Arookitakarookitakaviiekviiek! Mar 17, 2013 @ 4:03pm
M79 not doing the damage it should...
Just bought this game, so not sure of the mechanics entirely.

But the M79 isnt doing the damage it should be doing. The official tripwire wiki says it does 350 dmg per shot, but it wont 1 hit kill things like gorefests (which have 250hp).

Anyone know why this is? I have been directly hitting them, does this in some way reduce the damage? Should I instead be going for thier feet?

As an aside, how do the falloff mechanics for the explosions damage work (ie 0m 100% 1m X% and so on).

Thanks.

Bought this game to blow up mutants. Pretty good in that regard so far.
Showing 1-15 of 19 comments
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PinkiePie645 Mar 17, 2013 @ 4:20pm 
Originally posted by Fishy Fingers!:
The M79 isnt doing the damage it should be doing. The official tripwire wiki says it does 350 dmg per shot, but it wont 1 hit kill things like gorefests (which have 250hp).

Anyone know why this is? I have been directly hitting them, does this in some way reduce the damage? Should I instead be going for thier feet?
Wait directly hitting? You mean like popping a grenade infront of them? You shouldnt be doing that, aiming at the floor is better.
Yes they have resistance to explosives, a Clot/Stalker/Crawler can be insta-killed with grenades, Gorefast/Siren/Husk have more "armor" and Fleshpound and Scrake just pisses them off, i mean if it can just 1 hit kill most things, it would be broken.
Arookitakarookitakaviiekviiek! Mar 17, 2013 @ 4:33pm 
Wouldnt be broken. The ammo is expensive and you carry very little of it. You need to kill 2-3 enemies per shot just to make the ammo break even cost wise.

No, direct hitting, as in directly hitting them. If you dont understand what that means I dont know how to explain it better... Shooting it so that the grenade hits, and then explodes on the specimen itself.

I actually found out the answer myself with some looking. The enemies gain extra HP for the more players there are I was in a 5/6 person game so for gorefasts for instance ended up with 400/438hp, which makes it a 2 hit kill.
Arookitakarookitakaviiekviiek! Mar 17, 2013 @ 4:38pm 
As an aside, there are some really bizzare things done in terms of enemy damage and HP in this game.

The fleshpound for instance has X HP, then specific multipliers for things like explosives, then a flat 50% multiplier for everything else (meaning that it has 3500hp on normal if you are shooting it for instance). Why do that I wonder, why not just set its hp for 3500 and then only give weapons you want to do more damage higher bonuses..?

Some reasoning behind it I assume.
Rainbow Cactus Dildo Mar 17, 2013 @ 5:07pm 
Because: Politics



FYI be prepared to be called a noob by the established elitists if they hit you're thread.
Last edited by Rainbow Cactus Dildo; Mar 17, 2013 @ 5:08pm
Miiiiiiiiiiiiike Mar 17, 2013 @ 5:24pm 
You can one shot gorefasts in the head with an m79.
FrostyByte Mar 18, 2013 @ 4:01am 
Originally posted by Fishy Fingers!:
Wouldnt be broken. The ammo is expensive and you carry very little of it. You need to kill 2-3 enemies per shot just to make the ammo break even cost wise.

No, direct hitting, as in directly hitting them. If you dont understand what that means I dont know how to explain it better... Shooting it so that the grenade hits, and then explodes on the specimen itself.

I actually found out the answer myself with some looking. The enemies gain extra HP for the more players there are I was in a 5/6 person game so for gorefasts for instance ended up with 400/438hp, which makes it a 2 hit kill.

Sorry but it will be broken if M79 is like that, cant explain clearly how but from what i see demo man already can kill a lot of enemies with M79 grenade. Ammo count is kept at that number so people won't just spam it non-stop. You can bring other weapon to accompany M79 anyway, and yeah, demo perk is quite expensive and need some trigger discipline. >.<

Nice to see player like you, really, you want to research and find out the mechanic in a game. Gorefast(s) still will be stunned with M79 though, and thats where your team need to step in, if demo man can kill all of them, it will be everyone's favorite perk already. XD

Originally posted by Fishy Fingers!:
As an aside, there are some really bizzare things done in terms of enemy damage and HP in this game.

The fleshpound for instance has X HP, then specific multipliers for things like explosives, then a flat 50% multiplier for everything else (meaning that it has 3500hp on normal if you are shooting it for instance). Why do that I wonder, why not just set its hp for 3500 and then only give weapons you want to do more damage higher bonuses..?

Some reasoning behind it I assume.

