Mendozacheers Nov 3, 2013 @ 8:37am
Suggestions how to turn this game around.
So we all know how unfortunate this game have been. getting released in this state is gonna recude A LOT of players and future pruchases. However, I feel that it's still possible to turn around. Sadly, the amount of money gained from the pre-orderes might not be enough.

I suggest going full on "apologize" mode. I know the developers have tried it a litte bit with giving away copies to the pre-orders. But I think making a little at a time is not gonna do such big of a difference. I suggest making several additions, changes, bonuses, features whatever and then stack them up until a BIG patch. I know it is possible, there just have to be patience, time and money.

Here are a few suggestions:


1. Fix all the bugs. Obviously this is number 1 priority, and I know a lot has been fixed already. Get a proper testing team together to test every single aspect of this game. The bugs are the only thing that made this game fail so hard. There can't be a single bug left.

2. Get back your base audience, the ones who backed your kickstared, the ones who pre-ordered and everyone who owns the game. These guys are the most disappointed, they should be "bribed" to return to your game. You have to flatter them A LOT for that to happen. Just a tiny thing could make someone leave a game, and he/she requires 10x back to return. Do this with more free content, maps, weapons, game modes, settings, stats, EVERYTHING.

3. Get a new audience, people who did not get your game will not ever get it unless something is done. There's TOO MUCH bad rep regarding this game, on metacritic, on steam etc. Make them change their minds. This could be accomplished by a free weekend, giveaways, promotions, live streams etc. You will need a new audience to build up the old one.

4. Content is key. More content never goes wrong, as long as it's good of course. Make more maps, more weapons, more customizations, more server settings, more game modes! Get a hold of other game studios for a colaboration. Maybe get a Rainbow Six map ported over, that will light some fire in the fans. Get a SWAT4 game mode, where you have to cuff enemies and use non-leathal methods to get to your goal etc. There are many options here. BE VERY CREATIVE! Creativity is what makes a game explode.

5. Get more features. Minor ones, Major ones whatever. Steam Achievements, Steam Leaderboards, Steam Cloud, Steam Trading Cards, etc. You are already on Steam, take advantage of that. These features are easier to make than more game content. Achievement hunters will play whatever, as long as there is achievements. Same goes for Badge Collectors. Steam Leaderboards could be useful for speed running the maps, which is optimal for this type of game.

6. Get publicity again. Try get a hold of some YouTubers to cover your game during late beta. Get them to show their audience what you have improved! Let them speak freely about your game, don't put them under sillt NDA's (nobody likes those).

7. As I first mentioned, DON'T release 1 thing at a time (Except the bug fixing perhaps). 1 Small update a week will not make people notice your game again. YOU HAVE to make a BIG UPDATE, a bomb. People will look at the patch notes and the free content and they will be amazed about the length, the time and the efforts you have put on this game. IT will work, if everything is done properly.


I believe in this. It's going to be hard as hell, you will not get any money from your player base, and people will look down on your game for months. However, if you succeed - this big update, including the support from streamers and youtubers, This game will turn around.

This thread is mainly for the developers, if they are not listening to their fans - they will not manage this. Also, please don't TL;DR this, to narrow it down would actually be a mistake in this case, you are however welcome to post your suggestions here.
Showing 1-15 of 30 comments
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Ulcerus Nov 3, 2013 @ 6:45pm 
They would more or less need to remake everything and build up a new fanbase/crowd/audience to save this one...

I think it would be easier (still not easy though) to just make a new game that actually has the content we all expected but never got.

Fixing T:RS seems like trying to get a dead dog moving by pushing it with a stick.
itsTEOTWAWKI (banned) Nov 3, 2013 @ 9:20pm 
Originally posted by Ulcerus:
They would more or less need to remake everything and build up a new fanbase/crowd/audience to save this one...

I think it would be easier (still not easy though) to just make a new game that actually has the content we all expected but never got.

