[AGS]Stronkie Mar 26 @ 4:26pm
Early Access Games In general , also about SpaceBase
I have been buying lately a couple of games in early Access , namely Rust , Dayz , 7 Days , Spacebase DF-9 , Space Engineers and Godus.

Most of the games looked very promising. But here comes the big nono... Only Rust , Space Engineers , DayZ and 7 Days seem to go on with developement.

My question about SpaceBase is really.. What are you guys thinking.. Asking money for able to Beta Test a game... I mean , at least I would espect weekly updates in what you guys are doing.

For people that say now.. What do you mean , you are not beta testing this game at all.

Well to the common Sense of Early Access :

===========================================

What is Early Access?

Get immediate access to games that are being developed with the community's involvement. These are games that evolve as you play them, as you give feedback, and as the developers update and add content.

We like to think of games and game development as services that grow and evolve with the involvement of customers and the community. There have been a number of prominent titles that have embraced this model of development recently and found a lot of value in the process. We like to support and encourage developers who want to ship early, involve customers, and build lasting relationships that help everyone make better games.

This is the way games should be made.

===========================================

Are we being involved in the development of this game?

* No we are not , Bugs , Remarks , Questions about the game are being Ignored

Do we receive constant updates about what the DEV's are doing?

* No we are not , Last Game update is from 17 Feb 2014

We are only "Paying the Dev's " to betatest their Game. So for me.. The statement is true.

I think this game will never go into Gold Status.

So my advice to everyone is.. Do not Ever Buy Early Access Games.. It is a waste of money, time and frustration.

Note : I have edited my Post to get my Point across more.
Last edited by [AGS]Stronkie; Mar 27 @ 11:09am
Showing 1-15 of 47 comments
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Elegant Caveman Mar 26 @ 4:46pm 
Um... just btw: Banished is not Early Access. It's a finished product.

As for early access in general:

You have to look at early access as a form of crowd-funding, like kickstarter.

They allow people to help out devs, either by giving them money early to help fund development or by helping with testing. Or both.

Some people enjoy taking part in the creative process: testing alpha and beta, giving feedback, helping shape the development path (even if just a bit), being part of the community from the beginning.

If you're not interested in doing those things, then no, you should never buy early access games. They're unfinished products, and you have no guarantee that the finished product (if it ever gets finished) will be what you expected/wanted. A lot of things (both good and bad) can happen during a game's development process, so crowd funding/early access is--inherently--a gamble.

Early access is there for people who believe in a project and want to help the devs. That's how you need to look at it. It allows indie devs to do things they otherwise wouldn't be able to, without having to rely on funding from big publishers which might ruin things.

In some cases (not the case with Space Base, I believe), Kickstarted games will come to early access. These are games that are already planned for release on Steam, and since they have alpha/beta tiers, it's easier to give people access through Steam (since that's where the game will end up on release) than to continuously make DRM-free independent copies available to their backers. And since they're here already, might as well give other people (who may have missed the kickstarter) the opportunity to join in, if they're interested.

Specifically about Space Base DF-9, take a look at this article[indie-fund.com].

A typical project for us has been in the range of $50k – $150k. We’ve also funded a few projects for smaller amounts, but never a project the size of Spacebase DF-9.

Spacebase required around $400k to develop, so it would have been unwise for Indie Fund to go it alone.

[...]

Spacebase DF-9 went into open alpha last month and recouped the entire $400k investment two weeks from that date. 85% of the revenue came in via Steam Early Access, and the other 15% via direct sales by Double Fine.

Without Steam early access, there's a good chance this game would never get made.

So is there something wrong with early access? Yes. Yes there is. And that "wrong" thing is that people don't understand it. The system itself is great, though, as far as I'm concerned. Allowing for games like this to get made.

If you don't want to help out during the early stages, that's perfectly fine. Nobody's forcing you to. Just don't buy early access games and wait for the final release.

The important thing is knowing what you're getting into. Caveat emptor ; buyer beware.
Last edited by Elegant Caveman; Mar 26 @ 5:20pm
Solarisfire Mar 26 @ 4:58pm 
Ummm they just put Multiplayer and survival into Space Engineer... Wouldn't say they've stopped development...
Caesar Mar 26 @ 5:05pm 
@OP

Well if you feel that way please never buy an EA game again. I personaly dont feel let down just yet for spacebase. They typicaly update once a month and yes this month seems to be running a little late but Im going to wait and see what they give us.

