FLY'N > General Discussions > Topic Details
javajoe Mar 22, 2014 @ 6:43am
What % finish this game?
Looking at the achievment statistics, it looks like over 90% of the people that bought this game did not even get to the last world. Since the last world is 20% of the content (5 characters total?) this boggles my mind. The developers could have left the last world out and most customers would never notice. Or am I reading this wrong? Is this unusual? Is this due to the difficulty of the game? Does it even make sense for a developer to spend 20% of their time on the last level that only 5% of their customer will ever even see?
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Merriann Mar 22, 2014 @ 6:49am 
This is making me really sad as well. Though I don't think nobody would notice if they left the last world out, since I don't think the ending would work as well then. But if nobody would.... That's also really sad. Anyway, that's kinda unusual. Some people just play a game for 5 minutes and then forget about it or just play the other games instead all the time. Or maybe it is the difficulty for some. And no, it doesn't make sense at all.
TheGlecter Mar 22, 2014 @ 9:01am 
I didn't like the first world of FLY'N (in fact, the demo made me stop buying until the sale :P). It's the last 2 worlds that turned it into an awesome game IMO... so yeah, I think it was worth the effort no matter how many people has played them!

There may be some players that stop playing midway through due to the difficulty or whatever, but the low stats are probably because of all that people who buys games on sales/bundles and never really get into playing them...

If you look at the completion stats of most games, they usually are ridiculously low. For example, the stats say only 0.1% of players finished Monaco, which is a game with a pretty good fanbase and over 1000 maps in the Workshop despite of that... ;)
The 5th world is epic, and the last level is hard as heck. Some other platformers are far more punishing than this, so I'm not sure why people would abandon it during their first playthrough of the game.
Kargor May 15, 2014 @ 12:28pm 
Originally posted by Zhuinden:
The 5th world is epic, and the last level is hard as heck. Some other platformers are far more punishing than this, so I'm not sure why people would abandon it during their first playthrough of the game.

I can see why they would.

Just watched the beginning of TotalBiscuits WTF due to the Humble weekly, and I must say -- ok, scrap the lack of explanations inside the game, that's something to get used to eventually. But he seems to have problems even in the early levels since it expects very accurate jumps and has an annoying death timer that keeps killing him over and over again.

So yeah, it might look pretty, but it doesn't seem to be fun.
Last edited by Kargor; May 15, 2014 @ 12:28pm
Cyril May 15, 2014 @ 1:29pm 
Totalbiscuit's opinion on any kind of 2D platformer should always be entirely discredited because he hates them and is horrible at them, without fail. The game isn't that hard. It's not easy either, but it's entirely fair about its difficulty, safe for like... two spots in the entire game.
Cyril May 15, 2014 @ 1:34pm 
Going back and finding the specific video. I remember now. This is the one where he pretends to not have any intelligence at all for 20 minutes and blames the game for him being wholly unable to comprehend basic mechanics. Basically one of the worst videos he's ever put up. Don't dare judge the game by it. It should be *obvious* that he's entirely incompetent throughout the video.
javajoe May 15, 2014 @ 6:49pm 
This game requires quick reflexes. Especially the time chase levels, although you can turn off the time limit. It also requires patience to train yourself to hit the right sequence of buttons with the right timing. I don't have quick reflexes, and I am on the wrong side of 40, so this game was extra tough for me. Still, it is super fun! I made it about halfway through the "black bouncy ball" level before I gave up. I still got my money's worth.
Kargor May 17, 2014 @ 3:29am 
Originally posted by j.p.osborne4:
I made it about halfway through the "black bouncy ball" level before I gave up

In other words: you did not finish the game because it was too difficult. At least I'm assuming that you have to complete all levels to complete the game :-)

For myself, I cannot (usually) consider a game to be "good" if I didn't even finish it, for whatever reason. There may be a difference between "the game bored me to death" or "the game killed me to death", but neither of these are anything I consider positive aspects of a game.

