Bob Loblaw (Banned) Feb 20 @ 4:51pm
Duped unusuals question
I'm currently in the middle of a debate about whether duped unusuals effect the price of high or low tier hats more

His argument for high tier: Since there are fewer high tiers, a dupe would have a bigger impact. It's common sense; adding an extra rare hat would have a bigger impact than adding an extra common hat. Also that the people willing to spend more money on a hat would be more picky on the hat they get

My argument for low tier: There are so many people that want a high tier (I used Cloudy Team Captain as my example), that they wouldn't care if it's duped just as long as they get the hat and effect. It also goes the other way, there's a lower demand and higher number of low tiers, that people could easily find a cleaner low tier, as opposed to a high tier that might only have 1 or 2 in existence. Finally, most people looking for Cloudy Team Captains aren't planning on buying them just to trade it for another unusual like most lower tiers, they're usually there for the status.

Anyway, what do you all think? Do dupes effect higher or lower tier hats more?
Last edited by Bob Loblaw; Feb 20 @ 5:07pm
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-W3E- Dat Jane Doe Feb 20 @ 4:54pm 
Bit curious with the quantity thing with tiers. Does the tier of the hat really decrease its quantity? I mean doesnt a nut n bolts ketche have the same probabality of being unboxed as a burning team captain? Its a random hat from a list of possibilities and a random effect to go with it.

Also dupes effect how much the player cares for the hat, which is common in higher tiers. An unwanted unusual doesnt change in much value as no one wants it anyways while a burning killers exclusive would probably lose 30 buds of value
Last edited by -W3E- Dat Jane Doe; Feb 20 @ 4:54pm
Bob Loblaw (Banned) Feb 20 @ 5:00pm 
Originally posted by -W3E-Pyratar The Last Airblaster:
Bit curious with the quantity thing with tiers. Does the tier of the hat really decrease its quantity? I mean doesnt a nut n bolts ketche have the same probabality of being unboxed as a burning team captain? Its a random hat from a list of possibilities and a random effect to go with it.

Also dupes effect how much the player cares for the hat, which is common in higher tiers. An unwanted unusual doesnt change in much value as no one wants it anyways while a burning killers exclusive would probably lose 30 buds of value

I've always wondered that too! And there are still a ton of people on unusual servers and tf2outpost looking to buy lower tier unusuals. Also, I have seen duped high tiers sell for their clean price since a lot of people are looking to buy the hat just to wear it. They weren't planning on reselling it.
Zombie Jesus -UT- Feb 20 @ 8:20pm 
In the main for any tier hat and effect if there is a clean one and a duped one for the same price people will always go for the clean. So the dupe is cheaper (Check HOUWAR trades as an example). Some people also like the thought of having an 'untainted' hat i.e. not duped and no scammers in the history. That also makes a hat less desirable therefore cheaper. So the answer is a duped hat no matter what type and level are cheaper.
Sam Hall |BBQ| Feb 20 @ 8:23pm 
meh, same hat, same effect; who cares...tf2 economy is all screwey since it existed before the steam market
Zombie Jesus -UT- Feb 20 @ 8:25pm 
All work the same Sam but people who trade do care and most players from squeakers to old timers trade these days.
Bob Loblaw (Banned) Feb 20 @ 8:27pm 
Originally posted by Zombie Jesus:
In the main for any tier hat and effect if there is a clean one and a duped one for the same price people will always go for the clean. So the dupe is cheaper (Check HOUWAR trades as an example). Some people also like the thought of having an 'untainted' hat i.e. not duped and no scammers in the history. That also makes a hat less desirable therefore cheaper. So the answer is a duped hat no matter what type and level are cheaper.

