{GE} Swift Runner Feb 7 @ 2:18pm
Does it really get much better?
I have maybe 2 and a half hours and I dont mind the gameplay, but I'm kinda just forcing myself to come back time and time again. I just got the library and got the guy better pretty much. I mean its a good enough game and I'm not having too much problems in terms of difficulty, maybe it's just not my thing. Just curious what you guys thought.
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Gemfruit Feb 7 @ 4:10pm 
It definitely gets better IMO, but it may also not be your thing.

I was pretty impressed with the game by the time I got to the library. I found the music amazing, graphics great, and the gameplay to be quite engaging. That being said, I did find the initial environments to be a little bland. I still can't place why I feel / felt this way, but something about the initial locations didn't pop to me like the Metroid games did / do.

That aside, the game does get a lot better. The locations vary a lot more (fire, ice, mythical ruins, energetic tower, etc), the music draws you in more, and the combat gets more diverse once you start upgrading weapons, armor, magic, etc.

If you're not too interested in the game thus far, I'm not sure you'll love it ever, but it may grow on you. The next hour or two picks up, so give it one long sitting to get further and see how you like it. Lastly, I must ask, do you greatly enjoy Castlevania and Metroid games?
{GE} Swift Runner Feb 7 @ 7:17pm 
I never really got the chance to play em as a kid and Im more of a pc gamer now, so I cant say I know. I guess I'll hang in a bit longer to give the game a shot. Kinda just been in a bad mood whenever I've played it so far for one reason or another so far.
DaetherX Feb 7 @ 8:56pm 
Originally posted by {GE} Boss Entry:
I never really got the chance to play em as a kid and Im more of a pc gamer now, so I cant say I know. I guess I'll hang in a bit longer to give the game a shot. Kinda just been in a bad mood whenever I've played it so far for one reason or another so far.

I've said in other threads that I really want to like this game more than I do because it deserves to be liked. I love the art style, the story makes me want to know more about the world and see what heppens next, and the combat is pretty good especially the boss fights. However all the things that bug me really add up.

I just got done yelling expletives, out loud, at my screen from being constant stun-locked by a new enemy I just ran into (Zigurat? I think? I had to use the magic jump extender spell to get here) who even when you dash through to strike from behind you often get hit because fires a 3way shot before it comes down and when you get behind it, it instantly disappears before you can hit it. Took me 4 or 5 lives to kill the A-hole and 2 screens later I saved and exited. I loved the first few hours, but the more I play the more I like the story and style and I want to like it more but the more I hate the flaws at the same time.

Being gangbanged by solo mewtwo's who are invincible while doing AoE magic at the same time is frustrating. (and the invincibility shield last a long time) Being gangbanged by enemies anytime there's more than 1 on screen at a time is frustrating. Being gangbanged by spells trying to get to where the spell casting resurectionist enemies are is frustrating. And of course don't get me started on (some of) the timed door challenges.

Despite all that, I'd still recommend this game (with caution) to people who enjoy this type of game giving it a good/average score or thumbs up and am compelled to try to finish it.

The bosses are, so far, all really well done with unique elements to their attacks and things you have to do to beat them I haven't seen in other games. They make me curse at them once or twice until I learn their patterns. The fact that dieing only means clicking "retry" is very nice. In the room with the stun-locking enemy, who also throws you across the room, I fell down from that room to the room below then got gangbanged to death down there and was angry for a second, but I respawned up in the room with the stunlock enemy not in the lower chamber where I died. I think that if I had started down there I'd have just quit for a week or so.

