New Update

[Czar~<{(o)}>~Loki]

Read threw it and it all looks and sounds great. Lots of good tweaks I saw too and thank you for making the vendors trade a bit more. Seems like thats what it needed, no need for the unlimited amounts and I think this is a great fit. As always keep up the great work Styg!

[Karol13]

I like the tweaks too. But especially the trade change (that traders will buy only limited amount of specific items) leaves a gap "what to do with hoarded items".
There was a good suggestion : donating (and increasing relationship with specific group/station...)
Or there could be shops that would basically buy anything but for very low price. (let's say, any 100 items per month : so if I would find such shop I could sell there anything... but max 100 in 30 days)
The already implemented solutions is also fine : disassembling items into "ingredients" like fabric, leather... but this does not work for everything.
I would welcome the options of changing wealth (items) not into profit, but into diplomacy points, or helping the poor (karma?)

[Flugscheibeningenieur]

I also like the fact that you can recycle stuff and break it down, but I think crafting should be made much more powerful.
I had to invest a ton of points to even be able to craft my own armor and it was veeery slightly better than the one that I had looted from some opponent (basically it was the same).
Additionaly to the skillpoints it also cost me money to get some of the rare ingredients.

Also does stuff like persuade work yet?
I put some points into it but it always failed when I used it, just wondering.

Also does psy have any weakness at all?
As far as I can tell so far it always hits, which is especially brutal against those psy beetles, is there any drawback at all? (sure you need mana, but you also need ammo and repair with weapons)

[Adelion]

Persuasion does work but you need rather high amount of skill points invested in it to make a change at the important scenes. So some points will most likely not really help you that much and the outcome will probably be the same as without a skill value of zero.

As for the drawbacks of PSI. There are not really that much. For it to work you also need to spend lot of points into so you can not focus on other skills. The main problem ist the mana you need. Especially at the beginning the mana costs are pretty high for the spells and you need to watch out for the money so you can always purchase the PSI Booster. And you find way more ammo then PSI Booster. Personally I would say it is just a tiny bit trickier to play. Other than that PSI abilities are awesome.
I made a character both with high social skills and high PSI skills and it is working like a charm.

[Flugscheibeningenieur]

thx for the post, I currently started again because I didn't like the oddity system and also wanted to use my skillpoints a little better.

I run a crowssbowshooting trapper that also has high stealth, lockpicking, etc.
The game is pretty hard though right now, (minor spoilers), warehouse A is definitly HELL!

[Czar~<{(o)}>~Loki]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย AiCola:

thx for the post, I currently started again because I didn't like the oddity system and also wanted to use my skillpoints a little better.

I run a crowssbowshooting trapper that also has high stealth, lockpicking, etc.
The game is pretty hard though right now, (minor spoilers), warehouse A is definitly HELL!

yea I didnt like the oddity at first either seemed alot slower leveling at start of the game. I just got past the gorksy misson and im starting to like it a bit more. Even tho im playing a melee/gun class im finding it pretty fun.

I do have a major advantage tho as I have played through the game 7 or 8 times now so I know where I need to go and what not but this will be my first using the oddity system.

[Flugscheibeningenieur]

The main disappointment of the oddity system is that often you lockpick some lockers and first of all you invested skillpoints, second of all you needed to spend money on lockpicks, and then nothing is even inside, or just useless junk.
So with the classic system you did at least get some XP for picking the lock.
same goes with killing stuff you can't avoid through stealth.

[Czar~<{(o)}>~Loki]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย AiCola:

The main disappointment of the oddity system is that often you lockpick some lockers and first of all you invested skillpoints, second of all you needed to spend money on lockpicks, and then nothing is even inside, or just useless junk.
So with the classic system you did at least get some XP for picking the lock.
same goes with killing stuff you can't avoid through stealth.

yea, I too am definatly a fan of the classic rather than oddity but I wanted to give it a chance because I like the idea. I actually think that both systems should be merged. Instead of Oddity points there would be a set max amount of xp gain from the oddity set and you gained xp for each oddity item found until the set was complete.

