ShakeNBakeUK Jan 30, 2013 @ 4:17pm
I just can't get into this game no matter how hard I try
Too much stuff bugs me.
Playing on PC, with XBox controller.

First off, nVidia issues. Looks like it's gonna take ages to get a driver to fix this. Mine seems to be working ok now, I run it from a shortcut on desktop, but man after installing it it was crashing like crazy, especially when adjusting graphics options. This is a recent issue, because I bought the game ages ago and had 0 technical issues back then. Just re-installed recently to give it another crack (with gamepad).

Next up, battle rank / level up system.
The game actively encourages going back to earlier areas to complete quests / fetch components, but punishes you for doing so? The more enemies you kill, the higher your battle rank gets, the harder the enemies get. This is not a huge issue, but it means that if you grind lots early-mid game, you will be a high battle rank before opening up all union slots, and when you recruit new people, they will all be massively underpowered compared to your main group, and very difficult to level up..? It can also make boss fights very difficult, if you levelled up lots, but have weak weapons for your rank.

Next up, skill system.
I am quite far into disc one, yet still my whole party has 0 interesting skills. You start off with a single target attack. You learn another single target attack, with a slightly different attack animation. Next ability -> same. And the next. WTF? Same for every weapon class too. It's boring as hell, I would be literally falling asleep during battles, if not for the critical button presses.

Next up, party member customisation.
If you wanna upgrade your allies, you have to spend ages researching what monsters drop which components, and where to go to get them. You then spend ages grinding. And if you add someone to your party later on, WHY can't you simply GIVE them components??? It's really annoying to be forced back to an early area to farm a component for a nw party member, when you have over 9000 of them sitting in your inventory doing nothing...

Next up, main character options.
I cannot swap weapon type on my main character without gimping him. I basically have to pick something, and stick to it, otherwise it will take forever to learn and improve abilities.

Next up, AoE abilities.
Why can I not simply select an area of the battlefield to cast a spell on? Most of the time, any AoE spell I have (I only have one atm btw), misses practically everything, whilst enemy AoE abilities tend to wipe 50% hp off my entire army...

What is the point of basic soldiers? I can just stack my army full of unique leaders which are far more powerful.

Why is the skill level up system so hidden? I have no idea which weapons / weapon styles give which skills, I have no idea how many times I need to use them to rank them up.

Why does almost all the AP in battles get given to the first character? My union leaders have rank V skills, but the rest of the group has rank I-II... Must I manually move my unions around every 15mins or so, so that everyone gets to level up their skills equally?



The story is the only saving grace of this game. It seems really interesting (mainly because you have no idea WTF is going on though)...

How do you guys keep playing this game, despite all the obvious flaws?

Is the story worth putting myself through all the boring / random / luck based battles and wiki research....?

Thnx.

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Zloth Jan 30, 2013 @ 6:03pm 
NVIDIA just fixed their problems a few hours ago.

The BR thing really IS NOT AN ISSUE! Just play normally and all will be well. It's the people that decide they are going to try and abuse the system like they do with so many other JRPG games and comb back and forth through some early area to crank their level up that get burned.

The weapon skills aren't terribly interesting. The magic skills, however, do have a lot more interest. You've got your debuffs, your morale changers, your heal spells, your anti-debuffs. You've also got to balance the item-based stuff against how much cash you want to spend.

I do agree on the weapon advancement thing but... you say you're only on disk 1? I never care squat about my weapons until I get around to the six bases on disk 2. Whatever I find seems to work well enough. If one character gets behind the curve, well, that's fine, too - there are plenty of others out there to hire. (Though you're seriously exaggerating when you say it takes hours of research. The Last Remnant Wikia tells you exactly what every character needs for each item and has links so you can find out exactly what has those things. It takes more like 5 minutes.)

It does not take "forever" to teach Rush a new weapon - but didn't you just say all the weapon skills are pretty much alike? So why do you want to switch?

