Pixel_Pro Mar 10, 2013 @ 10:53am
Why not just >>>>
Give this on the house?

Nope i dont feel entitled nor do i expect anything for nothing BUT when paying 60 a pop and getting screwed w/ garbage more times than desired it would be nice to get some of this stuff with the game w/o pre-order or paying for dlc. I appreciate collectors edition when they ARE done right but this falls into a category of freebie imo, if im missing something about this being worth the 3 bucks please explian BUt keep in mind i was never too keen on "digital artbooks" to mee they make no sense and i would much rather a physical artbook to say the least.

If this was a physical item than yes i could see the cost of manuf etc but they are not
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SigmaHyperion Mar 10, 2013 @ 12:41pm 
For the same reason you can't go to Burger King and pick up a Soda "On the House" after you buy a burger at McDonald's.

This is made BY AN ENTIRELY SEPARATE COMPANY (or 'guy' rather, doubt it's more than just Geoff).

So some guy (who's done a couple of these previously for Portal 2 and ME3 that were really, really well done) spends hundreds of hours travelling, taking photos, prepping interviews, writing, creating videos, the file, editing, etc, etc, etc for upcoming games that he thinks are gonna be really big, and wants to get a couple bucks for the work that he did.

Does anyone complain that BradyGames is charging money for the Guide it created for the game? It's EXACTLY the same thing.

I can't gauge whether this particular one is worth the money or not (not bought it yet, was coming here to gauge opinion), but I can tell you that the ME3 and Portal 2 ones were some of the best $3 I've ever spent. Really good writing and really wonderful insights to the development process that are FAR more in-depth than the BS marketing crap that we get from internal ('free') efforts of something remotely similar, and I probably spent more time reading than the time I spend on a sizeable percentage of $60 games that end up being turds. And, to reference an earlier point, certainly worth more than any of the $20+ Guides that I've purchased.
Pixel_Pro Mar 10, 2013 @ 1:09pm 
I beg to argue that yes you can get a coke from burger king if buying something else..
Obviously you have strong opinions on the dlc practice anyways thanks for taking so much time to respond it was a very nice gesture , maybe unitentional but a nice gesture none the less..

enjoy your dlc :)

also if you were to say infinity ward was making guides than that would be something to discuss, Brady guides can not be compared w/ the likes of dlc.. YOU do NOT miss out on a FULL exp if choosing to not buy a guide and although this dlc isnt really one which would hinder an exp i just consider it a"tacky " practice due to the contents and price point for this digital material.

I myself have never bought a guide other than witcher 2 and that was more of a wanting more content to what was a great game, quality but i have gotten some guides via collectors editions but only ones that i consider reasonable for the content included.

I have seen this dlc and let me just say take a look at it and then come back, seriously.. How can you argue a point when you have no insight? im not talking about guides and switching topics to enforce ones opinions is an old trick and one that rarely works on me.

Copy and paste this if i make a thread for brady guides.


EDIT : "So some guy (who's done a couple of these previously for Portal 2 and ME3 that were really, really well done) spends hundreds of hours travelling, taking photos, prepping interviews, writing, creating videos, the file, editing, etc, etc, etc for upcoming games that he thinks are gonna be really big, and wants to get a couple bucks for the work that he did."

If you think that this is anything more than recycled material/artwork which was created during the dev process with diaolgue then maybe youre a bit naive, taking trips all over the world for this? hundreds of hours taking pics? for this material? the very one you havent seen?

Originally posted by SigmaHyperion:
For the same reason you can't go to Burger King and pick up a Soda "On the House" after you buy a burger at McDonald's.

This is made BY AN ENTIRELY SEPARATE COMPANY (or 'guy' rather, doubt it's more than just Geoff).

So some guy (who's done a couple of these previously for Portal 2 and ME3 that were really, really well done) spends hundreds of hours travelling, taking photos, prepping interviews, writing, creating videos, the file, editing, etc, etc, etc for upcoming games that he thinks are gonna be really big, and wants to get a couple bucks for the work that he did.