I have no problem with EA games, this gives the indie game devs a way to release their games without a costly puplisher. For example Underrail, an EA game, developed by one guy is a great game. Yes the updates are slow but I dont mind. I play so many games anyway that I just usually jump from game to game so monthly updates on an EA game is not torture for me.

Before buying any game and especialy an EA game, one should do his or her research into the game. So my advise would be, know what you are getting into and if you dont want to contribute then please wait for the game to be complete.

Please understand I do understand how you feel as I take a simular stance on TTG's The Walking Dead games and how they release each episode monthly or bi-monthly. I find that very annoying for an adventure game as I dont so much mind it in other EA games, depending of course. So I will not even buy a TTG until it is complete, or if I do its on sale and I dont touch it till its complete.

and @ Elegant Caveman, very well put sir I agree completly with your entire statement.
Last edited by Caesar; Mar 26 @ 5:09pm
Ensign Mar 26 @ 6:40pm 
You should educate yourself on this fine studio. This video is informative but extreamly funny. This is why you arent seeing an update yet. This is by the people making this game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHDpmCpTZuA

INCASE YOU DONT WATCH>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Spacebase DF9 releases monthly builds but u must not be familiar with Double FIne the makers of this game. Were u aware that every year they hold a "Amnesia Fortnight" where the whole studio stops working on thier games (like this one) for 2 weeks to get ideas on new games from around their office so that programmers or artists or coders who have game ideas can pitch it to all of us and they can run thier own dev teams dedicated to making games we vote on. You should subscribe to this channel, then when your youtube subs show this channel has uploaded a new spacebase video you know those are the patchnotes for new content. Also most of thier new indie games are sooo awsome.
END>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Space engineers just updated like 1 week ago.

Godus (while i hate how long it took) also updated about 2 weeks ago, they had to overhaul thier game for the past 6 months. We are gonna start seeing updates monthly (So says molenuex so mabey its a lie)

Banished is as Elegant Caveman said, a FINISHED game. It took him years to finish but its done now and sold as a finished product.

Im glad you didnt back Folktale its taken them a year to update with play content becuase they too had to remake thier game into a different format (sandbox) getting an update next month as well. I guess youd complain about that too.

Your kinda greedy OP. Again Elegant said it best.

Originally posted by Elegant Caveman:
Some people enjoy taking part in the creative process: testing alpha and beta, giving feedback, helping shape the development path (even if just a bit), being part of the community from the beginning.

If you're not interested in doing those things, then no, you should never buy early access games.

Early access is there for people who believe in a project and want to help the devs.
So is there something wrong with early access? Yes. Yes there is. And that "wrong" thing is that people don't understand it.

He/she is an idealist and a true beleiver of helping the creative process. Some people like me just pay to play the games but i do so understanding that its not possible to be like prison architect where you always get a punctual update every month. Some games are jsut a bit more complex. Your paying for a privillege to play early. Thats why your post is baffeling..

Originally posted by The Lack Of Engergy:
My question about SpaceBase is really.. What are you guys thinking.. Asking money for able to Beta Test a game...
Hello? Your paying to play early in your case, just like me. Thats why you paid to beta (its alpha) test. Becuase you got excited and u caught a case of the "OMG LOOKS SO GOOD I WANNA PLAY NOW DESPITE THE BUGS, SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY!" syndrome. Which is fine. Im doing that too, i love early access. But you have to understand you cant be greedly like your being. Weekly update? Any idea how long it takes to code/art/flesh out new content? I guess you never played an MMO before but u release content in huge batches. If we got weekly updates then you can expect something boreing that you would be done having fun with in the first hour. OOO a new room the pub! cant wait for next week when they release the bartender unit, oh cant wait for next week for the fridge, oh cant wait for next week when we get tables, oh cant wait till we get a stove. It must be monthly.