I think pretty much everyone agrees that "Castlevania: Symphony of the Night" is the absolute best game in the "metroidvania" genre. In fact Castlevania games themselves were not even "metroidvania's" until SotN. If you own a Playstation(1 or 2 can also play 1's games) then you should pick up SotN, and if not you should buy it for cheap anyway to get the legal right to download and use it on an emulator.
Gemfruit Feb 7 @ 9:58pm 
I definitely agree that getting gangbanged by enemies is the game's largest flaw. As a developer myself, I'm extremely surprised to see a fix for this. A short invincibility counter (1/3rd a second) after taking damage (or knockback / heavy damage) would do wonders for the game. Not every little hit needs to make you invincible for a moment, just the bigger ones that stop you from being mobile. There are a lot of games that use a very quick invicinble after damage system, and it works. Perhaps the developer can play with this for the updates.
Tecnotronics Feb 8 @ 4:41am 
Every time I try and play this, it's like the developers meant for it to be played one way. Ya set upon the most powerful path, without knowing what that is unless you know from previous gamer intel, and stick to it. (so like a game meant for receptionists).

Take for example, the defense button:
As Reina, at level 11, the fundamentals I've learned, are to punch punch jump, downkick and be in range for a moment of thought, or out of range for a quick spellcast assuming it's viable with the rest of the frames. For some reason you can combo 2 punches (light attack), while you can combo 3 kicks (heavy attack). Why is the defend button even there? I don't know, since it blocks some stuff but you take damage while losing time, and the essence of battle pace. it's more like a function key, to open up the magic menu lol. Using defense feels like a lost battle, but the game never tells you that.

It must be something to do with the frames, like yall talk about. If you Defend, and then attempt to Skillcancel, it will often reverse cancel your skillcancel, while it's still in the 'coming out of defense' animation. Leaving all the power in the hands of the AI to rock ya.

This is my setup atm:

WASD: movement
W: (also for jump)
Keypad 4856: light, heavy, magic, skillcancel
Keypad 1 2 3: assist, map, defend

I'd say just keep at it, and maybe you can see it get better. But if ya like me, and can't really grasp the fundamentals after hours of play, to get into the zone, it probably won't get better. Just a lamb amongst these angels n demons n such!
myhr2 Feb 8 @ 5:55am 
Defense is very usefull. It's just that you can't block Magic and Heavy attacks without little twists. And it works exactly in the same way for your character.

If you attack an ennemy that is guarding, you won't damage it. If you make a Heavy attack in his guard, it will break it, and the same goes for magical attacks, they break guards. But when en ennemy is guarding with a purple half-sphere effect, it has a Parfect Guard, and nothing can break it.

It's the same exact mecanichs for your characters. As Wyatt, you can improve your guard with skills from the Guardian Tree, aka Force Blade and Templar. As Reina, using the Staff will give you a Perfect Guard.

So, the devs didn't meant the game to be played in one way, it's all the opposite, really, you have many many options to build your character around. 4 stats, 4 weapons per character, most of them with multiple upgrade pathes, armors and accessories that will encourage you to use specific combinations of stat, attacks, and/or defenses.

But all this can only be discovered if you dig a bit and try to understand how it works, and if you try things. There's a lot of little details to be discovered. And for those things that are almost impossible to discover by yourself, well, there are the forums! Fell free to ask! =)

As for getting comboed by ennemies, and avoiding this by implementing invincibility frames...Matter of taste, I think. It works well in some games, in most games, really. I, personnaly, would not like it in Valdis Story, I can just see this totally ruining the gameplay, allowing you to just rush in the middle of ennemies without thinking, spam attacks and not worry because you've got so much options to recover and avoid attacks...Nah, not fan of the idea. The game is already balanced around it, changing it would require to remake all the game.

Thing is, this game isn't accessible, at all. It tells you very little about its mecanics, but they exist and are consistent. For me, discovering them was part of the pleasure. Moments like (I'll put them in spoiler because, as I said, it was so rewarding to figure it by myself) :
- "Hooooo, so if I can activate the Mana Heater that aren't working by channeling magic near them!"
- "Hooooo, so I can jump from ledge to ledge just by pressing the directional buttons and not the jump button!"
-"Hoooo, so I need to break the Sniper's shield with a spell in order to kill it faster!"
-"Hoooo, so if I take the Force Blade skill, I will still take some damage while blocking Heavy/Magic attacks, but they do not stun me anymore!"