Does anyone complain that BradyGames is charging money for the Guide it created for the game? It's EXACTLY the same thing.

I can't gauge whether this particular one is worth the money or not (not bought it yet, was coming here to gauge opinion), but I can tell you that the ME3 and Portal 2 ones were some of the best $3 I've ever spent. Really good writing and really wonderful insights to the development process that are FAR more in-depth than the BS marketing crap that we get from internal ('free') efforts of something remotely similar, and I probably spent more time reading than the time I spend on a sizeable percentage of $60 games that end up being turds. And, to reference an earlier point, certainly worth more than any of the $20+ Guides that I've purchased.
SigmaHyperion Mar 10, 2013 @ 2:04pm 
enjoy your dlc :)

also if you were to say infinity ward was making guides than that would be something to discuss, Brady guides can not be compared w/ the likes of dlc.. YOU do NOT miss out on a FULL exp if choosing to not buy a guide and although this dlc isnt really one which would hinder an exp i just consider it a"tacky " practice due to the contents and price point for this digital material.

I'm sorry, but I'm confused.

How is not purchasing this BOOK (that's what it is, an e-book) causing you to 'miss out on the full experience'?

This is nothing more than an e-book that provides some details on the development process of the game. I fail to see how that is "DLC" or how it impacts your experience in the game.

This is a Book. A Strategy Guide is a Book. Neither impacts your ability to enjoy the game. Why is it okay for BradyGames to charge $30 for a guide, but not for Geoff Keighley to charge $3 for this?

"I myself have never bought a guide other than witcher 2 and that was more of a wanting more content to what was a great game, quality but i have gotten some guides via collectors editions but only ones that i consider reasonable for the content included."

So, for the sake of the argument, call this a "Guide" then.

You're going to get FAR more of that "content" that you were looking for in Witcher 2 in something like this, than you ever will in a Strategy Guide that's not really catered to that (though they're kinda going that way thesedays). And it's 1/10th the price to boot. This sort of thing is pure fan service to cater to those who have a fervor to gobble up everything they can about a game, a world, an iterative design process, or whatever.

"If you think that this is anything more than recycled material/artwork which was created during the dev process with diaolgue then maybe youre a bit naive, taking trips all over the world for this? hundreds of hours taking pics? for this material? the very one you havent seen?"

As I specifically said -- I cannot speak for the content of this Guide, and hence why I came in here to look for feedback, but, also as I specifically said: his earlier works offered considerably more than the usual internal efforts we see from companies who release some sort of "making of" content on their own. The vast, vast majority of the content in his Portal 2 and ME3 productions were unique; with unique content, unique interviews, and far more extensive and in-depth interviews than gaming journalism offers as a normal basis. Only the recent efforts of Polygon I would put even remotely close to the efforts that Geoff put out in those previous efforts. In fact, his ME3 piece was so in-depth that the couple times that such basic/rehashed crap appeared (like an overview of all the characters) was so jarring to the reading experience as to be immediatley noticeable.

Just his ME3 'scene simulator' alone, which let you pick different chocies you could have made throughout the series to see how a scene played out differently in ME3, was worth more than the $3 and something BioWare absolutely should have created internally for marketing purposes themselves. He brought a new level of appreciation to the effort that the developers put into the game with that one thing alone. ORIGINAL design documents, sometimes literal scribbles on napkins, allowing one to see how a game progresses in design -- something game-makers almost never let get out because people can get up-in-arms when things don't make it in the end-game. Same thing with items, characters, scenes, etc cut from a game; they often don't even make the internal "behind the scenes" productions unless they were cut in the concept phase because the entitled gamer fanbase gets all in an uproar that it was created, therefore they should get it in their game.

This guy is FAR more in-tune with what the hardcore fans are looking for than internal marketers are, and/or recognizes that his market of people who are paying for such content is, by that virtue alone, a more 'hardcore' fan than what the internal marketing efforts have to cater to, and the end products are distinctly different as a result.

