Mistic Sep 18, 2012 @ 3:30am
*Hyun-ae or *Mute?
After finding out the generation ship's secrets, which AI do you like the most? Which one do you tend to agree with? Which one would you save? I know it's a tricky question, because there are also the options "both of them" and "neither of them", but I think it's a good point of discussion.

In fact, I'm surprised nobody has posted this before. Is this forum new? I had never visited the Steam forums before I played this game.
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Prospero Sep 18, 2012 @ 1:10pm 
Personally, I find *Mute just slightly more interesting. I like her attitude the best, but I hope in Hate Plus she'll change it to be less misogynistc while we also find out what caused her to become like this.

That's not to say I don't like *Hyun-ae too, though. ^__^

And I think it's just not generally used for discussion. Not many Game Hubs are, it seems.
Mistic Sep 19, 2012 @ 3:06am 
I'm still not very conviced about these Game Hubs, but don't mind me.

I like both of them a lot. They're both funny in their own ways, and they're true three-dimensional characters, with their good parts and their bad parts.

*Hyun-ae's story was heartbreaking, a horrible tragedy, and it was moving to see her struggling with her past. If you play your cards right, she even admits that it was wrong to kill all people in the ship. However, she also lies and there's a good deal of hypocrisy in her actions when she wants you to ignore *Mute's existence or at least her words, despite her never having wronged her personally. It does ring some nasty bells, doesn't it?

At first, I hated *Mute's misogyny, but then I realized that she was not only a product of that terrible culture, but a victim too, because she had to be mind wiped for the scenario to work. Also, in a game that it's about hate, trust and communication, *Mute never lies to you and is the only willing to listen to the one she hates. The harem ending is only possible because of her. Even during the normal routes *Mute tells you not to take her word for granted and to ask her rival yourself.

The harem ending is my favourite because it gives you the power to end the hate story. If I only get to make a sadistic choice (I seriously hope you can pass the harem ending to Hate Plus), I'd choose *Mute.
[HGS]Augardente Guerreiro Sep 19, 2012 @ 8:30am 
As an individual, I prefer *Mute. I feel like *Mute is a good person who holds horrible opinions, whereas while *Hyun-ae holds much more laudable opinions, she's not a particularly nice person in herself. That tension is one of the things which makes Analogue so great.

Ultimately though I like them both, and cared about both of them. I wasn't romantically interested in either of them, but I didn't want to just leave them to rot on the Mugunghwa, so even when I didn't go for the harem ending, I still often copied the inactive AI to the active AI's core with the idea that my character might be able to restore them both at some point down the line.
Mistic Sep 20, 2012 @ 5:12am 
Originally posted by HGSlimegonk:
As an individual, I prefer *Mute. I feel like *Mute is a good person who holds horrible opinions, whereas while *Hyun-ae holds much more laudable opinions, she's not a particularly nice person in herself. That tension is one of the things which makes Analogue so great.

I didn't think about that. It makes a good paradox. But would you really call *Mute a good person and *Hyun-ae a not-particularly-nice person?
Fimbulvetr Nocturnal Sep 20, 2012 @ 3:21pm 
Personally, I liked *Hyun-ae the best. It's quite strange really- in some games I prefer the quiet, shy girls, while in others I prfer the brash, outspoken ones. Anyway, in this game I just felt like she would be the one I would want more as a wife, rather than *Mute. I sympathized the most with her at the end- I mean seriously, that is a horrible thing to go through at such a tender age. Plus, *Hyun-ae loves sex and dressing up, so as a man, that's a plus for me! :)
Mistic Sep 21, 2012 @ 5:32am 
The dressing up of *Hyun-ae was very funny, indeed. What I liked the most about it was that it gave us nice insight into Hyun-ae's character. That she would have loved to dress up as a maid by her own will but hated the hanbok because it was forced on her, or that she wanted to follow in her father's footsteps and become a scientist. It's the magic of this game: even fanservice is meaningful.
arahman56 Sep 21, 2012 @ 2:47pm 
After going through the game (unlocked Harm Ending), it does feel like *Mute didn't really have access to all the information- especially not the Pale Bride's diary. I wonder how *Mute would have reacted if she knew it then. Something tells me she would have had her own kind of punishment to dish out- and it may or may not have been more pleasant than Hyun-ae's.

EDIT: So Hyun-ae's husband was *Mute's master- no wonder she didn't have complete knowledge of what's going on.
Last edited by arahman56; Sep 21, 2012 @ 6:11pm
Mistic Sep 22, 2012 @ 5:32am 
As *Hyun-ae said, a good deal of her backstory was encrypted by the Kim family so no one could find out the truth. Not because they thought they did wrong, but because they were afraid of losing face in the imperial court. The Smith family also encrypted some of their less than exemplary moments.

When *Mute (in the Harem ending) realizes what happened to Hyun-ae, she feels bad because the girl couldn't ask for help. That means that, if Hyun-ae could have asked *Mute, the AI would have helped, probably ruining the Kim family forever. But Hyun-ae couldn't ask and even if she could it was obvious that she distrusted *Mute and the AI never cared because she thought the Pale Bride didn't speak because she was the perfectly demure wife. Maybe the Emperor's first wife could have solved the puzzle, but she died.
[HGS]Augardente Guerreiro Sep 24, 2012 @ 5:21pm 
Originally posted by Mistic:
But would you really call *Mute a good person and *Hyun-ae a not-particularly-nice person?

