Jolly Jew Mar 13 @ 11:37am
horrible design choises that just baffle me to no end
while RO2 is an awesome game and i enjoy it a lot there are quite a few design choises that hamper the gameplay for absolutly no good reson, and just add frustration. i want to see what you think about these, for no better name.... ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ choises...
brefore i post this to TWI's official forums


1) no AOE indicator for artillery on the map.- why??? how is leaving the player in the dark about this enhance gamplay??? in real life, a commander knows what is the area of effect of an artllery barrage but here you are left in the dark, you'd think that the icon is enough, but no. there have been so many times that i though the icon is far enough from my teammates yet i still get TKs
simply write down what is the radius of every type of artillery in a tooltip (example - "mortars 500 radius" it's very simple! (assuming that every square on the map is 100 meters)

2) not respawning if you didn't chose your respawn location- what the hell??? first of all, preventing people to spawn is utter BS, the timer hit 0 yet you force the player to wait another 25 seconds just because he didn't click fast enough, if he didn't chose an area, then he should by default respawn near his SL or better, not wait for a whole addtional cycle!
someone doesn't like respawning this way? just circle in the options and it will be as normal.

3) respawn waves are completly unclear - this is very frustrating when playing commander, you see like 10 players waiting to spawn and you see that they have like 25 seconds in the timer, most logical thing to do is to force respawn, but nope, it was just the beginnig of a new cycle, the names instantly disapeared and my FR ended up respawning no one.
is it so hard to add "WAVE INBOUND" messge in the timer?

4) reloading completly cancled if the whole animation is not done - i know it's done to prevent the animation canceling the CoD is notorious for but accidently moving when all you had to do is to ♥♥♥♥ the gun is incredibly frustrating the solution, is again very easy yet not done: either do the cocking animation first or better, just add an 'uncocked' condition for the gun, so that you could insert the clip one instance and pull the bolt in another instance.

5) not being able to stop bandaging yourself - why??? why do i have to just stare at the barrel of an enemy rifle while my idiot soldier just keeps patching a little arm wound!?
the amount of times people died because of this is outrageous, you should be able to cancel bandaging whenever you want. even if it means you will keep bleeding.

6) not being able to reload, melee or change weapon while cycling the bolt. -
you are an amercian, you see a tojo charging, you shoot at him and you miss/hit arm, ok lets just take out the pistol/quickly stab him - NOPE GOTTA CYCLE THE BOLT FIRST!-, oh look, you are dead now.
EDIT: i know this can be fixed already by having to manually oporate the bolt, i personally really dislike this feature, i am already used to automatic bolting like in other FPS i shouldn't be forced to use a feature i dont like to oporate my gun properly.

9) no spawn protection area indicator - while in general spawn protection in a realistic shooter is something very silly, at least have damn decency to show where are the spawn protected areas on the map, suddenly walking up to these areas when sometimes you have mere seconds to turn back can be very frustrating, and can easily get you shot by the enemy because while you are frantically run away - completly exposed.
even more frustrating is constantly getting "arty cordinates invalid" when you try to place a mark and just guess where it's allowed to put a mark.
add an indicator to sapwn protected areas on the map, this is very simple!

10) tie breaker is utter ♥♥♥♥♥♥***
most servers have to rounds per map from some reson, and when both teams got a win the "tie breaker" goes into effect: whatever team has most combined points wins the second round.
this is plain crap because 99.9% of the times the attacking team willl win because they naturally get more points from capping objectives.
this means that even if you managed to win the second round as defenders, it will still be considered a loss! meaning that playing a second round as defenders is pointless!

remove the tiebreaker! it records none-existent losses in the player's profile!


***) -i know a lot of people will disagree with this one- ) ONLY RELEVANT IN RISING STORM. your character just pokes the air around the enemy with the bayonnet like an idiot even though he is clearly in range.
in real life you can easily hit people precisely in melee combat because you have hand-to-eye cordination, yet in this game instead of locking on the enemy or swing a wide arc to stab the bayonnet just hits a tiny little point in the center of the screen, and because of no crosshairs, it's pretty hard finding it especially in situation when every half second counts.
if you got close enough to the enemy you should be rewarded with a kill and not poke the air around him like an idio.t stabbing someone at 0 range should be a friggin' surgery.
funnily enough, without the bayonnet, melee is a swing in a large arch, so getting a melee kill with a stock of a gun has a lot more chances of hitting making the bayonnet actually a downgrade.
in stalingrad howevel, i do not have these problems somehow...
Last edited by Jolly Jew; Mar 17 @ 2:31pm
Showing 1-13 of 13 comments
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Moskeeto Mar 13 @ 1:25pm 
You're not going to get much of a good discussion going on here considering this forum isn't filled with the more dedicated players. I suggest you make this thread in the official forums instead where this can be discussed more maturely.

http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/forumdisplay.php?f=70
Acriaph Mar 13 @ 2:12pm 
Originally posted by Jolly Jew:
1) deleting your progress in a match if you disconnected before it finished - why???