Umm, sorry i dont quite get you but i think its already like that? I mean, all explosive weapons (M79, M4 203 nade, M32, LAW, and pipe bombs, and the default grenade) is doing damage bonuses to fleshpound(s). While to compensate his weakness to explosives, well, he needs some resistance so it will be fair (50% reduction for everything else).

Reasoning, umm, i dont know, but my guess is its the developer's way to spice the gameplay?
Arookitakarookitakaviiekviiek! Mar 19, 2013 @ 4:06am 
Originally posted by FrostyByte:
Umm, sorry i dont quite get you but i think its already like that? I mean, all explosive weapons (M79, M4 203 nade, M32, LAW, and pipe bombs, and the default grenade) is doing damage bonuses to fleshpound(s). While to compensate his weakness to explosives, well, he needs some resistance so it will be fair (50% reduction for everything else).

Reasoning, umm, i dont know, but my guess is its the developer's way to spice the gameplay?

No, what I meant was he has 2x explosive vulnerability (and other vulnerabilities) and 50% resistance to everything else.

Why not just give him 4x explosive vulnerability (and double the other weaknesses) and double his health, which achieves the exact same effect in game. Both approaches would work the same, the way they have chosen is just a bizzare "round and about" way.

As an aside, the only enemies you can kill a lot of with the M79 are clots, stalkers and crawlers, which you can kill faster and more cost effectively with the starting pistol, everything else takes 2+ shots, meaning that any other perk is more effective at killing them, and indeed some things like Fleshpounds attacking with an M79 is hurting your team.

I have since realised that you arent supposed to get the M79, but skip it for the M32.

As an aside, pipe bombs. So expensive but I love them.
kym Mar 19, 2013 @ 4:36am 
Originally posted by Fishy Fingers!:
No, what I meant was he has 2x explosive vulnerability (and other vulnerabilities) and 50% resistance to everything else.

Why not just give him 4x explosive vulnerability (and double the other weaknesses) and double his health, which achieves the exact same effect in game. Both approaches would work the same, the way they have chosen is just a bizzare "round and about" way.

Because that's actually a pretty straightforward way of showing which weapons are better used for fps and which aren't. Grenadelaunchers = perfect. Grenade/pipe bomb = good. M14/lar = not bad, worse than on other zeds. Crossbow = way worse than on other zeds. 50% on everything else should be an obvious sign for everyone else to keep their hands off him. Also double the health would boost the speed you could level your perks with fps.


Originally posted by Fishy Fingers!:
As an aside, the only enemies you can kill a lot of with the M79 are clots, stalkers and crawlers, which you can kill faster and more cost effectively with the starting pistol, everything else takes 2+ shots, meaning that any other perk is more effective at killing them, and indeed some things like Fleshpounds attacking with an M79 is hurting your team.

I have since realised that you arent supposed to get the M79, but skip it for the M32.

As an aside, pipe bombs. So expensive but I love them.

mimimi[data.motor-talk.de]
Tsundere Kanojo Mar 19, 2013 @ 5:17am 
Arc the grenades into their heads.
FrostyByte Mar 19, 2013 @ 9:19am 
Originally posted by Fishy Fingers!:
No, what I meant was he has 2x explosive vulnerability (and other vulnerabilities) and 50% resistance to everything else.

Why not just give him 4x explosive vulnerability (and double the other weaknesses) and double his health, which achieves the exact same effect in game. Both approaches would work the same, the way they have chosen is just a bizzare "round and about" way.

As an aside, the only enemies you can kill a lot of with the M79 are clots, stalkers and crawlers, which you can kill faster and more cost effectively with the starting pistol, everything else takes 2+ shots, meaning that any other perk is more effective at killing them, and indeed some things like Fleshpounds attacking with an M79 is hurting your team.

I have since realised that you arent supposed to get the M79, but skip it for the M32.

As an aside, pipe bombs. So expensive but I love them.

Okaay i'm not much into number crunching, but yeah, whats wrong with the current condition? o.o

Anyway, if the devs double the fleshie's weakness and also doubling his health, if the demo man or anyone who is tasked with taking him down die in the middle of the wave, then a fleshie appear, seems like definite wipe condition. Other perks wont stand a chance against it. Well, except if they want to kite it forever while the other dead team mates taking a nap for a while.

True, M79 can (usually) only kill a bunch of clots, stalkers, and crawlers. And its the weapon's job anyway, in later difficulties stalkers and crawlers, again crawlers, spawn in a heavy bunch sometimes, not to mention their speed bonus, to the point that you wont be able to kill them all fast enough with the starting pistol anymore. And hell, 70% of my deaths are thanks to crawlers anyway.