Not all AoE powers are the same size (or even the same shape). If a lot of your people are getting hit by them then you've probably got just a few unions with most of your people in them instead of spreading out.

Basic soldiers were, I think, a bigger deal in the XBox version. I have yet to use one and I'm on my third play through. The other folks you can hire at unions are pretty close in power to the unique leaders (though they aren't nearly as interesting).

Level up systems are typically hidden because developers want you to PLAY the game instead of gaming the game. Just play the thing and your skills should advance nicely.

The union leader does seem to get first dibs on the AP pool but they certainly do not get exlusive rights to it! Have you actually been watching what skills will get used when a command is going to get used so you can see who's going to do what? Personally, I only switch my unions around once every 5 to 10 hours of game time.

The game does have a random element to it, though. Some characters will advance faster than others. Or maybe the character you think will be a mage ends up having better weapon skills. You've have to be willing to work with what you're dealt in this game.

The story in the first half is actually kinda blah, IMHO. The mystery of the Conqueror is interesting but it's pulled down by Rush's complete idiocy. Rush gets a lot more sane in the second half so the politics and the Conqueror can shine.

P.S. Thank goodness, a sane criticism of the game!
ShakeNBakeUK Jan 30, 2013 @ 6:16pm 
I think in the xbox version, you could only have a limited amount of leaders, which would make sense. In the PC version, there is 0 need to recruit basic soldiers, everyone I use is from guilds and most of them are unique leaders.

I wanna switch weapon because I am bored of using the same one with the same boring attack animations, but you're right there's practically no point, the attack animations for all combat abilities are just as boring, no matter what weapon type / wield type you use, so might as well just stick to one and max it out. ZZZzzz

I just really hate the idea of hidden stats in RPG games. Maybe is is due to years of gaming in MMORPG PC games. Console games just seem so shallow in comparison. I had the exact same problem with Final Fantasy XIII - no idea what components you are supposed to use on what weapon / character. Had to look up a huge spreadsheet online, instead of having the info there in the game. Gets really annoying having to alt tab loads.

In Last Remnant, if you wanna look up a list of components for your whole army's upgrades, list all the monsters that spawn that component, and all the areas those monsters spawn in, you end up with like an A4 page of info :S

btw I am like BR 40+ at the Heroic Ramparts, is that like way too high or about right..?
Last edited by ShakeNBakeUK; Jan 30, 2013 @ 6:18pm
Zloth Jan 31, 2013 @ 7:27am 
Hehe, the same exact thing put me off from FF 13. I ended up with tons of components but I was afraid to use them so I would just avoid using them at all until the monsters started pulverizing me. And my XBox is downstairs (in a room where the only chair is the exercixe machine ;) so looking stuff up is a major pain.

This game DEFINITELY has issues with hiding things. At the end of my first play-through I still had no idea what classes were. The formations are really neat but the super-short description just isn't enough information at all. And do they really expect people to remember where they mined superior cotten!? It's not a good sign when your game requires a Wikia page.

That said, though, I was able to get through the game just fine even when I knew so little about the systems. I wasn't able to do some of the special DLC challenges but I made it through the basic game (even Nora's quest) just fine. I didn't think about classes, I only went by the short descriptions of the formations, and I only did a bit of component hunting toward the end of the game. This game has a lot of depth but that depth IS optional. The only time you really need to know it is when you're up against the super-nasty DLC content like the Fallen/Demigod/Lost or the Enlightened Seven.

You definitely don't need to look up ALL the components needed. The developers paced the game fairly well so some of your characters will work out naturally. (Plus the can sometimes buy their own components!) If somebody seems to be falling behind and that somebody is a character you really want to keep, then go look up on the Wikia to see where you can find the thing they are missing.

BR40 isn't too high, IMHO. It's hard to tell for sure because a ton of quests open up at that point and I've got no idea what quests you've done and what quests you plan to do. If you've been sticking to just the story missions so far but plan to do all the quests you possibly can later on, then you're pretty high. If you've been doing quests as they open up or if you don't really want to do many side quests then you're doing just fine.

