Team Fortress 2 > Obecné diskuze > Detaily tématu
[poptart] MINISATAN NERFED!!!!!! 22. úno. v 10.46 odp.
Why do some weapons reward stupidity rather than skill or strategy?
Phlogistinator
Enforcer
Mini Sentries
Beggars Bazooka
Blutsauger
Huntsman
Pomson

All these weapons give exceptional benefits with no real downside with no skill involve, they reward you for playing the game incorrectly or just being dumb, phlog says you wm1ed instead of helping your team with airblast have health and crits

Enforcer- free 60 damage shots for firing speed that is not a big deal due to how revolvers are accurate through timed shots

Mini sentries- free kills on pyros and scouts for press 4 and 1, in exchange for not being able to back up your team

Beggars- Who needs to aim when you can spam 3 rockets at once and kill someone anyway?

Blutsauger- When your a medic you should run away from danger not run at it with your needle gun trying to sap a spec of health from an enemy before you get hit with that last rocket.

Huntsman- Much larger hitbox and faster damage in exchange for not having a scope?

Pomson- spam down a hall with infinite ammo and range, get free uber and cloak drain cause, why not

I dont think these weapons are overpowered or underpowered I just dont get who would design weapons around stupidity instead of skill
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C14 (Zabanován) 22. úno. v 10.51 odp. 
Huntman is hard. Really hard.
Piece of Piss (No Monitor) 22. úno. v 10.53 odp. 
Although huntsman is for ♥♥♥♥♥s, anyone who faces off against me (I use stock) using one gets rekt. Almost instantaneously. Because, as I've said countless times before; bullets > arrows.

One is instantaneous, the other is not.
Naposledy upravil Piece of Piss (No Monitor); 22. úno. v 10.54 odp.
The Real Frollo 22. úno. v 10.56 odp. 
I like how everyone thinks that you don't need to aim with the beggars... Sorry, but sitting ere and simply shotting into a wall will get you as much kills as with the regular rocket launcher. I will agree with you it's a very gimmicky weapon, but just because there's a slight angle offset doesn't mean you're not supposed to aim. In close combat the rockets are fairly accurate with the aim, while at long ranges aim means nothing, but you can't get any kills that way. Not aiming and getting kills don't apply to this weapon, it works best in close combat, where aiming still fairly works. Using it in long ranged combat usually 9/10 won't result in any kills due to lack of precise rockets.
I really have no complaints for the rest... Except the blutsauger... It's not stupidty. Running away from an enemy won't do anything except get you killed. At least attempting to kill the Pershing enemy and staying alive will benefit you more than running away like a coward. The syringe gun is there for this reason.
Zombie Jesus -UT- 22. úno. v 11.00 odp. 
Mini sentries are an attack weapon especially when it is used with the frontier justice which provides revenge crits. You have to know how where to place them or they get taken out easy. Just goes to show how much this dude doesn't understand the game.
Senator Lugia 22. úno. v 11.06 odp. 
Phlog can be used for thoughtless charging, but that's still not much better than idiots with a normal Flamethrower. When charged with strategy and deployed on time, it can be a devastating weapon.
Beggar's isn't bad, it's the point of a Salvo. While coming upon one who has just loaded up is an unlucky encounter, if they're unloaded, they're easier to take out than a stock Soldier.
Huntsman is different than a Rifle. I won't say that it takes more skill or less to be proficient. Often, people with ♥♥♥♥ poor aim will miss constantly, but get the occasional lucky headshot that makes people rage.
Pomson is a mid-range alternative to the Shotgun. It's easy as hell to dodge at range, though, and doesn't do as much meatshot damage as any Shotgun.