So...Yeah, if you don't feel like playing it, maybe it's not your kind of game. To each their own! The important thing is to have fun while playing! =)
FIRE_KEEPER Feb 8 @ 7:36am 
i have 20 hours of gameplay ... and i still play it all the time
azamoth66 Feb 8 @ 11:33am 
Originally posted by myhr2:
Thing is, this game isn't accessible, at all. It tells you very little about its mecanics, but they exist and are consistent. For me, discovering them was part of the pleasure.

I beat the game 3 times without knowing that you can break some pipes during a specific boss fight to flood the area with water, making the boss easier to see when he stealths. I found this out by mistake while trying to combo him with that dark rain spell.

But yeah, the number of builds and play styles available is pretty impressive for a game like this. It really has me looking forward to the other two characters. There will be even more interesting tricks and combinations to uncover. That is a pretty good part of the fun for me and the reason why I'm still interested in the game after 60+ hours.
not-tu Feb 8 @ 12:44pm 
Originally posted by Gemfruit:
I definitely agree that getting gangbanged by enemies is the game's largest flaw. As a developer myself, I'm extremely surprised to see a fix for this. A short invincibility counter (1/3rd a second) after taking damage (or knockback / heavy damage) would do wonders for the game. Not every little hit needs to make you invincible for a moment, just the bigger ones that stop you from being mobile. There are a lot of games that use a very quick invicinble after damage system, and it works. Perhaps the developer can play with this for the updates.
It's not so much of a flaw but an obvious design decision by the devs. The game is designed to punish you for mistakes, but also gives you tools to easily prevent you from making these mistakes.

If you want to engage a group of enemies and button mash, things are going to happen.

Easiest way I recommend for people to approach a big group of enemies, use Reize's assist and he'll stun all of them, giving you plenty of time to kill at least half.

This kind of punishing design isn't for everyone. For me it feels rewarding when you're able to master parts of the game so these kinds of situations don't happen anymore. But the devs are constantly tweaking and adding things, so its not out of the question they might tweak this.
Mosquito Señorito Feb 8 @ 2:26pm 
To OP: if it were 2,5 hours, then Valdis Story is probably not your thing. Judging from some replies in this community and from personal experience, you get hooked to this game for good. If you don't...well, there's nothing awful about it.
As for combat difficulty. Funny thing is: you always leave frustrated but you always come back. Some fights in the games are total ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥. But you always overcome it and then feel great about it (except for 120% ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ parts. you just glad it's over).
Epic The Incandescent Feb 8 @ 3:33pm 
Originally posted by not-tu:
Originally posted by Gemfruit:
I definitely agree that getting gangbanged by enemies is the game's largest flaw. As a developer myself, I'm extremely surprised to see a fix for this. A short invincibility counter (1/3rd a second) after taking damage (or knockback / heavy damage) would do wonders for the game. Not every little hit needs to make you invincible for a moment, just the bigger ones that stop you from being mobile. There are a lot of games that use a very quick invicinble after damage system, and it works. Perhaps the developer can play with this for the updates.
It's not so much of a flaw but an obvious design decision by the devs. The game is designed to punish you for mistakes, but also gives you tools to easily prevent you from making these mistakes.

If you want to engage a group of enemies and button mash, things are going to happen.

Easiest way I recommend for people to approach a big group of enemies, use Reize's assist and he'll stun all of them, giving you plenty of time to kill at least half.