I think it's probably a performance thing, your stats aren't just saved to your computer, so if the system had to be constatly reporting every point every online player is receiving as they get them over and over again, that seems like it could be an issue for the system that has to handle it. So the hosting server keeps track during the match, and reports them at the end of the round.

Originally posted by Jolly Jew:
2) no AOE indicator for artillery on the map.- why???

In real life the commander knows from experience/training, he doesn't have some size indicator light up on his map (not during WWII anyway). With a little practice it's not hard to figure out the rough size of artillery fire.

Originally posted by Jolly Jew:
3) not respawning if you didn't chose your respawn location- what the hell???

Sometimes people don't want to spawn right away, maybe they had to get up from the computer for a minute, or maybe they're selecting a new class between spawns? It's bad enough when the commander force-respawns me 1 second after I die and I show up on the opposite side of the map from where I was needed because I didn't have time to select a spawn, it would be terrible if that happened with normal spawns too.

Originally posted by Jolly Jew:
6)not being able to use the gun while proning

I disagree, I don't see trying to fire while in the process of going prone as realistic. You most likely wouldn't even have the gun in a firing position while you were dropping down.

Originally posted by Jolly Jew:
7) not being able to stop bandaging yourself - why??? is the character hypnotized and forces himself to keep on bandaging even when facing certin death?

I agree on this, I think you should be able to stop bandaging.

Originally posted by Jolly Jew:
8) not being able to reload, melee or change weapon while cycling the bolt. -
you are an amercian, you see a tojo charging, you shoot at him and you miss/hit arm, ok lets just take out the pistol/quickly stab him - NOPE GOTTA CYCLE THE BOLT FIRST!-, oh look, you are dead now.

Do you not have manual-bolting turned on? Your example sounds like you don't, and if that's the case, go to the main settings screen and check the manual bolting box.

Originally posted by Jolly Jew:
9) no spawn protection area indicator - while in general spawn protection in a realistic shooter is something very silly, at least have ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ dececy to show where are the spawn protected areas on the map

I've only had issues when the spawn protection changes over me, never had issues pulling out of spawn protection I just walked into. I prefer not having the areas shown on the map.

Originally posted by Jolly Jew:
10) not being able to skip intro movies - WHY???

It's not a random delay, it's the time it takes the progam to start up on your computer, how long that takes depends on your system (mainly hard drive speed). It doesn't take that long on mine, but I'm using an SSD.

Originally posted by Jolly Jew:
i know a lot of people will disagree with this one- ) ONLY RELEVANT IN RISING STORM. your character just pokes the air around the enemy with the bayonnet like an idiot even though he is clearly in range.

I haven't had any issues like that.
Tig Ol Bitties Mar 13 @ 3:16pm 
Everyone hates the melee function in this game. For a game that strives to be realistic, it's the most unbelievable (and awkward) player move in the whole game.
=Snappy= Mar 13 @ 4:11pm 
1) +1; would not be surprised if this can't (easily) be done, though, because of the current system being so locked in to the design of "only contact the master server once, at end of match".

2) +1 (and a bonus +1 for correctly using the abbreviation "AOE".)

3) +1; basically agree but i don't think player should auto-spawn. i just think they should be able to spawn at any time, once the wave timer reaches 0.

4) +1; haven't played commander tbh but the rest of your points seem sensible and usability-oriented, so i'll trust your judgement on this one.

5) +1 yeah pretty janky. seems like with everything else being so "realism"-oriented, there would be a way to implement logical realistic gun behavior w/r to "partial reloads" as well as "what 'state' does my weapon have to be in, in order for me to successfully melee with it?" (i.e.: basically any state!)

5a) FWIW i am often annoyed by not being able to prone or deploy, or make other stance changes, at certain times. tbh it's probably a L2P issue, but for one thing it would be nice if the "cannot deploy" warning would at least show up in the main, "big" notification area, not just in the console text. (believe me, i am not a fan of big white text messages popping up in the middle of my screen in FPSes -- and, note to all devs: based on how every single game has this BS, you would really think the players are craving it, but I honestly don't think they are! -- but i can also say, it's often far too late by the time i see the tiny message down in the console text.) an audio cue would also be helpful.

5b) OTOH I think activation of mantling should be "stickier". when you are running along a wall, up against the wall, but facing mostly perpendicular to it, you should be able to "grab" the first mantle point you come across, as long as you are pressing the mantle key at roughly the right time. right now you just "miss" the mantle point, and overshoot to the other side of the window or whatever, then switch back in the other direction, and repeat, skating back and forth ... until you realize "hey this is never going to work", and you stop and take the time to carefully align yourself with the mantle point and finally make your way through it. and then get shot and die (if you haven't already). realism or not i think there is a bit of room for improvement here.

6) haven't really noticed but tbh I find the description of going prone without breaking your fall with your hands to be unrealistic. i can't imagine doing it. i think it's instinctive tbh. just like your body is instinctively not going to let you land on your face, if you can help it. OTOH i've never been in combat...

7) makes sense i guess but hasn't been a problem for me personally. kinda new at the game but usually if given a chance to bandage, i'm just happy to be alive. ;); but basically in the same category as #5 above.