Well... not in absolutes, but relative to each other, I'd say *Mute is closer to my idea of a 'good' person. Of course it's hard to view *Hyun-ae properly, given the awful circumstances in which she found herself, but she strikes me as being inherently a bit of a selfish brat who wants people to empathise with her but isn't too bothered about empathising back (before anyone thinks I'm endorsing the regressed culture, that's based as much on her interactions with the player, and the brief snippets she shows of her pre-cryo life). *Mute seems much more accepting, bizarrely. If the player isn't what she expects she goes "okay, I can deal with this" whereas *Hyun-ae throws a hissy fit whenever the player disagrees with her. Unlike *Hyun-ae, *Mute can get past her hatred of her counterpart to encourage the player to hear both sides, and in the harem ending, is willing to open dialogue with *Hyun-ae. *Mute seems to be more aware of her own failings, too. I definitely see *Mute as someone who's good-hearted (or good-CPU'd, whatevs) by nature, but is corrupted by the society in which she lives. *Hyun-ae... okay, I know she's a teenager, and thus prone to being stroppy, so I'm probably being unfair to her. And I certainly don't dislike her. I just felt, on occasion, that I'd like to shake her by the shoulders and tell her to have a bit more awareness of the world beyond the inside of her own head.
Mistic Sep 26, 2012 @ 9:20am 
Mm, those are very good points. Now that I think about it, *Mute was the first to ask you about yourself. However, I can understand Hyun-ae: she was a teenager forced to live in Misogyny Land, tortured, and that was going to die soon but nobody cared. Not the best conditions to make oneself more open and understanding.

About the two AI's (and more things), I found this interview:
http://www.vnsnow.com/christinelove.htm

Christine Love talking about *Hyun-ae:
"There were a few details missing, but for the most part, I had a pretty good idea of how *Hyun-ae would turn out from the start. It was pretty obvious that the Pale Bride was going to be as horrified by that society as anyone else would, and that it would break her. She never really changed much."

She also says that Hyun-ae was her perspective, "the modern girl who can't understand what's going on". However, it seems that *Mute was the more surprising one:

"I knew that she had to be opposed to *Hyun-ae, that she was the real security AI on the Mugunghwa, and that she'd be conventionally attractive for her era; past that, I had nothing. As her cheerful misogyny began to emerge, I started to hate her, especially with every line I wrote that had a deferential version for a man playing, but a demeaning version for a woman playing. Then she started to grow on me; it was never really her fault she was like that, it was just her way of surviving, I realized. There were no huge surprises from either, no giant twists, but I definitely never anticipated feeling so much sympathy for *Mute."
Deathmaw Oct 1, 2012 @ 10:49am 
*Hyun-ae all the way.
I completely agree with what she did. I don't feel that what she did was unwaranted in any way after what she suffered through.
Mistic Oct 5, 2012 @ 2:01am 
Originally posted by Deathmaw:
*Hyun-ae all the way.
I completely agree with what she did. I don't feel that what she did was unwaranted in any way after what she suffered through.

Well, I understand why she did it, but genocide is still a bit off-putting, to say the least.

But there's something else that has been bugging me: that *Hyun-ae isn't really Hyun-ae, but a copy of *Mute's source code with Hyun-ae's memories. That means she couldn't be made responsible for Hyun-ae's actions.
[HGS]Augardente Guerreiro Oct 6, 2012 @ 1:37am 
Interesting interview, Mistic, thanks for the link :)

I'd wondered about that myself, the fact that *Hyun-ae isn't Hyun-ae, and as such, is she actually culpable for Hyun-ae's crime? That would be a follow-up which I'd like to see - the player gets *Hyun-ae back to Earth where it's decided she should stand trial, with the enusing moral greyness about whether or not she's actually the perpetrator, while on a personal level, also exploring to what degree *Hyun-ae ought to feel remorse about her previous incarnation's actions. Bring in the transhumanism aspect - does it matter what form a person takes, if they have the same memories? Does that make them still the same person even if the original mind has died?

...unless she's a good actor who knows people will think she SHOULD feel remorse! There's another way of reading it - *Hyun-ae remains an amoral lunatic who's been playing the investigator all along, simply as a means of getting off the ship.
Mistic Oct 6, 2012 @ 8:38am 
Originally posted by HGSlimegonk:
Interesting interview, Mistic, thanks for the link :)

You're welcome :)

Yeah, it's an interesting matter. I would have loved if the game had explored the transhumanism issues, but I understand Analogue wasn't about that.

It's a pity you can never point out to *Hyun-ae that she isn't the real Hyun-ae, despite her using the first person when talking about the Pale Bride. If we switched to a biological standpoint, she would be a clone of *Mute with Hyun-ae's memories. That opens so many dramatic possibilities... And of course, now that you've mentioned it, there's always the "*Hyun-ae is secretly evil" way of reading the story. I don't think that's the case, and although I can understand the appeal of that plot twist, I think it would cheapen Hyun-ae's tragedy.

I liked that in Analogue the AI's weren't psychos who plotted against the weak meatbags (it's so easy to find evil AI's in fiction). Humans were the real monsters. It was paradoxical: *Mute never rebelled, but that means she helped to keep that horrible going; on the other hand, Hyun-ae killed all people on board, but she did it while still being a human, not as an AI.
Thehambugalar Oct 7, 2012 @ 8:26pm 
*Mute.

I can understand with what Hyun-ae went through. I can't condone the taking of that many (more or less) innocent lives. *Hyun-ae may be a data clone but as far as she is concerned she is the real Hyun-ae same thoughts, feelings, and memories, why should we see her any differently? It's like cloning Hitler's brain (I'm sure there is a better compairoson out there, but I'm tired. :p) wouldn't you hold it responcible in his place?

*Mute can be changed, you even see signs of it during your interactions with her. She is more or less a modern conservative woman, her views are dated but not completley archaic. She most likely didn't want what happened to the colony to happen, remember she didn't have complete control of the ship the captin could override her anytime he (assuming it was a he) wanted.
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