This kind of punishing design isn't for everyone. For me it feels rewarding when you're able to master parts of the game so these kinds of situations don't happen anymore. But the devs are constantly tweaking and adding things, so its not out of the question they might tweak this.
still it would be nice if you sadistic jerks would add a ♥♥♥♥in ariel recovery and not just call the invicibility frames you get from "skill cancle stomp" the equivilent....that serious is the sole ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ reason ive not picked this back up, I love the art style and love the story but seriously i hate the punishing " lol u suck at timing so we stun lock you hur" thing yall got going on there..........i mean it cant be THAT hard to add 1 extra function to skill cancles or hell if you want to be douchy make it so you have to use a skill cancle and volt jump...just a little flip righting them selves and atleast slowing the distance you fly would be lovely devs...♥♥♥♥ING PLEASE!?
not-tu Feb 8 @ 4:44pm 
Originally posted by Epic The Incandescent:
still it would be nice if you sadistic jerks would add a ♥♥♥♥in ariel recovery and not just call the invicibility frames you get from "skill cancle stomp" the equivilent....that serious is the sole ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ reason ive not picked this back up, I love the art style and love the story but seriously i hate the punishing " lol u suck at timing so we stun lock you hur" thing yall got going on there..........i mean it cant be THAT hard to add 1 extra function to skill cancles or hell if you want to be douchy make it so you have to use a skill cancle and volt jump...just a little flip righting them selves and atleast slowing the distance you fly would be lovely devs...♥♥♥♥ING PLEASE!?
I'm not a dev so I don't know what you expect me to do lol.

It's a deliberate decision of design. A large majority of people are fine with the games design. Not all games are for everyone sadly. It's too bad you are frustrated by the game this much. The devs potentially could tweak this towards how you want it, but I have no insight into that. All feedback helps though! They've already shown that they've made the game more accessible to people based on the feedback of some people.

Also FYI, cussing and caps locking in several threads isn't going to make many people want to listen to your feedback.
Gemfruit Feb 8 @ 9:46pm 
I think my opinion came off too strong, and unclear.

I'm now at the end of the game, and I LOVE the design choices that were made. That being said, I still see a few "flaws", that perhaps are design choices, but aren't optimal. I still stand by the small invicnbility frames addition, thougha s stated early, it's VERY important that they're implemented correctly, to avoid breaking the game. I simply think heavy attacks, are after being combod (5+ hits to you) shoul activate some invincible frames. It's not an easy thing to change, but it can be added / tweaked for what I believe would be a more enjoyable experience. I wouldn't want to change what's here, just avoid some ♥♥♥♥ty situations that frustrate players, that are in all honesty, quite rare.

Another issue I've seen, is the timing on stuns / attack speeds. An example of this is the purple crabs towards the end. They will often stun you from above, then shoot at you again while you're stunned, leaving you absolutely zero time to avoid being stunned yet again. I was complaining about this flaw, then got hit just to show my girlfrind that the system was in fact in place, and sure enough, I was stunned 4 times in a row while attmpting to skill cancel out as soon as possible. The easy solution to this, is to alter the stun duration from the current attack speed of the enemies. Either shorten the stun, or increase or decrease the attack speed of the crabs.

A small thing that bothers me, and any "completionist" I'm sure, is the lack of knowledge that certain items are finite in the world, and that not everything can be upgraded. I personally don't like the design choice (though won't argue against it), however I do loath that players are informed that resources are finite, and that chohices made will effect the rest of the game. I can't get some weapons upgraded to max now, and many armors will never be touched, despite me wanting to try them. I'd personally make every material in the game a rare drop from some enemy or another, but that's just me.

The only other "issue" I found, was that I was able to reach some places when I wasn't suppsed to, so I lost track of where to go / what boss to fight next. Before I had bolt jump, I was able to fight the angel eye of whatever (can't recall the name), and was in the tower that you're supposed to go to after Bolt Jump. I wouldn't say this is a huge issue, though it did make me unsure of where to go, and had me backtracking a LOT to see if I had missed something.

These minor gripes aside, this is now one of my new favorite games. I absolutely love it, and can't wait to play as the other characters. I'd easily give the game a 8.5/10 as is. I'd point out what I love, but I'll save that for a review on my site later, as it'll easily be 2-3 times the length of this.
myhr2 Feb 8 @ 10:25pm 
Well, for the stun duration/invincibility frames, like you said, it's a matter of balance, very tricky to change, we'll see what the devs come up to, perhaps there isn't a solution to please everyone.

