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steam://openurl/http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2013-11-27-how-the-sausage-was-made
And it's not so maddening "If we can't reasonably find why should be there, then there's no really need" in other words, if it flows the same even without oil, so there's no need of lamp oil, the game will be the same.
And it's your opinion arguable or not, but in 1899 there were elettricity so no one used iol lamp no more, just pointing out if you missed that bit.
I like it and i'll support bto Frictional and Chinese Room in their future projects, you're free to support them or not, where's the problem? It's not that they killed you cat whit that game. It's a game not a bad wife.
I read the one from the guardian (where they sound like huge spoiled brats seriously) and they said that they removed the mechanics because they didn't want to make the same game as TDD, which is fine, but the problem is: they didn't gave us anything to replace the removed mechanics, they simply removed them. That is as if a car manufacturer said "I'm going to make a car that is different to other cars...one without a steering wheel!" without offering you something to replace the freaking wheel.
Ever heard the phrase "If it's not broken, don't fix it"? Well it goes perfect with what TCR did.
Do you seriously think the game would have been the same if it had "oil" or tinderboxes or sanity? You know its called "survival horror" for a reason right?.
In the first game, you had to manage your inventory, oil wasn't infinite, you couldn't walk around with the lantern on for the entire game, but if you turned it off, your sanity would go down, which would in turn lure the monsters to you. If that isn't scary and super tense to you, then I dont know what would be.
If the devs couldn't find a justification for these mechanics, then i will simply say they lacked creativity and common sense, why? because these mechanics were justified by simply saying: to make this game scarier, you know, the horror game you paid us to make? Like what you did with the 1st game, where you didn't want to turn off the lantern but you knew you had to before you ran out of oil, but at the same time you knew that if you did it then it would lure the monsters to you?.
Or physical interaction, in the 1st game you could barricade yourself inside a room with boxes, you could try to hide inside a cupboard. They couldn't justify that? they couldn't say "we are doing this so as to increase the scare factor, the inmersion factor"
No man, the problem here is that TCR simply seems to have a superiority complex, they think that every game they make is a huge piece of art and that anyone who disagrees is an illiterate monkey. They want to make a "unique" game, they don't want to have anything in common with another one, even if it means removing every single gameplay feature to just make it a walking simulator.
Nope sorry, they have rights to do what they please to their game.
Game can have nice story and gameplay, but even no story and nice gampleay and no gameplay and a nice story. You kno what makes great? Different games for different audiances, or we end whit the same game again and again who everyone hates. You think that a a game should be made in a way to please you, but it's up to you, i'm fine with story driven games, are part of my game tastes, not yours, no problem with the devs here, only yours. I like open rpgs, point &click adventures, brainless fps, and games like Machine and Dear Esther. Very different kind of games for different moods and moments. If you focus on one only aspects you'll miss many many great games and movies, as what fits to you doesen't for me. Think about that. And if fifn't fits for me or for you it's nobody faults nore harms, we play something else, why that need to yeld disappointmet? I don't think you run trought the streets blaming summer to be so hot. So, why acting like that on a forum, were personal opinions are slapped as worldwide facts?
And by the way, survival in't not about inventory managment, but surviving a dreadfull enviroments, whit or without help of any sort. It's not about erbs or ammos, but your brain against the dangers.
Again: You better not make a car without a steering wheel.
If you don't like games with no gameplay, then why are you playing GAMES? It might be a different medium altogether. Games are meant to have gameplay, not just being "walk from point A to point B".
The problem here is that you are the one who likes less stuff and you are trying to tell us that we can't complain about getting less because some people like getting less.
So in other words, you're saying something like "I don't like to work 8 hour shifts for a normal salary, I want to work 16 hour shifts for a normal salary, therefore there should be more jobs that require you to work 16 hours for 8 hour's salary!"
And that's a problem, because you may not like getting "the full package", but others do, and since others are asking for more, you really don't have a say (since you are asking for less).
The majority of people want games with gameplay, no one is saying "remove story from games!", but we don't want to be ripped off with games that are just, like I said, walking simulators, we don't want to have our favorite games ruined like that.
And the biggest issue here is that Amnesia was already a established IP, people were already expecting something, and they killed it completely, I wouldn't have mind these things if this was just "A machine for pigs" instead of "amnesia AMFP" How would you feel if you were a big zelda fan and you found out that the next zelda game will no longer be adventure but will be an cross-species dating sim? I'm pretty sure you'd be ill pissed.
You're basically saying that you'd be okay with someone who owed you money if they came over to your house to pay you, with only the president's face under the excuse of "Oh, it's because this is the nicest part of the bill, therefore, you do not need the other parts!"
You like getting less, we get it, but dont try to force that "Less is better! you guys who like to get a better value for your money are wrong!" mentality on us.
I said as long someone find a game entertaining, despite the features, it's ok, why arguing on that? I said, there are games with both, with one and with none of the above, and it's better that way so everyone will find what fits to him, instead of a pre packaged game who no one likes. The more the choice, the more the fun for more people, why can't you see that equation?
So, where's my issue in that? If you find it boring it's up to you, they don't have to change their game to applease YOU, nore ME. Play something else, you bought a game that ended boring to you, oh god what a shame! Move on, seriously.
I am pretty sure he is condoning this behavior from the devs. You can't ever please everyone, thats a fact of life. But that's not the problem here, the problem is that TCR basically took Amnesia, an established IP, ripped it to shreds, burned most of the shreds and only gave us 2 (the story and atmosphere).
And that he is condoning this, under the excuse of "they can do whatever they want with their game, a minority of people like me liked it so they should keep doing that!"
