an instant screw over.
100% Recycled Awesome Jan 27, 2013 @ 11:16pm 
RTR Is broken. Other than that, nothing is overpowered.
2↓st Sentry Gentleman Jan 27, 2013 @ 11:47pm 
The Milkman set bonus needs some sort of downside.

The Wrangler's shield needs to be tuned down.

The Red Tape Recorder needs to require the intended 3 seconds per downgrade.

The Escape Plan needs an actual longevity downside [and re-merge it with the Eq].

Frosty Andy Jan 28, 2013 @ 12:21am 
Pomson 5000, I still hate it, while playing as Medic (fortunaly, I dont find any Engineer with Pomson while playing as Spy). Must not drain Uber and cloak charges on hit. Maybe reduce health on Engi while equipped
Last edited by Frosty Andy; Jan 28, 2013 @ 12:24am
什果宾治 Jan 28, 2013 @ 12:42am 
Red tape recorder since it's superior to the sapper in every scenario.
Sentient_Toaster Jan 28, 2013 @ 12:56am 
Originally posted by ROYAL_CHAIRFORCE:
The Milkman set bonus needs some sort of downside.

It's probably mostly that accurately aiming the shortstop while doing the usual dodge-like-crazy methamphetamine scout thing is not exactly the easiest thing to do, so most people end up being better off in practice with a scattergun despite the shortstop's midrange damage being theoretically extremely powerful when combined with the scout's mobility. It's not that dissimilar to e.g. the Bazaar Bargain in this respect; it has amazingly high potential w/ up to 50% faster charge, but you have to be very very good at headshots for it to be a better choice than stock.

The Wrangler's shield needs to be tuned down.

Perhaps, but I'd like to see this tested heavily as the reduction might have a pretty big impact on map balancing. Some think the shield should completely go, some argue for 50% off or the like, others question the aim-assist. Not clear to me what's reasonable.

Honestly, I'm more annoyed by the Gunslinger's effect:effort curve at the low end -- it's not particularly powerful (although it arguably has an outsized impact on KOTH maps, due to the short 3:00 min timers and the single central CP being far, far more important than anywhere else in the map), it can just be very annoying for very low effort. It could use better skill-indexing of some kind.


The Red Tape Recorder needs to require the intended 3 seconds per downgrade.

And, probably, lose the "immediately drains dispenser of all metal" bit, which makes undoing damage very difficult even if the buildings are almost immediately desapped.

The Escape Plan needs an actual longevity downside [and re-merge it with the Eq].

Honorbound... /jk.

I don't know that I'd merge them back again, as high-speed gambling on massive melee damage isn't what I'd want to encourage.
R∆.GE Jan 28, 2013 @ 4:40am 
The damn Gunsliger with it's mini-sentries is OP.
SonicDude Jan 28, 2013 @ 4:42am 
And all of it is the engineers who use the pomsons, wrangler (il wrangle you to the ceiling) and FINALLY the gunslinger
and the seal mask just to be more evil
nuff said
Mustache Musty Man Jan 28, 2013 @ 4:53am 
I say Gunslinger mini sentry ruins every thing
InvisibleWater Jan 28, 2013 @ 5:17am 
Mini-Sentries: Actually decrease their range

Red-Tape Recorder: Fix the downgrade times
Party Cow #Krophs Jan 28, 2013 @ 6:09am 
No weapons are technically overpowered, but some might want removed cuz everyone can't fight them