8) +1; again, "category 5"!

9) doesn't strike me as a huge issue, but if it could be dealt with in a non-immersion-breaking way, i'm not really opposed. but seeing a bunch of glowing overlays and other HUD stuff would not be welcome in this game, and TWI seems to be self-enforcing this rule pretty well.

10) it's done intentionally because all these companies think they are helping their brand by shoving advertising in your face. (even though you already own the product O_o). annoying as hell but doubt it will be fixed, because of reason above. however, in most unreal engine games, you can simply delete at least some of the intro video files, to minimize the issue. also: i blame consoles.

***) +1; haven't played much RS, but this sounds lame. sounds like a little bit of leeway in the hit detection might be in order.

12) did my config get wiped a couple days ago because of the beta patching? if so, this is a "flaw" with, AFAIAA, all unreal engine games, but really, if any developer -- including epic themselves -- actually gave a ♥♥♥♥ about the players' valuable time, they could fix this issue with a trivial effort. (among other options: simply store config to steam cloud!)

13) voteban, and/or better abilities for a server full of non-admin players to deal with griefers/music spammers, etc. the current capabilities are inadequate, as they seem easily circumvented.

14) should be able to filter out games with bots in server browser.

-----------

feel free to c/p my contributions to your official thread, if you make one.

and while I agree that developers who make "horrible" design choices need to be dealt with firmly, I recommend you tone down the hostility of your post, because tripwire, bunch of arrogant sobs that they are, do not take criticism well, especially if they have any excuse not to, such as: they deem it insulting. (...explaining why I personally do not have an account on their forums, nor do i intend to make one.)

and also FWIW: on the overall scale of horribleness -- i.e. stuff that lots of developers do that really, truly, makes them bad human beings and should earn them eternal damnation -- most of this stuff ain't that bad.

GL & TY!
Last edited by =Snappy=; Mar 13 @ 4:15pm
|RD| DurbanPoison Mar 14 @ 9:03pm 
I somehow am able to enjoy the game despite it's flaws. I bet soldiers in the real war also had a list of gripes lol.
Last edited by |RD| DurbanPoison; Mar 14 @ 9:04pm
Sasana Mar 14 @ 9:24pm 
Originally posted by Tig Ol Bitties:
Everyone hates the melee function in this game. For a game that strives to be realistic, it's the most unbelievable (and awkward) player move in the whole game.
A thousand times better than RO:O though. I cried whenever I tried to melee combat in that game, it took both people well over 10 seconds of missing to land a single swing.
Jordax142 Mar 15 @ 4:46am 
I agree the melee hit detection is wonky at best.

I've had moments where a bayonet should have gone though an enemy only to find out that the enemy is apparently made out of thin air, as it goes through him without any damage.

On the other side, last night I let go of the melee button after a banzai charge only to club a friendly machine gunner in the face who was 5 meters away from me.
Acriaph Mar 15 @ 9:40am 
Originally posted by Jordax142:
On the other side, last night I let go of the melee button after a banzai charge only to club a friendly machine gunner in the face who was 5 meters away from me.

If you're not actually looking to stab someone at the end of the charge you can cancel the melee attack by right-clicking before you release the melee button, then you won't waste time stabbing air or accidentally hitting a team mate.
Pte Maylam Mar 15 @ 12:57pm 
The intro movies play because the game is loading. You can disable them, but it takes just as long to reach the front screen as when the movies play. They give you soemthing to look at while the game gets started.

But if they upset you that much, I'm fairly sure there was a guide somewhere that explained how to disable the intro movies.

But like I said, the game still takes the same amount of time to load (it is probably a wee bit faster, but the difference is negligible).
Jolly Jew Mar 17 @ 2:34pm 
Originally posted by Pte Maylam:
The intro movies play because the game is loading. You can disable them, but it takes just as long to reach the front screen as when the movies play. They give you soemthing to look at while the game gets started.

But if they upset you that much, I'm fairly sure there was a guide somewhere that explained how to disable the intro movies.

But like I said, the game still takes the same amount of time to load (it is probably a wee bit faster, but the difference is negligible).

thanks for explaining, i removed that from the OP, as well as a few other subjects that were wrong.

@snappy, are TWI really this arrogant or it's just rumors? i never heard of companies that refuse to accept criticsm. those who do usually end up being scorned by the gaming community and vanish into obscurity.

Originally posted by DurbanPoison:
I somehow am able to enjoy the game despite it's flaws. I bet soldiers in the real war also had a list of gripes lol.

i also enjoy the game. could have enjoyed it more if it didn't have these dumb things
Pte Maylam Mar 17 @ 3:41pm 
You're most welcome, mate. :)
[F|H]Rivimies Mar 17 @ 4:11pm 
Originally posted by Pte Maylam:
You can disable them, but it takes just as long to reach the front screen as when the movies play.

Well, no, sorry. There is a big difference with fast drive (SSD) when startup movies are disabled.
Pte Maylam Mar 17 @ 4:18pm 
I'll have to take your word for it, my laptop was obsolete 5 years ago!
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Date Posted: Mar 13 @ 11:37am
Posts: 13