Puzzle Agent

### Puzzle Agent

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contrivable Jul 6, 2014 @ 11:18am
Broken Puzzles
I really like the game but I was frustrated with some of the puzzle arrangements.

There is a number of puzzles I consider broken, e.g. their rules allow for multiple solutions but not every solution will be accepted. So far the only puzzle allowing more than one solution and also accepting them is "Directions & Detours" (2 solutions as explained in the "How?"). Also there are puzzles just not sufficiently explained.
This means there are puzzles that may not be solved without hints at the first attempt having you restart the game if you want the perfect result.

Feel free to refute me.

Wrangling Watchmen
Only 1 of 3 solutions will be accepted.
Bernie may appear to "imply" he has worked the second to last shift but he doesn't really. Pop worked 3 hours, Bernie 8. That means Al and Iggy together worked 24-3-8=13 hours. Since no-one but Bernie worked the eight hours Al and Iggy each worked 6 or 7 hours (clock settings indicate full-hour shifts). Iggy is the only one restricting his shift start, as either 0600 or 1800. The "How?" states Iggy cannot go last because he was relieved but stating that their firm was employed that day doesn't mean it wasn't the next day too. Or maybe another firm took over.
1. If Iggy worked from 0600 Bernie cannot work before him because 8 hours don't fit in 6 hours and Pop cannot work before Iggy because no-one else can fill the remaining 3 hours with his shift. Al's shift must then be 6 hours long to fit the time. That means Iggy worked 7 hours until 1300. We don't have any idea in which order Bernie and Pop did their shifts.
1. The non-implication by Bernie may mean he worked the third shift making the boom at 2000=8pm. ACCEPTED
2. Otherwise the boom was at 1500=3pm. REJECTED
2. If Iggy worked from 1800 everyone else worked before him. Making the boom at 1700=5pm. REJECTED
There is a hint simply stating that Pop took the last shift. But how would you come to that fact?

Diners and Dishes
Only 1 of 7 solutions will be accepted.
By seating arrangement only the (chicken) lady at the end of the table can eat something resembling a neighbor but not her spouse. So she eats onion rings and the (onion) man on the right eats fish.
So there are three people left that can eat what they resemble: buffalo man, banana split man or ham lady.
1. If buffalo man eats buffalo burger, banana split man can not eat banana split and not chicken, so ham.
Fish lady and ham lady both can eat chicken or banana split.
(Solutions from left to right)
1. chicken,burger,ham,onion,fish,banana REJECTED
2. banana,burger,ham,onion,fish,chicken REJECTED
2. If banana split man eats banana split, buffalo man must not eat the burger and ham lady not the ham.
1. burger,ham,banana,onion,fish,chicken REJECTED
2. ham,chicken,banana,onion,fish,burger REJECTED
3. chicken,ham,banana,onion,fish,burger ACCEPTED
3. If ham lady eats ham, banana split man can not eat banana split and not chicken, so burger.
1. chicken,banana,burger,onion,fish,ham REJECTED
2. banana,chicken,burger,onion,fish,ham REJECTED
There is a hint simply stating banana split goes to banana split man. How to conclude that?

Menacing Map
The rules clarify you need to map a path connecting Lobbster and hut but they don't make it clear that the path must also not make any path to an evil creature available, i.e. possible as opposed to necessary.

Going after Glori
Rules fail to mention that you cannot pass forest tiles.

Frantic Fish
I may be a bit picky here.
• Rule 1: You accidentally recursion. Rule 3 and rule 1 taken literally mean every fish contains an infinite number of swallowed fish with possibly the exception of the fish containing the key. This obfuscates the 19 fish premise while not conflicting with anything.
• Rule 2: Considering hint 1 this is supposed to count visible fish as well which is unclear from the rule.
• Rule 3: The food chain only strongly coincides with order by size.

Arm Wrestling Redux
Rules fail to mention this is about a knockout tournament. I, for one, tried to identify the strongest competitor.

Changing Chairs
There are two ways to arrange the chairs so that they fit in the form and produce the picture - one way being 180° turned. Even though the picture is complete the version with the moon on the right will be rejected.
Dan Jul 29, 2014 @ 6:23am
That's quite a lot and some of them seem very broken if that is true. The game did come off as a bit glitchy to me as well, and even having played the sequel there are still significant plot holes from time to time. Hopefully your discoveries can help out future players.
CozyGhost Nov 26, 2014 @ 12:03am
I definitely have found that there can be multiple answers to some as well. The Diners and Dishes one I found to be fair, though. Here's my recent one;

A Quarry of Crows (sp?). There were definitely ways of organizing the crows that could have resulted in more than at least 5..
[N00B] Amiigo Dec 14, 2014 @ 12:17am
How Hawk's
In hot hawks, when it indicates that the birds use their maximum weight, then at the end the solution has 1 unused bird...
contrivable Dec 14, 2014 @ 12:38am
Originally posted by AGhostDream:
I definitely have found that there can be multiple answers to some as well. The Diners and Dishes one I found to be fair, though. Here's my recent one;