Also true that other perks can clear bunch of them too, take commando and support and firebug perk for example. Thats why IMO demo perk is one of the hardest perk to play, some wrong moves, and you will be seen as a bad demo man.

Mr.Fleshie vs M79 is just....a big no.

If you decide to skip straight to M32, careful in your reload timing, you dont want some fleshie coming straight to your team while you are busy reloading it. Personally i usually use M79 for smaller enemies, and pull and unload my M32 when the fleshie(s) enter the scene.

Pipe bombs are lovely! And not so expensive anymore when your perk level grows. I see them more as fail-safe device though. Also, try wearing them pipes as your hat. :D
Last edited by FrostyByte; Mar 19, 2013 @ 9:19am
DarkFalz Mar 19, 2013 @ 11:40am 
Just to clear a couple of things up. Fleshpounds only take double damage from Hand Grenades and Pipe Bombs. Against M79, M32 and M203 grenades, they take 25% extra damage and they take flat damage from the LAW. Grenade lauchers also get a damage bonus for headshots just like all other weapons so it's much smarter to aim for the head.

With regular weapons, it is 50% resistance for nearly everything except M14, LAR and blunt impact headshots. The FP has 25% resistance to those.

Originally posted by Fishy Fingers!:
I have since realised that you arent supposed to get the M79, but skip it for the M32.

What? The M79 is a really invaluable tool in later waves since it allows you keep your M32 loaded and ready without sacrificing much firepower. You never know when you might get a surprise Fleshpound or quadruple Siren spawn (especially on HoE) and always having the M32 ready to go can mean difference between surviving the wave or wiping.
FrostyByte Mar 19, 2013 @ 5:38pm 
Originally posted by DarkFalz:
Just to clear a couple of things up. Fleshpounds only take double damage from Hand Grenades and Pipe Bombs. Against M79, M32 and M203 grenades, they take 25% extra damage and they take flat damage from the LAW. Grenade lauchers also get a damage bonus for headshots just like all other weapons so it's much smarter to aim for the head.

With regular weapons, it is 50% resistance for nearly everything except M14, LAR and blunt impact headshots. The FP has 25% resistance to those.

Omg nice info, thanks for this. Just a few further questions about this,

From M79 etc they take 25% extra damage, and flat for LAW, does LAW get headshot multiplier too? Whats the headshot multipliers for nade launchers? 1.1x ?

Thanks in advance.
DarkFalz Mar 19, 2013 @ 6:05pm 
Originally posted by FrostyByte:
Omg nice info, thanks for this. Just a few further questions about this,

From M79 etc they take 25% extra damage, and flat for LAW, does LAW get headshot multiplier too? Whats the headshot multipliers for nade launchers? 1.1x ?

Well I just did some runs on testmap to get some numbers against a Fleshpound. Here are the results:

M79

Aiming at the Fleshpound's legs caused about 660 damage

Aiming for the Fleshpound's head caused about 1300 damage

LAW

Aiming for the Fleshpound's legs caused about 1500 damage

Aiming for the Fleshpound's head caused about 2900 damage

That seems pretty conclusive to me. So remember guys, like the in game tips say, aiming for the head is a good idea.
Last edited by DarkFalz; Mar 19, 2013 @ 6:06pm
Arookitakarookitakaviiekviiek! Mar 20, 2013 @ 4:02pm 
Whats this test map and how do you get specific damage numbers (I assume you have a better way then just pressing escape and checking perk level progress after each attack :D).?

Your info on fleshpound damage multipliers contradicts info on both the official KF wiki and KF-wiki.com, so I would like to get on that test map and see who is right.

The M79 is fantastic, yeah, but its better to have the 32 first then get the 79 (you will get both eventually anyway). At least as far as I can tell.

Soon enough I will spawn with the 79 so it wont really matter.
Last edited by Arookitakarookitakaviiekviiek!; Mar 20, 2013 @ 4:03pm
DarkFalz Mar 20, 2013 @ 4:10pm 
You shouldn't completely trust wikis for the sole reason that anyone can edit them so anyone can put wrong information on them. The Fleshpound multipliers I have are pulled directly from the Killing Floor SDK. There's an entire PDF file with information like that. And since it's all from the SDK, you know it's 100% correct:

http://forums.tripwireinteractive.com/showthread.php?t=45945

The testmap I'm talking about is KF-FE-Testmap_AdvancedV2. It will give you readouts of exactly how much damage you're causing with every shot in real time:

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=99193018
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Date Posted: Mar 17, 2013 @ 4:03pm
Posts: 19