Yes, but do high tiers or low tiers become more cheaper?
Zombie Jesus -UT- Feb 20 @ 8:38pm 
Originally posted by The Doctor and His Companion:
Originally posted by Zombie Jesus:
In the main for any tier hat and effect if there is a clean one and a duped one for the same price people will always go for the clean. So the dupe is cheaper (Check HOUWAR trades as an example). Some people also like the thought of having an 'untainted' hat i.e. not duped and no scammers in the history. That also makes a hat less desirable therefore cheaper. So the answer is a duped hat no matter what type and level are cheaper.

Yes, but do high tiers or low tiers become more cheaper?

I can buy a duped HOUWAR for instance cheaper than an equivalent clean one. Also same applies for a Stormy Madame Dixie for instance. The duped ones are harder to sell and always need to be discounted.
Bob Loblaw (Banned) Feb 20 @ 9:18pm 
Originally posted by Zombie Jesus:
Originally posted by The Doctor and His Companion:

Yes, but do high tiers or low tiers become more cheaper?

I can buy a duped HOUWAR for instance cheaper than an equivalent clean one. Also same applies for a Stormy Madame Dixie for instance. The duped ones are harder to sell and always need to be discounted.
Let me rephrase my question:
Are people more willing to pay the clean price for a duped high tier or low tier?
Zombie Jesus -UT- Feb 20 @ 9:25pm 
Yes if there are no other equivalent hats and effects. No if there is a clean equivalent hat and effect. What's so hard to understand about that?
Zombie Jesus -UT- Feb 20 @ 9:26pm 
That applies to both high and low tier hats.

I really suggest you go to TF2 Outpost and watch the trades there if you don't believe me.
Bob Loblaw (Banned) Feb 20 @ 10:30pm 
Originally posted by Zombie Jesus:
Yes if there are no other equivalent hats and effects. No if there is a clean equivalent hat and effect. What's so hard to understand about that?

No, I understand you perfectly. You're the one that's misunderstanding me. I know that both high and low tier hats decrease in value when they're duped, I'm not asking whether or not they do, what I am asking is which tier goes down MORE.
Zombie Jesus -UT- Feb 20 @ 10:46pm 
OK lets do the maths: We have a Clean TC for 50 buds. I would believe that mopst would not want to pay much more than 40 for it. That equates to a 20% drop in value. The same applies to a Stormy Dixie. They usually go for around 20 keys. For a duped one you would have to sell it for less around 15 keys. How do I know? I have bought a diped Secret Bomber for 10 buds less than it was advertised as it was duped and I have had to sell a dixie that was duped for about 5 keys less than its clean worth. It is proportional.
Bob Loblaw (Banned) Feb 20 @ 11:04pm 
Originally posted by Zombie Jesus:
OK lets do the maths: We have a Clean TC for 50 buds. I would believe that mopst would not want to pay much more than 40 for it. That equates to a 20% drop in value. The same applies to a Stormy Dixie. They usually go for around 20 keys. For a duped one you would have to sell it for less around 15 keys. How do I know? I have bought a diped Secret Bomber for 10 buds less than it was advertised as it was duped and I have had to sell a dixie that was duped for about 5 keys less than its clean worth. It is proportional.
It's not all math though. It's people that are buying the hats, you need to take human psychology and the fact that there are some people wiling to pay more than 40 buds for the TC into account. Also, economics isn't always that straight forward.... but judging from your example, it would appear that lower tier hats are affected more (80%>75%) so thanks for proving me right :)
MA☝Omgwtfbbqstfu™ Feb 20 @ 11:09pm 
Entirely depends on the demand. If the only flaming team captain you can get is duped, then yea the asking price is going to not really be effected at all.

If you are selling against unduped hats aplenty, then of course it will take a hit.
Bob Loblaw (Banned) Feb 21 @ 12:19am 
Originally posted by MA☝Omgwtfbbqstfu™:
Entirely depends on the demand. If the only flaming team captain you can get is duped, then yea the asking price is going to not really be effected at all.

If you are selling against unduped hats aplenty, then of course it will take a hit.

Ookay thanks ^.^
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Date Posted: Feb 20 @ 4:51pm
Posts: 15