Fixing T:RS seems like trying to get a dead dog moving by pushing it with a stick.

I agree Ulcerus, even if they were to patch "Takedown: Red Sabre" into the best tactical shooter the world has ever known, the game would still suffer from its reputation. Hopefully a developer with the right skill set will take a swing at reviving the "tactical shooter" genre. Hopefully they'll get picked up by the right publisher too.
Mendozacheers Nov 4, 2013 @ 2:20am 
Originally posted by itsTEOTWAWKI:
I agree Ulcerus, even if they were to patch "Takedown: Red Sabre" into the best tactical shooter the world has ever known, the game would still suffer from its reputation. Hopefully a developer with the right skill set will take a swing at reviving the "tactical shooter" genre. Hopefully they'll get picked up by the right publisher too.

If this game was a MOBA, then yes - they would never be able to turn around from a bad rep. However, as a tactical shooter this game is pretty much the only one on the market atm. People would play anything no matter the reputation if the game offers what no other game offers.

Take Infestation: Survivor Stories (The War Z) for example. There are 1500 people playing this as I am writing this. That game is 10x more infamous that this title, with the developers lying, "stolen" game ideas, removed metacritic page, countless amount of videos on YouTube showing this game's true nature. Most of all - Buggy to the point that Valve removed it from the Steam Store. Not even Takedown has done That bad.

So why were people playing it, because that genre is heavily demanded right now. The stand alone DayZ is still in development and the original mod was a mess to install and get to work. If this game had 1/3 of the players of Infestation: Survivor Stories, it would survive. 500 people playing at the same time, this early in the morning is GOOD.

The Tactical Shooter might not be as demanded as the Zombie Survival genre, but it sure has a lot of demands. The fans want a real new Rainbow Six, and a real new SWAT4 and there is currently no game offering that. However, it's just a matter of time until the next company tries to deliver this content, and if Takedown is at the same stage by then - they are screwed.

I am not saying that it will be easy for them to turn this game around, but it's certainly possible. There have been much worse cases that have.
[UTC]TekHousE Nov 4, 2013 @ 4:41am 
Originally posted by Ulcerus:
They would more or less need to remake everything and build up a new fanbase/crowd/audience to save this one...

I think it would be easier (still not easy though) to just make a new game that actually has the content we all expected but never got.

Fixing T:RS seems like trying to get a dead dog moving by pushing it with a stick.

Agreed! We got ripped off, Christian got a new car or made a bigger than normal mortgage payment..And moved on..

This game is dead unfortunately.
CallsignWulf Nov 4, 2013 @ 8:18am 
WarZ is being played because people are completely blind and ignorant, like some people here.
The game may still be "fun" for people, and that makes them ignore the ♥♥♥♥ devs and morals and everything going on behind the scenes (or in front of them).
This is why the game industry is going south, people keep letting things slide because they may get just a little enjoyment out of a game.
There are other tactical shooters out there. All the Ghost Recon games are still for sale and easily accessible, y'know, the "REAL" tactical shooters we were all looking for. The ones that actually have tactical shooter features and gameplay.
Mendozacheers Nov 4, 2013 @ 8:28am 
Originally posted by CallsignWulf:
WarZ is being played because people are completely blind and ignorant, like some people here.
The game may still be "fun" for people, and that makes them ignore the ♥♥♥♥ devs and morals and everything going on behind the scenes (or in front of them).
This is why the game industry is going south, people keep letting things slide because they may get just a little enjoyment out of a game.
There are other tactical shooters out there. All the Ghost Recon games are still for sale and easily accessible, y'know, the "REAL" tactical shooters we were all looking for. The ones that actually have tactical shooter features and gameplay.

Those games are old and most likely already played (The newer Ghost Recon is discluded), we want a NEW and FRESH tactical shooter. People seem to be blinded by the rage of this title that they forget that the easiest way of getting what you want is for the developers to do the right choices here.