Remember the big worry about getting your BR too high is that the new people you recruit will be terribly whimpy compared to your party. You recruit new people all the time so it isn't hard to see this coming. For instance, if you recruit ♥♥♥♥♥♥ and find his spells are doing way less damage than Emma's spells, then you've got a problem.
SinisterSlay Jan 31, 2013 @ 7:43am 
Also bosses don't scale with BR.
Nor do the rare creatures. Only regular enemies scale. And only barely.
Zloth Jan 31, 2013 @ 2:59pm 
Yeah, bosses scale. Depending on your BR, they attack with different levels of powers. The rares scale their hit points by BR, too.
SinisterSlay Feb 1, 2013 @ 7:07am 
I have 1 hit killed rares. If they scale, its super minimal.
Bosses cap out, they never get more powerful, they just use better attacks. But most are scripted specially and always use the same attacks.
Zloth Feb 1, 2013 @ 7:43am 
The same TYPE of attacks but not the same level. Hell's Gate will use higher level Grenade Impact on higher BR parties. There are limits to the scaling on both sides of the scale, though. The Wikia says Hell's Gate's Grenade Impact scaling stops at BR50, for instance.

The final battle scales more than anything else. That scales on your BR and on what quests you have/haven't done.

I don't think the DLC battles scale at all. Also, if you're playing in hard mode, the hit point scaling seems to vanish.
Last edited by Zloth; Feb 1, 2013 @ 7:45am
SinisterSlay Feb 1, 2013 @ 11:01am 
Originally posted by Zloth:
The same TYPE of attacks but not the same level. Hell's Gate will use higher level Grenade Impact on higher BR parties. There are limits to the scaling on both sides of the scale, though. The Wikia says Hell's Gate's Grenade Impact scaling stops at BR50, for instance.

The final battle scales more than anything else. That scales on your BR and on what quests you have/haven't done.

I don't think the DLC battles scale at all. Also, if you're playing in hard mode, the hit point scaling seems to vanish.

Yes that I can agree with :).

The scaling on the final battle makes it more fun. The big problem with JRPG's is they are often too easy to win the boss battles. In that way I like the BR system. It means if you play casually and only follow the story, you will have a low BR and easier fights, if you are hardcore, you get tougher fights.
Zloth Feb 3, 2013 @ 1:29pm 
You know, I think most games are making the final boss battles a bit on the easy side now. I just finished Borderlands 2 and it's final battle, while plenty epic, was certainly not the hardest one to win. Maybe the game companies want to end on a high note instead of a frustrating one?
SinisterSlay Feb 4, 2013 @ 5:59am 
Originally posted by Zloth:
You know, I think most games are making the final boss battles a bit on the easy side now. I just finished Borderlands 2 and it's final battle, while plenty epic, was certainly not the hardest one to win. Maybe the game companies want to end on a high note instead of a frustrating one?
Maybe they should start asking just befor ethe fight, what sort of challenge we want.
Sol Katti Feb 10, 2013 @ 12:04pm 
Originally posted by SinisterSlay:
Originally posted by Zloth:
You know, I think most games are making the final boss battles a bit on the easy side now. I just finished Borderlands 2 and it's final battle, while plenty epic, was certainly not the hardest one to win. Maybe the game companies want to end on a high note instead of a frustrating one?
Maybe they should start asking just befor ethe fight, what sort of challenge we want.
Lol word. I mean I know I'm going far back but FFX, you just throw a Phoenix Down and BOOM, dead. And FFX-2, you break apart this HUMONGOUS weapon just to face some dude who does mediocre damage to your party, well at least to mine.

But all in all I do like how they made this game. I mean I wish they were the same for both versions, I have the Xbox version btw. Yeah the story is a little confusing but, hey, there have been worse
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Date Posted: Jan 30, 2013 @ 4:17pm
Posts: 11