The others...meh.
number 22. úno. v 11.29 odp. 
Phlog - Entirely useless. If I see the mmmph taunt or whatever, I just run in the other direction.
Enforcer - If a spy has to take out their revolver then there's zero excuse for them to win the confrontation, unless they get some lucky shots off. The ambassador is really the only one to be worried about, imo.
Mini sentries - Yeah, hate em'. I play a lot of koth, so I see a lot of these. I don't really know what to say about it though. Servers with gunslinger engineers tend to empty out pretty quickly, so have fun when half your team has to be balanced to the other side. =D
Beggars Bazooka - Joke of a weapon. Don't be caught in close quarters and you'll be fine.
Blutsauger - I don't have a problem with it. It's fine if you get caught by yourself. Lay some spam out and hope to land your shots. However, if medics are going out of their way to get kills then that means they aren't giving the heals. That can be a problem.
Huntsman - I play scout as a main so the huntsman doesn't bother me. Close in the distance while strafing and jumping.
Pomson - Super annoying and pomson crits are just mind numbingly fair. Again, it's projectile based and extremely slow, so close the distance and clean up.
Naposledy upravil number; 22. úno. v 11.31 odp.
[poptart] MINISATAN NERFED!!!!!! 22. úno. v 11.41 odp. 
Adjutant SteemingBullet původně napsal:
I like how everyone thinks that you don't need to aim with the beggars... Sorry, but sitting ere and simply shotting into a wall will get you as much kills as with the regular rocket launcher. I will agree with you it's a very gimmicky weapon, but just because there's a slight angle offset doesn't mean you're not supposed to aim. In close combat the rockets are fairly accurate with the aim, while at long ranges aim means nothing, but you can't get any kills that way. Not aiming and getting kills don't apply to this weapon, it works best in close combat, where aiming still fairly works. Using it in long ranged combat usually 9/10 won't result in any kills due to lack of precise rockets.
I really have no complaints for the rest... Except the blutsauger... It's not stupidty. Running away from an enemy won't do anything except get you killed. At least attempting to kill the Pershing enemy and staying alive will benefit you more than running away like a coward. The syringe gun is there for this reason.
,
Say your fighting a soldier or demo, a good medic will try and serf the explosions and get away, you can shoot needles at the enemy while doing this as a distraction or to add some additional damage but your goal is to get to another power class that can defend you, if there are none you probably overextended without either a quickfix, or real ubercharge to save yourself in case of an emergency in which case you deserve to die.
[poptart] MINISATAN NERFED!!!!!! 22. úno. v 11.49 odp. 
Panic původně napsal:
Phlog - Entirely useless. If I see the mmmph taunt or whatever, I just run in the other direction.
Enforcer - If a spy has to take out their revolver then there's zero excuse for them to win the confrontation, unless they get some lucky shots off. The ambassador is really the only one to be worried about, imo.
Mini sentries - Yeah, hate em'. I play a lot of koth, so I see a lot of these. I don't really know what to say about it though. Servers with gunslinger engineers tend to empty out pretty quickly, so have fun when half your team has to be balanced to the other side. =D
Beggars Bazooka - Joke of a weapon. Don't be caught in close quarters and you'll be fine.
Blutsauger - I don't have a problem with it. It's fine if you get caught by yourself. Lay some spam out and hope to land your shots. However, if medics are going out of their way to get kills then that means they aren't giving the heals. That can be a problem.
Huntsman - I play scout as a main so the huntsman doesn't bother me. Close in the distance while strafing and jumping.
Pomson - Super annoying and pomson crits are just mind numbingly fair. Again, it's projectile based and extremely slow, so close the distance and clean up.

Like I said im not arguing they are overpowered, I find all these weapons except pomson mini sentries and enforcer to be balanced, I just dont get why so many weapons teach noobs to play badly instead of well if these weapons, and theyd be easy to change to

enforcer- cant see enemy health, 60 damage per shot and the spy can tell if you have enough health? too much this makes you sacrifice something actually important for that damage.

pomson- add penetration remove uber drain lower cloak drain to 5% and only on close range, making it better for harrasing your long range counters and add some extra damage to your team from behind but remove the free bonuses, you have to be close to a spy and the spy can move to the side to avoid more than 10% of his cloak being drained.

phlog- change crits to mini crits, make it give you full overheal and add an airblast that deletes projectiles instead of reflecting them "short circuit but with fire rate and hitbox of normal airblast" and make it not charge on fire but on deleted projectiles. 12 deleted projectiles will charge your mppph and let you heal and mini crit making it teach you how be helpful instead of stupid

Mini Sentries- give a small 30% damage vulnerability to fire and bullets, making it so a heavy doesnt have to have a stalemate with a sentry for 6 seconds at midrange and scouts can more reliably 2 shot them, making them as easy to destroy as they are to kill, I would even be willing to make the gunslinger add 50 health instead of 25 if this change was implemented.
[poptart] MINISATAN NERFED!!!!!! 22. úno. v 11.54 odp. 
Zombie Jesus původně napsal:
Mini sentries are an attack weapon especially when it is used with the frontier justice which provides revenge crits. You have to know how where to place them or they get taken out easy. Just goes to show how much this dude doesn't understand the game.

- mini sentries are offensive NO ♥♥♥♥, you need to know good placement, no clearly youve never played koth as any non explosive class, its not how easily destroyed that matters its that the second you drop a mini another ones up the second its taken down, and if you want anything you have to say to be taken seriously insulting a players knowledge of a game your own argument is a crutch, try using actual examples and facts besides the obvious
number 22. úno. v 11.56 odp. 
Poptart Immaculation původně napsal:
Panic původně napsal:
Phlog - Entirely useless. If I see the mmmph taunt or whatever, I just run in the other direction.
Enforcer - If a spy has to take out their revolver then there's zero excuse for them to win the confrontation, unless they get some lucky shots off. The ambassador is really the only one to be worried about, imo.
Mini sentries - Yeah, hate em'. I play a lot of koth, so I see a lot of these. I don't really know what to say about it though. Servers with gunslinger engineers tend to empty out pretty quickly, so have fun when half your team has to be balanced to the other side. =D
Beggars Bazooka - Joke of a weapon. Don't be caught in close quarters and you'll be fine.
Blutsauger - I don't have a problem with it. It's fine if you get caught by yourself. Lay some spam out and hope to land your shots. However, if medics are going out of their way to get kills then that means they aren't giving the heals. That can be a problem.
Huntsman - I play scout as a main so the huntsman doesn't bother me. Close in the distance while strafing and jumping.
Pomson - Super annoying and pomson crits are just mind numbingly fair. Again, it's projectile based and extremely slow, so close the distance and clean up.