Only thing somewhat op is red-tape recorder, but not when it comes to mini-sentries and destroying a sentry completely...
Lord Frenzlin Jan 28, 2013 @ 6:33am 
RTR definitly needs a nerf.
2↓st Sentry Gentleman Jan 28, 2013 @ 9:06am 
Originally posted by Sentient_Toaster:
It's probably mostly that accurately aiming the shortstop while doing the usual dodge-like-crazy methamphetamine scout thing is not exactly the easiest thing to do, so most people end up being better off in practice with a scattergun despite the shortstop's midrange damage being theoretically extremely powerful when combined with the scout's mobility. It's not that dissimilar to e.g. the Bazaar Bargain in this respect; it has amazingly high potential w/ up to 50% faster charge, but you have to be very very good at headshots for it to be a better choice than stock.
That comparison is a bit off; just like the Eyelander the Bazaar Bargain is all about surviving a hard and dire childhood to become a very very grumpy old man one day while the Shortstop is a weapon giving somebody who knows how to use it a significant upside over stock in many situations right away, much like the Ambassador.
By itself its competences doubtlessly are balanced by their requirement and stock's reliability but now enter Mad Milk, an unlock unaffected by the Shortstop's ammo drain and one whose AoE-afterburn-extinguishing in conjunction with the ability to apply twice the Croncheror buff without any form of setup requirement boost not only the Scout's team support but also his own longevity by a bunch while taking away what'd normally be his only mid range weapon - that drawback however is neatly covered by the Shortstop as well.
And now add 25 free extra max health on top of that.

Is that still balanced?
Because to me it feels like one'd add a massive upside-only set effect to a weapon combo that already synergizes about as well as the Degreaser + Axtinguisher.
Perhaps, but I'd like to see this tested heavily as the reduction might have a pretty big impact on map balancing. Some think the shield should completely go, some argue for 50% off or the like, others question the aim-assist. Not clear to me what's reasonable.

Honestly, I'm more annoyed by the Gunslinger's effect:effort curve at the low end -- it's not particularly powerful (although it arguably has an outsized impact on KOTH maps, due to the short 3:00 min timers and the single central CP being far, far more important than anywhere else in the map), it can just be very annoying for very low effort. It could use better skill-indexing of some kind.
All agreed.

And, probably, lose the "immediately drains dispenser of all metal" bit, which makes undoing damage very difficult even if the buildings are almost immediately desapped.
It's pretty hard to tell where the features end and the bugs start on this thing..

Honorbound... /jk.

I don't know that I'd merge them back again, as high-speed gambling on massive melee damage isn't what I'd want to encourage.
I beg to differ on this one.
The original Equalizer was meant to be exactly that: A kamikaze-run weapon.
And kamikaze runs were not the problematic aspect of the Eq, a 10 health soldier charging at you flailing a melee weapon wasn't over the top hard to counter to say the least and fun to use.
No, what people found annoying was that Soldiers [ab]using the movespeed boost at low health for free getaways practically got an extra increase in survivability at no cost.
And call me crazy but as far as I am concerned the decision to make the weapon's damage a flat-rate didn't accomplish much but butchering the aspect about the item that used to be cool balance and gameplay-wise.

Your joke isn't exactly a bad idea though.
I could imagine rolling together all, the Equalizer, the Escape Plan and the Zaitoichi's stats combined to one weapon might actually solve the problems of every single one.
Last edited by 2↓st Sentry Gentleman; Jan 28, 2013 @ 9:14am
purex Jan 28, 2013 @ 9:29am 
Gunslinger: Mini sentry has 15%-30% less range and costs 105-110 metal. There, solved the game for ya, Valve. Please hire me.
2↓st Sentry Gentleman Jan 28, 2013 @ 9:45am 
Originally posted by purex.:
Gunslinger: Mini sentry has 15%-30% less range and costs 105-110 metal. There, solved the game for ya, Valve. Please hire me.
Or you could take a look at the aspects of the item that actually are problematic.

Like the 130% tracking speed, which, in conjunction with its monumentel knockback, is making the Minisentry as imprevious to circle strafing as a fully grown level 3.

Or the fact that it is deployed at 100 health where every other building starts at 1 hitpoint, and what's more that it regenerates ~33 health per second while constructing.


I think there would neither be complaints from the Gunslinger users nor any more hatred against them if we'd tune a Minisentry's knockback down to stock level, tune tracking speed down to stock level and when it comes to health let it build up like any normal building.
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Date Posted: Jan 27, 2013 @ 10:17pm
Posts: 39