The freaking car analogy again. They took a fully functional car, removed the steering wheel, sold it and said "it's a unique car because it has no steering wheel". And I'm not going to agree with someone who supports that behavior from devs.
"games" like those will slowly smother the industry if that behavior is never reprimanded.
And yes, sorry illgib but your english is simply too hard to understand for me and you just end up sounding like a really self entitled brat, even if you're not, my apologies for that, I'm just having a very hard time reading you.
I never agued if you don't like it, i never said you're an idiot or you must like it, i blame the attitude, if someone fiund something not in his chords, than it's ♥♥♥♥. No, i'm sorry but nope.
And an Ip made by one title? Penumbra it's an Ip, Amnesia absolutely not. Now it's an Ip with two games. Justine doesn't count it's a free Portal 2 promotional custom story.
Typo, damn' old keyboard.
That's exactly how I felt with AMFP, they nearly removed everything that made the first game interesting and didnt replaced it with anything, that has been my point throughout the entire discussion.
And yes, it's an IP, a single game makes an IP, IP stands for intellectual property. I could write a 50 pages draft about a monkey who goes to fight against demons in the moon and it would still be an IP.
Amnesia was an IP, it had an established gameplay, they ripped it to shreds, it was pretty obvious that most fans wouldn't be happy
Again i point out Penumbra Overture.
They removed fight mechanichs and some inventory management because they found it was pointless and people were spoiling their game searching weapons instead of solving puzzles. They sat at table "So, what we do whit weapons? Are really usefull? How and why? No out of dubt answers? Ok we can remove then test it" and it worked for what they had in mind.
Chinese Room did the same. "The inventory managment is really usefull for what we want to achieve, focusing people on the enviroments and the story? No it will distract them from our goal, making them living an experience and a story, remove and try it" and it worked in some way.
And puzzles where pretty much the same, were are that complicated puzzles in Dark Descent?
An acid in the Storage room collected in a jar took in the Wine Cellar.
Some lever scattered in the Storage Room to activate an elevator to the Prison, activated by some cogs scattered around the Machine Room (pick it up and place in the machine, next room. Nothing different from picking up a cog here to place it there)
There where two or three real puzzles, the Steam Control levers, the bridge in the Cistern and the needle in the Mourge. All the rest are pick that here and place it in the inventory, and use it next room. That's why they removed inventory, there's no real need of it, because what ill mind would create Resident Evil's puzzles in a house to open a simple door? They are totally immersion braking in games like that, imo. They are easy, a lever and nothing more. And of what you need to open a door?
Their goal where to tell a story and they achived it, no matter what haters think of it.
Frictional wanted to scare the hell out of people, and they achived that too.
Two different games with different goals, why we have to compare them?
The title means nothing, as Amnesia is a state of mind of both the characters and nothing more. Both hare fighting against dark enviroments, Daniel against a Shadows and ancient magic, Mandus against his own ghost. Lovecraft and Poe. Same goal. Different ways to achieve it.
But, if you remove them from Dark Descent i would be a bit disappointed too, it worked that way (but who knows) but with a completely new game you can't arbitrary repilcate the same formula expecting the same success or scary exerience. You alredy know how things works and when you meet a monster you'll simply over run him whitout a single sweat drop. That would be disappointing.
They simply put out their point of view, if didn't catch you it's not their fault, they wanted to tell a story in their way, nothing more. They aren't Frictional so you can't pretend the same game only by a title or an old teaser.
Alien and Aliens, again.
Yes, the developers thought players are too stupid to follow a plot AND at the same time handle some challenge.
So they didn't figure out "It should be here to give the players challenging, fun and adrenaline inducing gameplay". Brilliant.
By the way, an electric flashlight can run out of batteries.
I think what this all boils down to is: you can make any game you want as a video game company. No one has the right to tell them that what they're making is wrong, because it actually is their "artistic merit" to make the game they want.
BUT!!!
That being said, there is no reason to make a VERY different game and still call it the same name as a previous game. It invites unwanted comparison to the older game, which the developers would clearly want to avoid if they are truly wanting a "new experience", and it causes the players to believe that they are buying into and getting ready to play is a game that is a sequal to its similarly named predicessor.
In the case of Amnesia: A Machine for Pigs, these things could have been completely avoided, with people simply either enjoying the game or not, and not having such strong emotions over it, if the developers called it nothing more than; A Machine for Pigs.
These guys also made the Penumbra series. Funny thing there is, each game is almost exactly the same gameplay as the other. Why is this acceptable to the player? Because the player assumes (rightly so... ) that the gameplay would remain the same given the fact that it is a series.
Labeling it "Amnesia" is the real issue. You don't hear people comparing it to Penumbra so strongly. Or even though they do compare it to Outlast... its not so strong of a hate as when its compared to Amnesia: The Dark Decent. Only when compared to TDD is AMFP hated by certain people.... and honestly, they are completely justified in hating the game that much.
You can't make a new car, call it a Dodge Viper 2014... and make it a pick up truck.
You can't make a movie called The Hobbit and have it take place on Mars with spaceships and claim its the Hobbit just because you have little people running around.
You can't do these things, label them a certain way to market them, and then blame the consumer for believing what they were told when they heard the name of the product. When I tell you I'm selling you a Dirt Devil Vacuum... you don't expect me to give you a salad bowl in exchange for your money.
Even musicians will pull away from the band they are in and make music under a new band or different name to not fool the listener into thinking they're getting the same style of music from the same musician.
TL;DR This all boils down to REALLY bad marketing on their part. They should not have called it Amnesia as it stimulates the buyer into believing that they will get an Amnesia game. They ESPECIALLY shouldn't call it Amnesia if they are wanting to create some sort of creative new game. If they want to make a new game.... give it a new name and more people will be happy with the end product.