Its an art. Make engine, build early game, release to public. Will finish game in 9 months. Oh no public wants more bugs squashed for playability on current build, guess we better slow down on coding new content to patch current content. Finished date pushed back an aditional month. Game will finish in 10 months. Release new content, find it broke something fundemental in process, patch before working on patching what did work but requires reworking.....Its alot to take in and i for one can appreciate these things take time.
Last edited by Ensign; Mar 26 @ 6:45pm
NCMarshall Mar 26 @ 7:19pm 
Originally posted by Ensign:
You should educate yourself on this fine studio. This video is informative but extreamly funny. This is why you arent seeing an update yet. This is by the people making this game.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YHDpmCpTZuA

INCASE YOU DONT WATCH>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
Spacebase DF9 releases monthly builds but u must not be familiar with Double FIne the makers of this game. Were u aware that every year they hold a "Amnesia Fortnight" where the whole studio stops working on thier games (like this one) for 2 weeks to get ideas on new games from around their office so that programmers or artists or coders who have game ideas can pitch it to all of us and they can run thier own dev teams dedicated to making games we vote on. You should subscribe to this channel, then when your youtube subs show this channel has uploaded a new spacebase video you know those are the patchnotes for new content. Also most of thier new indie games are sooo awsome.
END>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>

Space engineers just updated like 1 week ago.

Godus (while i hate how long it took) also updated about 2 weeks ago, they had to overhaul thier game for the past 6 months. We are gonna start seeing updates monthly (So says molenuex so mabey its a lie)

Banished is as Elegant Caveman said, a FINISHED game. It took him years to finish but its done now and sold as a finished product.

Im glad you didnt back Folktale its taken them a year to update with play content becuase they too had to remake thier game into a different format (sandbox) getting an update next month as well. I guess youd complain about that too.

Your kinda greedy OP. Again Elegant said it best.

Originally posted by Elegant Caveman:
Some people enjoy taking part in the creative process: testing alpha and beta, giving feedback, helping shape the development path (even if just a bit), being part of the community from the beginning.

If you're not interested in doing those things, then no, you should never buy early access games.

Early access is there for people who believe in a project and want to help the devs.
So is there something wrong with early access? Yes. Yes there is. And that "wrong" thing is that people don't understand it.

He/she is an idealist and a true beleiver of helping the creative process. Some people like me just pay to play the games but i do so understanding that its not possible to be like prison architect where you always get a punctual update every month. Some games are jsut a bit more complex. Your paying for a privillege to play early. Thats why your post is baffeling..

Originally posted by The Lack Of Engergy:
My question about SpaceBase is really.. What are you guys thinking.. Asking money for able to Beta Test a game...
Hello? Your paying to play early in your case, just like me. Thats why you paid to beta (its alpha) test. Becuase you got excited and u caught a case of the "OMG LOOKS SO GOOD I WANNA PLAY NOW DESPITE THE BUGS, SHUT UP AND TAKE MY MONEY!" syndrome. Which is fine. Im doing that too, i love early access. But you have to understand you cant be greedly like your being. Weekly update? Any idea how long it takes to code/art/flesh out new content? I guess you never played an MMO before but u release content in huge batches. If we got weekly updates then you can expect something boreing that you would be done having fun with in the first hour. OOO a new room the pub! cant wait for next week when they release the bartender unit, oh cant wait for next week for the fridge, oh cant wait for next week when we get tables, oh cant wait till we get a stove. It must be monthly.


Its an art. Make engine, build early game, release to public. Will finish game in 9 months. Oh no public wants more bugs squashed for playability on current build, guess we better slow down on coding new content to patch current content. Finished date pushed back an aditional month. Game will finish in 10 months. Release new content, find it broke something fundemental in process, patch before working on patching what did work but requires reworking.....Its alot to take in and i for one can appreciate these things take time.
paying for the "privledge"? stop making excuses fanboy
Ensign Mar 26 @ 7:30pm 
Originally posted by NCMarshall:
paying for the "privledge"? stop making excuses fanboy

I didnt lie in my post have i? I guess prilllege does sound like fanboying so my bad. You tell me then. If you yourself arent paying to play the game early then why are you paying? Are you testing it so as to make the game better by posting bugs? If so is that fun for you? Is that what you signed up for? OP is paying becuase of what he said in his post he expects updates every week. So hes paying to play now. In other words the "privillege" of playing now as hes not doing it to fund these guys (if he was he woudlnt be complaining) and hes not doing it to report bugs (if he was he would have mentioned the devs have ignored his bug posts), so why is he paying if not for the sake of playing?

You say im making excuses? Well thats what OP is looking for no? "What excuse do the devs have for not updating already". Watch the video, the reason the update is delayed is becuase of amnesia fortnight that just happened a while ago. The update is 2weeks behind schedual. Can you drop a project come back in two weeks and know exactly where you were and what you were doing?
my•glass•eye Mar 27 @ 12:24am 
Originally posted by NCMarshall:
paying for the "privledge"? stop making excuses fanboy

Well gosh, wasn't your 'contribution' to this discussion worth the wait, eh?

