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Waypoint Mar 3, 2013 @ 7:55pm
Is there a trick to Kishgal?
I'm fighting him on Nightmare. The version you fight as Hugo is kinda wimpy, but Yunica and Spoiler Third Guy (and presumably Adol in time attack, which I don't even want to imagine because this is nasty enough with a good fire attack and his blows) both fight this ridiculous beast with a billion HP that randomly hits you with undodgeable stuff (Yunica has no way to dodge icicles + bullets, Spoiler has no way to get away safely if he whirlwinds).

I mean I could overlevel a bit and take him in a sloppy shoving match like pretty much all the videos I can find of the fight -- I can occasionally bring him to 1/4 health at correct level -- but that still leaves me hosed on Boss Rush.
Last edited by Waypoint; Mar 3, 2013 @ 8:31pm
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SureShot Mar 3, 2013 @ 9:47pm 
This is from Yunica's perspective since I just finished boss rush nightmare with her.

Other than Dalles last form, he's the only boss I'm not sure I'll ever master fighting against because of his health + a lot of factors easily causing you to be whittled down. Like I believe you said, if he casts his bullets from the sky and they land right as he's casting the 5 sets of bullets, it's almost impossible to dodge. The ice dragons are a pain as well.

I personally believe he has way too much health. There's no 'trick' to him that I know of, but just a long drawn out grind of using charged fire and avoiding damage as best as you can.
________ Mar 5, 2013 @ 7:41am 
Fire magic. Running away.

Every attack is dodgable.
Waypoint Mar 5, 2013 @ 12:22pm 
Yunica comes down to blind luck dodging falling icicles + bullets -- even with perfect timing and using whirlwind to compensate for having to jump, it depends entirely on the random stagger of falling icicles.

Third character moves fast enough that every attack is dodgeable...if you're already at range. But he has no ranged attack, and closing to range risks getting caught in a whirlwind on the way out that moves exactly as fast as you do and outlasts the guard on your fire attack, and good luck green-dashing away in a field full of clutter.

I know he's possible at level because I've done it with both of them, but it usually involved a couple hours of beating my head against him until he decided to cheese me less, coming right down to the wire, and few if any of the places I took damage being due to an obvious error on my part.

I guess I'm just asking if I'm missing something egregious. Usually I can look at a video and find some kind of apparent trick they used to get around whatever I was having trouble with, but every single Kishgal video I've seen (on Nightmare anyway, the others aren't that bad) comes down to either "be massively overleveled and pray" or "blitz him with Adol because he has good enough stats to survive that with fortunate winds".
Last edited by Waypoint; Mar 5, 2013 @ 1:55pm
SureShot Mar 6, 2013 @ 9:26pm 
Here's a decent video:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QayS_VAiktw

The Yunica is level 50 and despite a few mistakes, was barely able to pull off the fight. The only thing I recommend NOT to do is initiate with Burst until AFTER he uses his ultimate. As you can tell, she gets countered by it if he hasn't used it in awhile.

There's no secret to beating him; just running away, using charged fire as much as you can, and minimizing damage. It's just annoying because it's a very lengthy fight and you have to really master avoiding some of his attacks.
Last edited by SureShot; Mar 6, 2013 @ 9:27pm
Waypoint Mar 6, 2013 @ 9:42pm 
Yeah I figured out the hard way a few weeks ago that he looks for your Burst to mess with you and drop an iceberg on your head as you come out of it. I'll boost a few times for damage bonus, but I'll only Burst on ice dragons before he hits 50%, and on the first dragon after his iceberg. If I'm lucky, I can sometimes save it for right when he initiates the iceberg, then run up and plant my Burst in his face before it lands so he stands still and eats the whole thing while I point and laugh -- even at half damage it's usually way more than I'll get otherwise because he doesn't just jump out of it.

The third character is actually quick enough that he can usually get away with Bursting early and still escape the iceberg. The problem is the attack has a huge blind spot directly in front of you, so Kishgal just walks up in your face to avoid most of the damage, plants an icicle under your feet, and then starts shooting right as you come out of it. So you're usually better off not Bursting at all except to null dragons, and just use the boost for more hits on two fire attacks.
Last edited by Waypoint; Mar 6, 2013 @ 9:47pm
SureShot Mar 8, 2013 @ 11:20pm 
Well, I'm on spoiler third guy finally versus Kishgal on nightmare. Dare I say it's much more difficult than Yunica's. You have to be perfect with your fire attacks or you just get absolutely demolished by his whirlwind. Talk about a pain in the butt. He probably has the smallest openings out of all the bosses in the game. I'm currently level 41, and I'm trying not to use burst at all for the achievement, but that might be a big mistake.
Last edited by SureShot; Mar 8, 2013 @ 11:21pm
Waypoint Mar 9, 2013 @ 12:33am 
Yeah, REALLY don't do that achievement on Nightmare. Even if Burst isn't that good against him, Zava, or Dalles, it's still good to null the occasional dragon, and it's darn sweet against the main boss of the area and a good amount of the Demonic Core trash monsters that hit you hard enough to want to clear half the room in seconds. The good news is that version of Kishgal is 43, so you can afford to take another couple levels without feeling like it's cheating.