This would give the same results for people playing difficult(combat weak) classes which from what Ive heard is the reason for the oddity system and at the same time make the classic fans happy. But however you play it, it still is a very difficult and challenging game.

[malfunction]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย AiCola:

The main disappointment of the oddity system is that often you lockpick some lockers and first of all you invested skillpoints, second of all you needed to spend money on lockpicks, and then nothing is even inside, or just useless junk.
So with the classic system you did at least get some XP for picking the lock.
same goes with killing stuff you can't avoid through stealth.

The oddities are supposed to be available to every build possible and not restricted to specific skills i.e a character build with low or no lockpick skill can still obtain all odditiy types. Also there usually are oddities on enemies you kill (except people, unless you count the Eels/Scrappers).

I enjoyed oddity a lot and feel it's fine as it is, in fact both systems work great in their own ways. Oddity is quite unique and different from the same ol' leveling up systems people are familiar with though it wont be everyones cup of tea, so it's good both systems are there to choose from.

[Flugscheibeningenieur]

I know that the oddity system is intended to help characters that aren't made for grinding, but I was getting at the problem of tons of lockers that you need to lockpick, but get NOTHING from it.
So you invested in your skill and spend money on lockpicks but have zero gain.
In the classic system it at least rewards XP to pick a lock which makes it a little better because you will level up faster.
That is one weakness of the oddity system, it is supposed to help people that can't just kill critters to level up, but it hurts other playstyles.
Of course another way to "fix" this would be better loot in lockers, but you wouldn't want that to be too powerful either :D

In the classic system you can still up the odditys and get some XP from them, I liked this very much, a mixture of both is what I'd go for (like the "classic" mode currently works in the game)

[Adelion]

โพสต์ดั้งเดิมโดย AiCola:

I know that the oddity system is intended to help characters that aren't made for grinding, but I was getting at the problem of tons of lockers that you need to lockpick, but get NOTHING from it.
So you invested in your skill and spend money on lockpicks but have zero gain.
In the classic system it at least rewards XP to pick a lock which makes it a little better because you will level up faster.
That is one weakness of the oddity system, it is supposed to help people that can't just kill critters to level up, but it hurts other playstyles.
Of course another way to "fix" this would be better loot in lockers, but you wouldn't want that to be too powerful either :D

In the classic system you can still up the odditys and get some XP from them, I liked this very much, a mixture of both is what I'd go for (like the "classic" mode currently works in the game)

I think you have to regard this "problem" from a statistical point of view. Finding oddities in oddity system is worth much more then the little experience you get in the classic system. I can't find correct numbers right now, so correct me if they are too wrong that the example may still work:
Let's say you have level 9 and to get to level 10 you need either 3000 xp or 10 oddity points. You now pick 10 locks getting 60 xp in classic mode for every lock = 600 experience points (600/3000 = 20 %). In oddity system behind 9 locks you find nothing and behind the tenth you find an oddity worth 2 points (2/10 = 20 %). The result is the same. One time you get the experience concentrated and one time you get a little every time. Like I said I'm missing the real numbers so I can't say for sure how far or how close those two systems are really. But I think in average the result will be the same.

[Flugscheibeningenieur]

I don't really have the real numbers on me either but the thing is if you are missing that one lock with the oddity you get nothing, if you only pick 9 locks in classic you still have 9/10 times the experience.

[Czar~<{(o)}>~Loki]

basically this is how I see it:

classic - most good combat classes should play this

oddity - for more of your off the wall odd charcter builds

I am glad we have options in how we level. Makes things little more interesting. I personaly enjoy the classic method and the way I play it doesnt prevent me from exploring more than I would on the other system. This is because I enjoy more of an, in your face, bust your ass charcter play style. When I get bored of that I may make some weird stealth persuasion class to play with the oddity system. Till then im gonna stick to my fav classic.

[Karol13]

After my few tries, I have not the feeling that one or the other system (classic/oddity) gives advantage / disadv. on level-up speed/progress. Oddity gives extra fun by "search for it" and by "there is always some info/history/detail behind each oddity". Some oddities are simple (rathound earring...) some are little more complex ... but it is always much more fun than just "you earned 25 XP" .