On the other hand, Steam doesn't have "completion stats", unfortunately. What they call "completion" is getting 100% of the achievements, which for most games is far more than just completing the game. It usually includes crazy button mashing like "Finish the game in ultra-super-hard-godly difficulty in less than 10 seconds with your monitor turned off." or super-grindy achievements like "kill 100000000 enemies with a toy-dagger".

Achievements should really get some properties to categorize them, like "game end", "collectibles", "score" etc. I don't think there are THAT many achievement cheaters to not make this useful for stats. But, such is not the case, and Steam isn't exactly known to add their own logic outside of the games.
TheGlecter May 17, 2014 @ 3:58am 
Steam doesn't have "completion stats", unfortunately
The game has an achievement for finishing the last world. If you look at the world stats for that achievement, you can know the % of people who finished the game.
The 100% completion achievement is considerably lower than that one btw.

The game may be rather difficult sometimes, but I think it's far from being boring and punishing. Apart from a couple annoying bonus levels, there are plenty of checkpoints, and you don't have to grab the collectibles every time you respawn.

I stopped played the game once because I got sucked into other games, but that doesn't have anything to do with the difficulty. It's just that I didn't find it truly addictive until world 4 or so...
Last edited by TheGlecter; May 17, 2014 @ 4:00am
Turnba Jun 11, 2014 @ 2:16pm 
I really loved playing this game, but it got so difficult for me that I decided to leave it be. Maybe I'll go back to it at some point. In terms of getting my money's worth, well, I think I paid £5 for it and played 26 hours, according to Steam. That's pretty good value! And a beautiful game too.
javajoe Jun 12, 2014 @ 6:17pm 
Just for grins, I compared Fly'N completion stats to the completion stats for some of my favorite games. As expected, the completion stats for Fly'N are WAY lower than for other games:
Bastion: 13.6%
Trine: 22%
Trine 2: 16.1%
Portal 2: 43%
Portal: 46.5%
Limbo: 30.9%
Braid: 22.9%
Fly'N Electricleaner:4.5%
Fly'N Tribin cleaner:3.6%

What is amazing is that >95% of players never made it to the last world. This does not seem to be typical at all for other games. I think the developers made it too hard to progress to the end.
Adelion Jun 12, 2014 @ 11:50pm 
I don't know. You can die as often as you wish, the speed levels have an integrated easy mode after enough deaths and the checkpoints are often and reasonable. The only level I found extremely hard is the final boss battle where I easily got the "Die 50 times in one level" achievement. Okay I still helped a little bit.
It may be the boss battles before that are to hard because the level desgin is great although some of the later levels are gigantiv so you may loose focus on what to do actually.

But all in al I just think those people hate fun. It is the most realistic explanation.
Merriann Jun 13, 2014 @ 2:42am 
Yeah, I think the difficulty is reasonable too... The levels that WERE, in fact, really hard(such as the final boss) were still pretty fun to me. Not to mention that great sense of accomplishement! There's really only a few actually frustrating levels, but that's mostly because of me trying to 100% them. Like that one with the rising platform in the 2nd tree, ugh... It was 2-6, I think? Maybe? Y'know, with the white wolf-like creature. Whatever. There's few things to actually frustrate me in the game.
Also, 22.9% completed Braid? I'd complete FLY'N anytime instead of those puzzles...
javajoe Jun 13, 2014 @ 4:49am 
@Merriann I think you make a good point. Fly'N is very hard without being frustrating, since the art and level design are very good. It is a credit to the developers that players like myself and Turnba still enjoy the game even though we couldn't finish it. I still think the developers should have recalibrated the difficulty, if only 3% of your customers complete the game, the game is too hard. Of course the 3% will post a lot on forums ;-)
TheGlecter Jun 13, 2014 @ 5:10am 
Super Meat Boy (100%): 2.2%
Do you think that Meat boy should have been made easier? :P Let the indies bring a challenge to those who are looking for it... There are plenty of Marios already... ;)
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