WTF?!! NO REWARD FOR 100% Completion?!!

[Onomoki]

Look, i know i have been somewhat harsh on this game, but i have come around. I have changed my review to a positive, and have REALLY come to love this game. I love it so much i wanted to beat it all, even all the achievements, and that is something i never care to do... but this... no reward at all?!!

I hate it when developers does this... it takes so little effort. Anything would do, a smile from the goat in the ending sequence, ANYTHING... the single most basic element in game design is to present a discernable reward for the players effort. If so just a symbolic such... not doing so, in the ultimate player effort (beating the game) is such lazy design, and in fact... almost an insult. I said almost, because insult is such a strong word... but NOT rewarding the most hardcore players, the one who appreciates and play the games the most with something, is just... really, really lazy.

And don´t call the title a spoiler. It aint, a spoiler is revealing something the other players would enjoy discovering for themselves. Discovering that there aint no reward what so ever in maxing this game, ain´t something that can be spoiled. And if it is, the only thing i spoiled is their disappointment. Sue me for that.

[Kate]

I can't speak for Ian and Randy, but I think it would be cruel to make people feel obligated to 100% the game just to get something. If the game not having an extrinsic reward for that upsets you, I apologize.

[Onomoki]

Kaelan, i´m glad to hear it was a decision and not a lack of effort, that made this happen at least. Thanks for the response. Although i understand your reasoning, i don´t think your way of handling the dilemma is the way to go.

I believe one must find a balance between the reward not being to big, so that people will feel obliged, but not small enough, so people will feel cheated. A good reward would be, like seeing the goat wink at you at the ending screen. As i said, i don´t think people would feel obligated to 100% a game, in order to see a the Goat wink at you at the end screen, but that little, little wink WOULD make those who have gone through the effort feel something special.

Just leaving the reward out, left me leaving the game feeling abit disappointed... just a sour little aftertaste, from an other ways perfect gaming experience.

[Wis]

"The beauty is in the walking, we are betrayed by destinations".
I've always liked this concept.

[Onomoki]

I really doesn´t feel that the whole "it is the journey that is the destination, not the destination itself" rethorics applies in this case. It doesn´t apply because it assumes that the discernable result for beating the game 100% should be the main objective, and that is not what i´m going for. Maybe the term "reward" is misleading. My point is, the game would benefit from a discernable result, for beating it to the fullest. A confirmation of sorts: "This is it. You´ve done it". As it stands now, people are confused when beating it 100% (hence the questions, and threads and so on). And that feeling "wait, is this it? Or have i missed something?" is not proper place, to end anything.

[Bronsky]

I just made 100%. I didn't do it for any special reward. I did because I found the main game too easy, not because any extra reward. But to be honest, any reward would be appreciated

[Wis]

Well, let's say that, having beaten the All Intensive Purposes campaign in the first, I was very well prepared for this outcome.
I enjoyed the game and was willing to explore any room in it, I felt that the rooms for themselves were the gift for the 100%.
I didn't feel like I needed anything more than that.
But I can understand your (new) complaint.

[AchromaticSky]

Something really simple like a set of symbols on the save file would be enough. One for completing the game the easy way, one for getting all 16 souls and completing area 9 properly, and one for completing all the secret rooms.

Another possible approach is to make the reward something that only the players that can unlock it would be interested in (like the X-Difficult levels in Dustforce, these are unlocked by getting a perfect rank on every level in the game, something less than 1% of players do, but the levels themselves are so difficult that if you can't unlock them, you probably don't want to.)

[Onomoki]

Yeah, for all those above, i ain´t looking for a sort of reward that would be an incentive by itself to 100% the game. I DO agree that the enjoyment of playing it in itself is enough, but that doesn´t eliminate the fact... that playing the game to full completion changes the narrative of the story within, and such... the narrative itself should adapt.

If these were extra levels that didn´t fit into the narrative of the game itself, i wouldn´t mind... but since the developer included these levels into the whole find the glass shards, the main narrative of the game... it feels like a rip off when following that narrative doesn´t result in a tangible effect in the narrative itself. It´s not about the importance of having a carrot on a stick that is at hand here, it is acknowleding the effort and the way the game is played.

According to "your" logic, the narrative and structure of the game doesn´t matter at all. If all that mattered to you is playing the levels themself, then all that would suffice is a selection screen od 121 levels, with no indication of what levels is completed and any sense of progression. But i think we all can agree on, if the game would launch without any story what so ever, no sheeps, no map, no need to progress, no ending screen, the complete exprience would have suffered from it. And in the same way, the complete experience of completing EVERYTHING, that suffers from tha the narrative and framework not changing AT all in order to adapt to that playstyle.

So please, everyone... STOP with the "the journey in itself is the destination" analogy, because that doesn´t apply. It doesn´t apply because, even with that analogy... it´s like, if the journey itself is the destination, then that would demand that the journey would adapt to the way you are traveling. But since this game doesn´t adapt AT ALL to the way you are playing it, the journey of completing the game becomes arbitrary, because it is the same journey no matter how you approach it. Just a small touch, like a small animation of the goat winking at you would have change that journey into something else. And thus, not adapting to the playing style is just a bad designer decision.

[shrewdlogarithm]

Oh cmon - the reward for 100% is that you got 100%

Achievements - for me - should be 'side quests' on the way there.

I hate game where the achivements are

"Complete Level 1"
"Complete 50% of the game"
"Complete the game"
"Twice..."

:)

[Mr. Domino]

Yeah, I love that the achievements are alternate challenges which add to the game. That's how it SHOULD be. It adds value to the game instead of just simply documenting progress.

[Dex]

Originally posted by kaelan:

I can't speak for Ian and Randy, but I think it would be cruel to make people feel obligated to 100% the game just to get something. If the game not having an extrinsic reward for that upsets you, I apologize.

I don't feel as strongly about this as Onomoki seems to but I don't see how that would be seen as cruel, almost every game has some sort of reward for different stages of completion.

I just reached 9-10 and found it a bit disappointing that you get the same ending that you get for just reaching 9-5. Even the simplest thing like the tower not collapsing would be a nice "good" ending, and that takes less animation!

[JimTheEternal]

Originally posted by kaelan:

I can't speak for Ian and Randy, but I think it would be cruel to make people feel obligated to 100% the game just to get something. If the game not having an extrinsic reward for that upsets you, I apologize.

I understand the original poster's frustration, because I feel something similar. I'm not looking for a reward, but as somebody else already said in this thread, I'm looking for confirmation. I solve the last puzzle, get 100% room completion, and nothing changes at all. I don't need more storyline, I don't need super powers, but something that confirms that, hey, you've done it, there's no more left to do, would be really nice and stop the confusion. Without that, I'm left feeling like even though it says 100%, there must be something else.

[Onomoki]

Exactly Jim. Well put. It´s not about a reward, or an incentive to play the game. It´s about confirmation. "This is it. You´ve done it". Even a... a simple line of text. Like

"Wow, you beaten ALL of our levels? That´s cool / The developers"

would have sufficed. Anything but this empty void of... "what, am i done now?"

[Leonhard Euler]

I think that the lack of a special ending is more noticeable because the main (and only) ending feels empty or incomplete. There are all these animals that you meet and rescue, but then the tower falls with only you and the mouse outside.

There could have been more animals there, there could have been a battle with a boss wizard, there could have been some lore text... anything to make the journey's end seem a bit more satisfying.

But it was a great journey and I still like the game for that.

[Leonhard Euler]

(Moreover, the game tells you your completion percentage after the credits, which is a classic Metroid-esque signal for "beat it better to see a hot chick or something")