(Spoiler: no. not it wasn't.)
[AGS]Stronkie Mar 27 @ 12:59am 
Let me explain my view more.

I agree about EA. That is an totally Early Access System ( I have simcity and BF4 ) :)

I love SpaceBase . I love making my own SpaceBase Station. It is not about that all. All the games I bought on Early Access , I love playing them.

I also know how the crowdfunding projects go. I personally do not mind paying for an early access game. But for me to feel how they put it (be part of the developement of the Game) , I need to get more information , more updates about the status of the Game. I want to see and know what I paid for.

Godus took 7 months before they posted anything at all , SpaceBase is now almost an month without any news and or updates . Banished is indeed no early access game , but still it is quiet on the fact of updates (yes I know the guy works alone on it ).

I love to betatest games and to send feedback to the DEVS . I have been betatesting games since the beginning of betatesting games. I have sended a couple of feedback post to their own forum. They do not react on it. So for me to justify to pay for betatest their game. I need feedback from them. I want in return.. STATUSUPDATES every week or so. Not much to ask is it.

PS as I said original in my post Space Engineers is indeed updated , but it is not my kind of game , that is why I did not mention it as such.

And I agree CaveMan's Post. But please try to see my view also.

So to the DEV's of SpaceBase.. (and godus) Please keep us updated every week . !!! That is all I ask for.
Last edited by [AGS]Stronkie; Mar 27 @ 1:08am
Sandormen Mar 27 @ 2:23am 
What itches my ear, is the whole early access thing, often with a steep price. The danger in this, is that those that are interested in the game, for playing and testing, and playing some more, is that in the end... ...When the game is ready to be launched as a regular finished product, there won't be any more buyers. Those who were interested has already bought it, so in a sense, it is not neccesary for the developers to care anymore, after a short time.
I wish people would boycott early access. It is counterproductive for getting quality games.
-If developers create a "#¤% product, well, then, It doesn't mattter for us anyways. Paying for Alpha/Beta-testing?? No thank You very much. Superhigh introductionary prices? Why? So a few people get cash for developing half-baked games? -Not saying this one is, but it could be this one too. What sounds like a good idea might actually backfire in the long run. What happens if people have the audacity of stopping the cashflow of todays betatesting. Would the developers actually have to reconsider their jobs? Maybe. -If so, why? -Because their products are uninteresting pieces of... ...junk.
scavenge Mar 27 @ 5:08am 
Originally posted by The Lack Of Engergy:
I have been buying lately a couple of games in early Access , namely Rust , Dayz , 7 Days , Spacebase DF-9 , Banished , Space Engineers and Godus.

Most of the games looked very promising. But here comes the big nono... Only Rust , DayZ and 7 Days seem to go on with developement. I will not talk about space engineer , that is a game I totally regret of buying.

My question about SpaceBase is really.. What are you guys thinking.. Asking money for able to Beta Test a game... I mean , at least I would espect weekly updates in what you guys are doing.

So my advice to everyone is.. Do not Ever Buy Early Access Games.. It is a waste of money.

Oh thanks for the advice, but I own exactly 0 EA titles. So maybe I should be the one warning people, not the guy with all the EA titles bought with his daddy CC.
my•glass•eye Mar 27 @ 5:45am 
Originally posted by Sandormen:
What itches my ear, is the whole early access thing, often with a steep price. The danger in this, is that those that are interested in the game, for playing and testing, and playing some more, is that in the end... ...When the game is ready to be launched as a regular finished product, there won't be any more buyers. Those who were interested has already bought it, so in a sense, it is not neccesary for the developers to care anymore, after a short time.
I wish people would boycott early access. It is counterproductive for getting quality games.
-If developers create a "#¤% product, well, then, It doesn't mattter for us anyways. Paying for Alpha/Beta-testing?? No thank You very much. Superhigh introductionary prices? Why? So a few people get cash for developing half-baked games? -Not saying this one is, but it could be this one too. What sounds like a good idea might actually backfire in the long run. What happens if people have the audacity of stopping the cashflow of todays betatesting. Would the developers actually have to reconsider their jobs? Maybe. -If so, why? -Because their products are uninteresting pieces of... ...junk.