They made an anti-consumer decision releasing this game at it's state, but what they had was very promising. Too many consumers just go to rage mode the moment a developer have made a wrong turn. I, for one, wish to see things from a positive perspective and try and give my 2 cents. Making this game an enjoyable product is not Impossible, as some people like to believe, but rather Very time consuming, expensive and hard. That does not make it impossible.

The War Z got 2600 current players right now. I usually say this to people who call League of Legends and Call of Duty bad: That many players would not be playing it unless they find enjoyment in it. If something has enjoyment, then that is a successful product. Whether or not that game is for You specifically is a whole other matter. (I hate CoD and LoL, that does not make them bad games)

I feel that the developers also made the mistake of making these discussions only for the owners of the game. Everyone in here have spend money on it and thereof the constant disappointment. Personally I spend a lot of money on games, so it has not affected me in a major way. I feel that the developers should probably hear some Good positive discussions rather than the constant stream of whining. We have the right to complain, but the developers know that they were wrong, it's up to them now to try and make Right, and the OP is about that.
CallsignWulf Nov 4, 2013 @ 11:52am 
Had you read my post you'd see I understand that people get enjoyment out of said games. But whether or not it's fun doesn't make it good or succesful. Arma3 is quite a bit of fun, but a disappointment still. The engine is still old and crappy being 10 years old, and it's still basically Arma 2 with physics and some new graphics, (and a movement system which was taken from an Arma2 mod). I can't really respect Bohemia for that. That being said they make up for it with other things, like the modding support (and actually supporting modders efforts and helping them) and community responses and CONSTANT fixes. Here we have nothing to make up for the crap we're getting.
I'm saying whether or not someone has fun with the game or not, the FACT is, some devs and publishers made a ♥♥♥♥ decision and ripped a bunch of people off, a few people ignoring that and liking the game doesn't make that fact go away, they can enjoy the game all they want and that's fine. Some people don't care for the moral standards and gaming standards of others, and I feel bad for them to allow their own standards to go that low. I for one won't let that happen to me.
And you didn't say anything about a NEW tactical shooter before, you said "However, as a tactical shooter this game is pretty much the only one on the market atm", that being said, all the old tactical games are STILL on the market, and perform "tactica", a lot better than this game, at around the same price for most of them.
I also feel the devs, as well as publishers have made a mistake, quite a big one, and with how they are treating things atm, I really doubt they will ever fix that mistake, and with the current state of things, I really hope they don't. We just need to be patient and wait for a real team to get on board with the tactical shooter genre.
The fact is they claimed the game would be one thing and it was another. It was also greatly and still is greatly unfinished in terms of it actually working still, so it needs an early access tag. The devs and publishers need to get their ♥♥♥♥ing PR people together and do something because they keep saying "we don't have this or that ready for a statement" and just a bunch of cop outs.
They need to market the game as a generic shooter that has nothing better than the older games they TRIED to copy.
If they had done that and I bought the game, I wouldn't even be ♥♥♥♥ed, because it would have been my fault for not reading and buying the damn thing.
But atm it's like an opaque box of candy saying it's jolly ranchers, open the thing up and it's nerds instead. I like both, but I payed for the damn jolly ranchers, if I wanted nerds I would have gone a shelf over and bought them.
Mendozacheers Nov 4, 2013 @ 12:03pm 
Just because clothes from the 70's still exists, you don't use the term "being on the market". This whole discussion is about getting a new game in the genre that does not suck. We could either wait for a company to magically appear out of nowhere to make one for us, or we try and use the resources "we" have to try and make that happen = push the developers to retry and not give up, they will not get our money, and apparently not our patience - but hey, it's closer than not having it at all.