As for the completionist thing...In many games, I like to have an endgame save with everything maxed out, all the items, level max, all this. But here in Valdis Story, I think it's not that a big deal to "mess" a playthrough. Let me explain : you can currently respec your skills and stats, so it means you can redo most of your build. As for the equipement upgrades, they're...kinda optional, if you know what I mean, you can totally beat the game with everything level 1, because each weapon/armor/spell has its uses, even at level 1.

Thing is, I do believe that Valdis Story was heavily designed around replayability, so making mistakes in your first runs isn't important, and an endgame save isn't really meaningfull, after all. Yes, you can fail to save citizens, upgrade a magic you won't even use, or such, but it never prevents you to progressing, it makes it harder, but not impossible. In fact, you could look at this the other way round, it's not that making mistakes makes the game harder, but rather than experience makes it easier. And pretty much everything in this game revolves around experience : ennemy/boss patterns, upgrades, combat mechanics, synergies...But this is subjective as hell, I reckon.

As for accessing some areas too soon...Before one of the updates, you could'nt reach the Eye of Alagath before getting the Bolt Jump, but the ledge grab radius was increased (due to players feedback), which is very cool for the most part, buuuuut, not for that specific part. As for the Ziggurat, the tower you're refering to, it's meant to be accessible as soon as you get the Demon Key, so, yes, you can do it without the Bolt Jump.

not-tu Feb 8 @ 11:31pm 
Originally posted by Gemfruit:
I think my opinion came off too strong, and unclear.

I'm now at the end of the game, and I LOVE the design choices that were made. That being said, I still see a few "flaws", that perhaps are design choices, but aren't optimal. I still stand by the small invicnbility frames addition, thougha s stated early, it's VERY important that they're implemented correctly, to avoid breaking the game. I simply think heavy attacks, are after being combod (5+ hits to you) shoul activate some invincible frames. It's not an easy thing to change, but it can be added / tweaked for what I believe would be a more enjoyable experience. I wouldn't want to change what's here, just avoid some ♥♥♥♥ty situations that frustrate players, that are in all honesty, quite rare.

Another issue I've seen, is the timing on stuns / attack speeds. An example of this is the purple crabs towards the end. They will often stun you from above, then shoot at you again while you're stunned, leaving you absolutely zero time to avoid being stunned yet again. I was complaining about this flaw, then got hit just to show my girlfrind that the system was in fact in place, and sure enough, I was stunned 4 times in a row while attmpting to skill cancel out as soon as possible. The easy solution to this, is to alter the stun duration from the current attack speed of the enemies. Either shorten the stun, or increase or decrease the attack speed of the crabs.

A small thing that bothers me, and any "completionist" I'm sure, is the lack of knowledge that certain items are finite in the world, and that not everything can be upgraded. I personally don't like the design choice (though won't argue against it), however I do loath that players are informed that resources are finite, and that chohices made will effect the rest of the game. I can't get some weapons upgraded to max now, and many armors will never be touched, despite me wanting to try them. I'd personally make every material in the game a rare drop from some enemy or another, but that's just me.

The only other "issue" I found, was that I was able to reach some places when I wasn't suppsed to, so I lost track of where to go / what boss to fight next. Before I had bolt jump, I was able to fight the angel eye of whatever (can't recall the name), and was in the tower that you're supposed to go to after Bolt Jump. I wouldn't say this is a huge issue, though it did make me unsure of where to go, and had me backtracking a LOT to see if I had missed something.

These minor gripes aside, this is now one of my new favorite games. I absolutely love it, and can't wait to play as the other characters. I'd easily give the game a 8.5/10 as is. I'd point out what I love, but I'll save that for a review on my site later, as it'll easily be 2-3 times the length of this.
Thanks for taking all this time to write all this up

The devs appreciate all feedback and I'm sure this will help for any tweaks that might come in the future.

I completely agree the game can be frustrating lol. It's nice you still enjoyed it overall.
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