A Quarry of Crows (sp?). There were definitely ways of organizing the crows that could have resulted in more than at least 5..
The riddle specifically asks "what's the minimum number?" So any constellation of pictures with a larger number is not corresponding to a solution to the riddle.
contrivable Dec 14, 2014 @ 12:41am
Originally posted by N00B Aunt Jemima:
How Hawk's
In hot hawks, when it indicates that the birds use their maximum weight, then at the end the solution has 1 unused bird...
Yes. One might think, that the precondition to rule 2 already hints on having a special solution like that.
CozyGhost Dec 14, 2014 @ 4:27pm
Originally posted by contrivable:
Originally posted by AGhostDream:
I definitely have found that there can be multiple answers to some as well. The Diners and Dishes one I found to be fair, though. Here's my recent one;

A Quarry of Crows (sp?). There were definitely ways of organizing the crows that could have resulted in more than at least 5..
The riddle specifically asks "what's the minimum number?" So any constellation of pictures with a larger number is not corresponding to a solution to the riddle.

Ahh, guess I missed that.
Haarberger Jan 30, 2015 @ 1:29am
burger,ham,banana,onion,fish,chicken REJECTED
chicken,ham,banana,onion,fish,burger ACCEPTED

That got me even during the gameplay (Not having foreseen this thread).

How were you supposed to know that the fish person wanted chicken instead of burger and vice versa?
FalseGiraffe Feb 10, 2015 @ 9:10pm
Originally posted by contrivable:
Feel free to refute me.

Wrangling Watchmen
Only 1 of 3 solutions will be accepted.
Bernie may appear to "imply" he has worked the second to last shift but he doesn't really. Pop worked 3 hours, Bernie 8. That means Al and Iggy together worked 24-3-8=13 hours. Since no-one but Bernie worked the eight hours Al and Iggy each worked 6 or 7 hours (clock settings indicate full-hour shifts). Iggy is the only one restricting his shift start, as either 0600 or 1800. The "How?" states Iggy cannot go last because he was relieved but stating that their firm was employed that day doesn't mean it wasn't the next day too. Or maybe another firm took over.
1. If Iggy worked from 0600 Bernie cannot work before him because 8 hours don't fit in 6 hours and Pop cannot work before Iggy because no-one else can fill the remaining 3 hours with his shift. Al's shift must then be 6 hours long to fit the time. That means Iggy worked 7 hours until 1300. We don't have any idea in which order Bernie and Pop did their shifts.
1. The non-implication by Bernie may mean he worked the third shift making the boom at 2000=8pm. ACCEPTED
2. Otherwise the boom was at 1500=3pm. REJECTED
2. If Iggy worked from 1800 everyone else worked before him. Making the boom at 1700=5pm. REJECTED
There is a hint simply stating that Pop took the last shift. But how would you come to that fact?
I made a couple of reasonable, slight leaps of logic. Because Bernie is actually SAYING 'BOOM!', I assumed he was the one that actually heard the explosion, reacting as someone would if they were describing something they actually encountered rather than what someone else told him about. Because of this, the only solution that made sense to me is Al working midnight to six, Iggy working six am to 1pm, Bernie from 1 to 9, and Pops from 9 to midnight. Iggy could not have worked from 6pm, as he said he worked 'until he was relieved', which is meant to imply he was not the last to work the day. I realize someone could have worked AFTER him, but you can reason pretty well that nobody worked security on the factory the day after it was closed due to the explosion. Besides, the puzzle is supposed to fill midnight to midnight only, to assume things about facts beyond that window makes the puzzle unsolveable with the hints provided.

Diners and Dishes
Only 1 of 7 solutions will be accepted.
By seating arrangement only the (chicken) lady at the end of the table can eat something resembling a neighbor but not her spouse. So she eats onion rings and the (onion) man on the right eats fish.
So there are three people left that can eat what they resemble: buffalo man, banana split man or ham lady.
1. If buffalo man eats buffalo burger, banana split man can not eat banana split and not chicken, so ham.
Fish lady and ham lady both can eat chicken or banana split.
(Solutions from left to right)
1. chicken,burger,ham,onion,fish,banana REJECTED
2. banana,burger,ham,onion,fish,chicken REJECTED
2. If banana split man eats banana split, buffalo man must not eat the burger and ham lady not the ham.
1. burger,ham,banana,onion,fish,chicken REJECTED
2. ham,chicken,banana,onion,fish,burger REJECTED
3. chicken,ham,banana,onion,fish,burger ACCEPTED
3. If ham lady eats ham, banana split man can not eat banana split and not chicken, so burger.
1. chicken,banana,burger,onion,fish,ham REJECTED
2. banana,chicken,burger,onion,fish,ham REJECTED
There is a hint simply stating banana split goes to banana split man. How to conclude that?

You are forgetting the rule that ham must be next to the banana split. This rule invalidates your options 1, 2, 4, 6 and 7. And 3 is rejected because the fish lady would be eating a burger, which resembles her bullish husband, leaving the only correct answer, 5.

Menacing Map
The rules clarify you need to map a path connecting Lobbster and hut but they don't make it clear that the path must also not make any path to an evil creature available, i.e. possible as opposed to necessary.
Fair I suppose, but if this requirement were not there, the path would be way too simple and, to your complaint, there would be far too many solutions. This actually didn't snap into place for me UNTIL I applied that further limitation, but it would have been nice to be spelled out.