"It's easier to just make a game from scratch" (the genereic response to this). Well so be it. Who will make this game? Shall we just wait around for another kickstarter? Even if every aspect sucked about this game (which they didn't), these guys are 1 step ahead of nothing by just TRYING. Failing horribly sure, but they wanted and they tried. I don't know these guys, they could be total jackasses, ignoring the pleads from the customers, I still want to try and get some facts (as well as speculations) written down to "support" the potential future of this game.
Ulcerus Nov 4, 2013 @ 12:07pm 
Originally posted by Mendozacheers:
Just because clothes from the 70's still exists, you don't use the term "being on the market". This whole discussion is about getting a new game in the genre that does not suck. We could either wait for a company to magically appear out of nowhere to make one for us, or we try and use the resources "we" have to try and make that happen = push the developers to retry and not give up, they will not get our money, and apparently not our patience - but hey, it's closer than not having it at all.

"It's easier to just make a game from scratch" (the genereic response to this). Well so be it. Who will make this game? Shall we just wait around for another kickstarter? Even if every aspect sucked about this game (which they didn't), these guys are 1 step ahead of nothing by just TRYING. Failing horribly sure, but they wanted and they tried. I don't know these guys, they could be total jackasses, ignoring the pleads from the customers, I still want to try and get some facts written down to "support" the potential future of this game.
Yes, well, kudos to them for trying. Does that give me any joy for my money? Nope.
Cash down the drain.

Don't get me wrong. I get what you're saying. I just don't agree at all...
CallsignWulf Nov 4, 2013 @ 12:14pm 
Ground Branch already looks more promising than this, they actually post semi constant updates on their site and have gameplay/demo videos.
And why wait for someone to make the "new non sucky" games when we have games from 5-10 years ago that are still better? Just keep playing them. If I'm going to give in and give the devs a chance to retry, they need to make a public statement to the masses about their ♥♥♥♥ up, it NEEDS to be done. Any good person would do that. I wouldn't make a ♥♥♥♥ game like this and just play it off like nothing's wrong. On the forums they even ask for help to reproduce bugs and ask what bugs people have. They haven't even played their own game clearly, they're more than likely still on Rainbow Six 3 and older Ghost Recon games. The bugs that people reported at the launch of this game were so blatantly obvious, took only 5 minutes of playing to notice them (not exaggerating). They either didn't do any kind of QA or they're just playing it off like nothing happened at all.
I cannot give anyone kudos or respect for that at all, not until they own up and admit their mistakes.
And as far as them "trying", as much as I hate to say it, some people are better off not trying. Cold and hard truth right there.
It doesn't matter if they're 1 step above nothing when the older still functional and somewhat populated games are still 15 steps above nothing.
Bob Lee Swagger (banned) Nov 6, 2013 @ 9:15am 
give everybody a refund, delete all traces of the game, and try really hard to forget that it ever existed.
xG| Oofta Nov 6, 2013 @ 1:34pm 
I don't think it will ever be a huge game. Most peoples views are already soured by the bad release. It's sad because if they would have released it in this state it would have done much better.
DemonX_RD Nov 6, 2013 @ 3:59pm 
Originally posted by CallsignWulf:
Ground Branch already looks more promising than this, they actually post semi constant updates on their site and have gameplay/demo videos.

This is true.... they have been posting about this game since 2007. You hold your breath for it.. I wont.
CallsignWulf Nov 6, 2013 @ 4:49pm 
Originally posted by DemonX_RD:
Originally posted by CallsignWulf:
Ground Branch already looks more promising than this, they actually post semi constant updates on their site and have gameplay/demo videos.

This is true.... they have been posting about this game since 2007. You hold your breath for it.. I wont.
Stuff has been posted about this game and it's development for a while. What's different, besides the fact that GB actually looks good, and are continuing even after the Kickstarter failed, and that they are following a strict guideline when making the game realistic and tactical, and the constant updates and communication, and the current assets that actually look good already.
I'll gladly hold my breath for something that actually looks promising, and for a dev team that's dedicated to their project.
DemonX_RD Nov 6, 2013 @ 6:32pm 
Dev team? You mean john and kris? lol
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Date Posted: Nov 3, 2013 @ 8:37am
Posts: 30