What a load of ill-thought out rubbish. What on earth is the justification for telling people to boycott Early Access?

it works like this: developer wants to make a game, publisher doesn't think there's any money in it for them and refuses the funding required to make the game. Developer doesn't want to go through the hassle of Kickstarter and sending out all thoise rewards so asks gamers if they'd be interested enough in their game idea to buy into the Early Access, help them with bugtesting etc, in return for all the alphas and betas, and a full copy at release.

If enough gamers are interested in that idea to buy into the alpha, the developer gets money to make the game, which they can then sell when it's done. If they make more money selling the finished thing, groovy! If they don't, well, they tried, and hopefully didn't go bankrupt because they got some funding from the alpha.

If you don't want to pay for alpha access and all that comes with it, THEN DON'T. Just buy the finished game when it arrives. If it doesn't arrive, you've lost nothing. If it does arrive and you don't like the look of it or it reviews badly, you've lost nothing.

Everyone buying into Early Access knows what they're getting into. Leave those who are fine with that to enjoy what they've bught into, and be happy yourself with your own decision to not buy into the alpha.

Why anyone thinks they have a right to tell other people to boycott something that hasn't done them any harm I do not know.

If you've been burned by an Early Access dev completely abandoning a game you paid for the alpha of, well before completion, that sucks, but what it has to do with every other game in alpha I do not know.
my•glass•eye Mar 27 @ 5:48am 
Also, the reason many alpha prices are relatively high (well, high compared to your expectations of cheap games) is that it puts off people who like to buy low-priced games on impulse, find a biug and then whine about it.

By pricing quite high (relative to expectations of cheap games) you cut out such impulse purchasers, and tend to only get people who know full well what they're getting into.

But you just want cheap games and don't understand why an alpha isn't cheap. Okay, but I've just explained it to you so hopefull that'll be that, yeah? :)
edesignspl Mar 27 @ 9:16am 
Originally posted by NCMarshall:
paying for the "privledge"? stop making excuses fanboy

DING DING DING! We have a winner!!! I don't get the new mentality of paying for the "privilege" of testing a game. Maybe I'm old school. Maybe I'm just aware of too many "pay for privilege" games not going anywhere. Or maybe I just believe that developers should be privileged to have anybody alpha or beta test their products in their own free time without compensation. Special skins and a few items are not compensation; in general it's a cop-out imho. Not once have I ever been in a game and seen someone else with a special skin or weapon and thought, "Wow, they're cool, they pre-ordered or beta tested. I wish I had those." Plenty of other items and skins can usually be found in-game that are as good or better.

Honestly, exactly how much game content and features are implemented in these games that wouldn't be there regardless of "privileged access" players' input? I haven't seen anything that is really revolutionary. Mostly just rehashed stuff from other games that should be in there without input.

Privilege to pay to test and give input...lmao. Brainwashed.
Last edited by edesignspl; Mar 27 @ 9:18am
shadeling Mar 27 @ 10:13am 
If it weren't for this crowdfunding phenomena, we wouldn't be experiencing the PC gaming renaissance we are enjoying now because we would still be at the mercy of the big publishers who would continue to happily dictate what we get to play based on their marketing surveys and not what their fans want.

I sure as hell don't want to go back to that. As this new development trend matures, more gamers will be figuring out whether or not getting involved in early access is for them. The sooner more realize EA isn't for them, the better this whole process will be for everyone involved.
Caesar Mar 27 @ 10:23am 
Originally posted by shadeling:
If it weren't for this crowdfunding phenomena, we wouldn't be experiencing the PC gaming renaissance we are enjoying now because we would still be at the mercy of the big publishers who would continue to happily dictate what we get to play based on their marketing surveys and not what their fans want.

I sure as hell don't want to go back to that. As this new development trend matures, more gamers will be figuring out whether or not getting involved in early access is for them. The sooner more realize EA isn't for them, the better this whole process will be for everyone involved.

I agree, I think people just need to be informed on what EA actualy is. No one is twisting your arm to buy the game other than yourself. Its very simple, if you dont want to buy an EA game, then fn DONT BUY IT, but I guess thats to complicated for some.

All this crying about EA games and kids or grown adults crying like kids, demanding that we boycott it is just simply put ignorant. If you feel that way about EA game you definatly dont belong in the EA crowd. Most of us EA gamers love to give feedback, report bugs and help improve the game in anyway we can but if you dont then please dont buy any EA games.... and there is nothing wrong with that if you dont just wait for the game....
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Date Posted: Mar 26 @ 4:26pm
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