Going after Glori
Rules fail to mention that you cannot pass forest tiles.
True, I assumed though they were impassible, but it would have been nice not to have to assume. Should have been clarified that they were not simply decoration, but they did look like a wall to me.

Frantic Fish
I may be a bit picky here.
• Rule 1: You accidentally recursion. Rule 3 and rule 1 taken literally mean every fish contains an infinite number of swallowed fish with possibly the exception of the fish containing the key. This obfuscates the 19 fish premise while not conflicting with anything.
• Rule 2: Considering hint 1 this is supposed to count visible fish as well which is unclear from the rule.
• Rule 3: The food chain only strongly coincides with order by size.
Rule 1 says each fish has ONE other fish inside, or a key. I would consider a fish that contains a fish with yet another fish in it, to contain TWO fish. To be entirely pedantic, I suppose one could have demanded they say each UNSWALLOWED fish has either one fish inside it or a key but taken with rule 4 it just makes sense, or else a number of the rules just don't matter.

Arm Wrestling Redux
Rules fail to mention this is about a knockout tournament. I, for one, tried to identify the strongest competitor.
ENTIRELY agree with this one. The tournament style should have been stated. I also assumed each woman wrestled the other three because there was nothing to stop me from assuming this. I suppose after encountering some of the later puzzles I could have made an educated assumption that it's the only way to provide a clear choice.

Changing Chairs
There are two ways to arrange the chairs so that they fit in the form and produce the picture - one way being 180° turned. Even though the picture is complete the version with the moon on the right will be rejected.
I see your point with this one and will agree, but was never once tempted to build the face upside down. I think that was meant as a 'this way up' hint.

Last edited by FalseGiraffe; Feb 10, 2015 @ 9:14pm
Elymnir Feb 13, 2015 @ 8:11am
Totally agree! In some puzzles, rules are misleading. For the row of crows for example, we have no indication of the "overlapping rules". You don't know how many can overlap, hence changing the outcome. For the marmots as well, since there's no solution that permit to have 16 fish at the end no matter what arrangement, you have to be lucky on order to succeed at the first attempt. The game just lacks clarification, that's too bad because it undermines a bit the fun puzzles and the humour (caught myself laughing more than I should sometimes).
N'fol Mar 14, 2015 @ 3:33pm
While I was going through this, I found some puzzles that I think my answer would be valid, but was rejected by the game. I didn't keep close track, though. (Perhaps later I'll go through them all again and verify.)

I resorted to creating a spreadsheet for the fish-and-streams puzzle "Grickleback Baffler" to exhaust all possibilities. After looking at solutions, I realized that it could have been clearer that 16 fish had to arrive regardless of the location of the marmots (as opposed to 16 fish arriving, but only if the marmots are in the right location). There are 4! = 24 starting possibilities for the fish. Of those, only the valid solution allows for exactly 16 to arrive. There is one other possibility that only works if the marmots are in Mifpik March, and one other possibility that only works if the marmots are in Abdominal Swamp.
Tamara Apr 11, 2015 @ 11:23am
Originally posted by Haarberger:
burger,ham,banana,onion,fish,chicken REJECTED
chicken,ham,banana,onion,fish,burger ACCEPTED

That got me even during the gameplay (Not having foreseen this thread).

How were you supposed to know that the fish person wanted chicken instead of burger and vice versa?

Because they didn't eat anything resembling their spouse. The fish-woman has a spouse who looks like a buffalo, which resembles the burger.
Tamara Apr 11, 2015 @ 11:38am
This one bothers me as hell. The bugs in the boxes. They say: grashoppers 3 spaces (including the tiles they're on) and the purple ones 2. Same sort may share boxes. You need to draw as few boxes as possible. But THIS one got rejected: http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=423374573

Can someone please explane to me why? I think I just overruled the game with this easy solution.
Tamara Apr 11, 2015 @ 11:41am
This one's rejected as well (I thought maybe the grasshoppers shouldn't be sharing?). What the hell man. http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=423377422
Tamara Apr 11, 2015 @ 11:50am
Okay guess what? FOUR SIDED MEANS RECTANGULAR. Might sound dumb, but if you think about it, up-down-left-right are four sides. As long as you use those sides, it's okay right? A fifth side would be diagonal/tilted, in my opinion. So that's causing confusion... grmbl....
Elymnir Apr 11, 2015 @ 1:31pm
Originally posted by Tamara:
Okay guess what? FOUR SIDED MEANS RECTANGULAR. Might sound dumb, but if you think about it, up-down-left-right are four sides. As long as you use those sides, it's okay right? A fifth side would be diagonal/tilted, in my opinion. So that's causing confusion... grmbl....
Yeah, the phrasing was wrong on that one. As long as it's all rectangular shapes, it's fine but if you want to get creative and play with the rules it becomes unforgiving. Worst ones imo are the ones with birds on a line and fishes that have to go to the sea. Sometimes the rules are unclear, leading to confusion :/