Like I said im not arguing they are overpowered, I find all these weapons except pomson mini sentries and enforcer to be balanced, I just dont get why so many weapons teach noobs to play badly instead of well if these weapons, and theyd be easy to change to

enforcer- cant see enemy health, 60 damage per shot and the spy can tell if you have enough health? too much this makes you sacrifice something actually important for that damage.

pomson- add penetration remove uber drain lower cloak drain to 5% and only on close range, making it better for harrasing your long range counters and add some extra damage to your team from behind but remove the free bonuses, you have to be close to a spy and the spy can move to the side to avoid more than 10% of his cloak being drained.

phlog- change crits to mini crits, make it give you full overheal and add an airblast that deletes projectiles instead of reflecting them "short circuit but with fire rate and hitbox of normal airblast" and make it not charge on fire but on deleted projectiles. 12 deleted projectiles will charge your mppph and let you heal and mini crit making it teach you how be helpful instead of stupid

Mini Sentries- give a small 30% damage vulnerability to fire and bullets, making it so a heavy doesnt have to have a stalemate with a sentry for 6 seconds at midrange and scouts can more reliably 2 shot them, making them as easy to destroy as they are to kill, I would even be willing to make the gunslinger add 50 health instead of 25 if this change was implemented.
That's fine, just putting out my own opinion on them.
They are as some say "noob friendly". But I think everyone eventually gets to the understanding that some of these weapons are frowned upon by a large group and change their loadout accordingly. Just give it time. =)
Zombie Jesus -UT- 23. úno. v 12.12 dop. 
Poptart Immaculation původně napsal:
Zombie Jesus původně napsal:
Mini sentries are an attack weapon especially when it is used with the frontier justice which provides revenge crits. You have to know how where to place them or they get taken out easy. Just goes to show how much this dude doesn't understand the game.

- mini sentries are offensive NO ♥♥♥♥, you need to know good placement, no clearly youve never played koth as any non explosive class, its not how easily destroyed that matters its that the second you drop a mini another ones up the second its taken down, and if you want anything you have to say to be taken seriously insulting a players knowledge of a game your own argument is a crutch, try using actual examples and facts besides the obvious

Poptart a mini sentry is lethal at close quarters but easily taken out at a distance. Your post here really shows a lack of understanding to the capabilities, the strengths and the weaknesses of weapons used in TF2. By the way I don't have a problem with any of the weapons stated as I deal with them. If you don't like being called out then don't post in an open forum.
_METALLIC_ 23. úno. v 12.42 dop. 
The only weps i ♥♥♥♥ing hate are the Soda popper and mini sentries
0zinga 23. úno. v 1.30 dop. 
they're not based on stupidity, they're options. If you already have a medic, combat medic is fun and still usefull. Same could be said for the otthers.
Cpt. Walker 23. úno. v 1.34 dop. 
just saying, 3 rockets can't kill a heavy not even if the 3 are direct impacts, that's the real downside of the 3 rocket clip launchers
[poptart] MINISATAN NERFED!!!!!! 23. úno. v 10.30 dop. 
Zombie Jesus původně napsal:
Poptart Immaculation původně napsal:

- mini sentries are offensive NO ♥♥♥♥, you need to know good placement, no clearly youve never played koth as any non explosive class, its not how easily destroyed that matters its that the second you drop a mini another ones up the second its taken down, and if you want anything you have to say to be taken seriously insulting a players knowledge of a game your own argument is a crutch, try using actual examples and facts besides the obvious

Poptart a mini sentry is lethal at close quarters but easily taken out at a distance. Your post here really shows a lack of understanding to the capabilities, the strengths and the weaknesses of weapons used in TF2. By the way I don't have a problem with any of the weapons stated as I deal with them. If you don't like being called out then don't post in an open forum.

I dont care about being called out, its just a general rule of debating and disscussion that when you stoop down to insulting the other person it means you have either ran out of valid points or had none to begin with, and its true minies are easily killed at close range, but in the time it takes you to get up to a mini in close range it takes you about a minimum of 60 health and an average of about 115 health to get up to one placed in an intelligent spot, so as a pyro or scout you have to sacrifice a large portion of your health and potentially be killed by the engineer after doing so, especially if the engie has a frontier justice full of crits, then when your killed or gone, it only takes the engie to clicks to place another one, its not a matter of how easily destroyed they are because even if you destroy one an engineer with common sense will have another one up in 2 seconds,
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