Want a 6-question, Q&A-style interview, with the exact same 6 "No-Duh" questions that have been vetted out by an army of a PR team posed by every 'journalist' in a row that same day, with rehearsed answers about how awesome a game is? Want some screenshots that Marketing approved? Sure, you can find all you want online. But if you want an actual journalistic PIECE of writing thats the result of spending days tailing a lead designer to all of their meetings, talking about their career, their family, how and why they make the decisions they do; what pressures they were under, what made it and what didn't, that's thousands of words long? You want to see the original design documents? Want to read an interview with the always-neglected composers of the music; what their process is, hear pieces of the soundtrack as it progresses development? Sorry, not likely to find that on IGN. As a matter of course, you don't find a whole lot coming out of PR/Marketing that serves the HARDCORE fans on the internet; because internal-producted content costs far too much to appeal to such a niche market. Gaming Journalism is only JUST now getting to where we really have access to that level of writing as the market matures and wants that kind of info. The new site Polygon, and its Feature pieces, is the only source of information that I would find remotely comparable to these "Final Hour" productions by Geoff (and I checked, his credit section is rather extensive, so it is more than just him; there's a lot of contractors for video/photography/editing/etc).

It's like comparing a CNN Headline Blurb to an expose' by Time or the Economist. Sure -- the actual meat of the article may be pretty close to the same, but the LEVEL of the story is different. The knowledge imparted to the reader is different.

Worth it or not? Up to the person. That applies to the $60 game as much as this $3 piece. But I don't begrudge someone wanting to get paid for the work that HE did to create it. This ain't Angry Birds. He's not about to get rich off this at $3.
Unseensanity Mar 10, 2013 @ 4:06pm 
I'm sounding like that old guy here but a few years ago things like this were rewarded unlocks usualy by finding special items through exploration of the game. Most everything today is pay for DLC. IT used to be so much fun trying to find them all, now its just how padded the wallet is Whatever...
Javet90 Mar 11, 2013 @ 4:32pm 
If you mean interviews and concept art and stuff, then yea, that kind of stuff is rewarded with in game achievements. But this is not from the devs of Tomb Raider. This is from somebody completely unaffiliated with the developer, somebody who spent his own time and money to make this. The devs had NOTHING to do with the creation of this content. Thats what people seem to have issue understanding.
TequilaZaire Mar 13, 2013 @ 4:37pm 
Originally posted by Jdavet90:
This is from somebody completely unaffiliated with the developer, somebody who spent his own time and money to make this. The devs had NOTHING to do with the creation of this content. Thats what people seem to have issue understanding.

Exactly. Most, even myself at first, thought this was some odd cut content sold for $3. While I hope to see more ebooks like this in the future the marketing of them does need to be clearer.
Pixel_Pro Mar 14, 2013 @ 3:45pm 
we are a dying breed, lol.. you are correct sir and i couldnt agree more..

sheeple programmed to accept this and defend a subject for which they assume they understand inside and out..

When people put word in moth its a sign of a weak arguement, i never said that the devs designed ths so for who ever is saying that please dont put words in my mouth.. I said this was brought forth using material during and from the dev process and im not saying all of it is im saying keep piep dreaming for those who think this took hundred of hours of travel time and picture taking to make.. Brainwashed.

I have been gaming since the dawn of time and have a pretty good understand of "how it works" for many reasons and all im saying is that this should be a freebie or like this gentleman said "an unlock"..

This day and age this kind of practice is excepted, milking everything they can, milk job period.
Just like designer clothes and everthing else in this world people trademark "rent" their names, they look at product and may make a few tweeks / suggestions and then sign off to give permision to use ones name/label

Originally posted by Unseen:
I'm sounding like that old guy here but a few years ago things like this were rewarded unlocks usualy by finding special items through exploration of the game. Most everything today is pay for DLC. IT used to be so much fun trying to find them all, now its just how padded the wallet is Whatever...
KenTWOu May 3, 2013 @ 9:30pm 
Originally posted by Pixel_Pro:
this should be a freebie or like this gentleman said "an unlock"..
Unlocks and freebie don't have the same level of quality. Not by any means! That's what SigmaHyperion is talking about.
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