The main strategy I used was to bait him into swinging right as I used a charged fire. It blocks his hit, lands a good ~180 damage, and gives you time to glide away from the next one and clear the field a bit to boot. You still risk getting caught in a whirlwind, but...well, you risk that anytime you get close ever and there's not really a good window to safely avoid that while keeping any reasonable pressure on him.

I found it somewhat easier than with Yunica, because he puts out more damage on the whole and ends the fight faster, the higher speed helps with dragons, and being able to fire spin as you run makes it trivial to dodge the iceberg -- you don't even have to jump over the icicles on the side, you just go through 'em as they spawn. Still a PITA though.

Take heart. This character makes most of the remaining bosses really easy. He turns Zava and Dalles into a joke. Very last guy is kind of nasty though, but there's not really any point of reference because nobody else fights him. Also yes, that means don't Burst on Dalles for the achievement.
Last edited by Waypoint; Mar 9, 2013 @ 12:40am
SureShot Mar 9, 2013 @ 12:54am 
Yeah, it took me a little while but I beat him. I did have to level to 43 like you said. I was initially really worried I was overleveling (especially since I plan on doing time attack nightmare after), but it's good to know he's also that level. It did feel more 'fair' (fair vs kishgal is still laugh inducing).

You get really good at dodging his dragons and ultimate the more you play. The entire fight seemed to be about baiting out his attacks and using fire immediately as he starts his animation (and knowing when to keep fire charge to block attacks). His whirlwind was ironically a guaranteed counter by you if he whiffs it. He definitely has consistently timed dragons and ultimates at around 25% life.

In hindsight, this took me FAR less time than Yunica's fight versus him, so I would probably agree he's easier. Granted, you also gain a bunch of play experience versus him during Yunica's playthrough.
Last edited by SureShot; Mar 9, 2013 @ 12:55am
Waypoint Mar 9, 2013 @ 2:26am 
Yeah I did a Normal run first, for achievements, to fill out boss entries in the bestiary, and to scope out problem areas. I don't really bother fighting a Nightmare boss below level when I already know what level they all are.
Last edited by Waypoint; Mar 9, 2013 @ 2:30am
SureShot Mar 9, 2013 @ 9:51am 
Where do you find out their levels by the way?
Waypoint Mar 9, 2013 @ 12:42pm 
Bestiary. That's one of the reasons I went through it on Normal first once I figured out that one or two levels on Nightmare impacted damage numbers by almost half.
Gwonam Jul 18, 2013 @ 6:26pm 
on yunica, wait until he is in a corner and than position yourself infront of him, activate her burst ability, he will be trapped in the corner and be forced to eat the full duration of the attack.

this is very hard to do and requies you to pay attention to his positioning and have good timing but you can eat 20% of his health each time you do this.

Use wind as your main attack, charge up and flank him. wind is good because it allows you to stay mobile and avoid his attacks while hiting him at the same time. if you have quick fingers you can cycle between wind and fire and use fire when he is too far away

on toal play cautiously and dont take risks when your shield isnt up, use your burst mode's invunability to avoid his strong- full screen attacks


the boss is most vunerable to attacks directly after he has used an ability.
dont let him box you in with ice walls, destroy parts of them, or you wont be able to dodge his other attacks

jump to avoid his projectiles

run in a large circle when he summons his dragon (need ice walls down to do this) until it expires

when he is about to hit the center of the map with ice huge the edges
ladynadiad Jul 19, 2013 @ 9:46pm 
Actually a rather interesting fact is that Kishgal is also weak against the lightning based attacks. Considering the advantages the lightning based attacks can give, if you still have trouble using fire, try that instead since Yunica's Bolt Crash can help in guarding, Toal's lightning attack regains him HP, Napishtim Adol's lightning homes in on the enemy and Felghana Adol's helps with guarding as well. The only drawback is they don't melt the icicles like fire does, but once you get the hang of jumping over them that's not a huge deal.

And also while Burst doesn't do much damage against him, I find it a lifesaver to activate it when things are getting too chaotic because it prevents you from getting damage and Kishgal is too busy getting out of thw way, so it gives you a breather.
Waypoint Jul 20, 2013 @ 4:38pm 
So basically, it would become the opposite of Yunica's first match with him for the achievement. Instead of running away and Bolt Crashing him during recovery, you run into his face, bait him into swinging, and Bolt Crash to block it. Then switch to fire to clear the field where necessary.

I'll have to try that.
Last edited by Waypoint; Jul 20, 2013 @ 4:43pm
Quint the Robot Girl Feb 28, 2014 @ 5:18am 
So I guess nightmare!Kishgal really is just that much of a jerk.
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Ys Origin > General Discussions > Topic Details
Date Posted: Mar 3, 2013 @ 7:55pm
Posts: 15